to ask would you send your eldest Dc to a grammar school?

[var12]

Hypothetical question... if there were grammar schools in your area and your DC1 was offered a place, would you accept it?

Thanks var12. The 11+ has three main tests - English, Maths and reasoning (verbal and non verbal). They have to pass all three in order to pass. A child can scrape a pass on all three and get in or get really high marks on two, fail the third and so not get in. It is designed to select children in rather than identify the actual top 25%. There is also a writing task which is looked at in a head teacher appeal.

Some people have managed to secure extra time, but 25% isn't much in a 25 minute exam with 30 questions. It is multiple choice so some lucky guesses can get you in.

Unfortunately grammar schools don't like the D-word, and actively discouraged us for considering it based on that alone - 'other schools would probably be better placed to support a child with dyslexia.'

The 11+ varies from county to county from your description above I'm guessing you're in Kent.

The test which my children sat was very different- the Kent test is GL whereas Bucks is CEM - you do not have to pass each section the only thing which counts is the overall standardised score. Bucks has no writing section.

I don't think it's appropriate to make generalisations about the 11+ as it varies from county to county.

It is also wrong to say that SEND are not catered for - access arrangements can be applied for and granted in the same way as for GCSE's etc.

Having read some of this thread it seems most of the people who wants grammar schools are longing for a system they know very little about! Be careful of what you wish for (think Brexit!)

Its true, Ollycat, I really don't know much about the grammar system. Grammars were abolished (in most of the UK) before i was old enough to have heard of them. There were none in my home town when I was growing up.

I've learned a lot on this thread. I never thought grammars were a magic bullet anyway, but I can see now how the grammar system is also flawed.
If I had the choice today (which i don't), I am not sure which route i'd choose. I guess I'd need to know more about grammars.

Other posters seem convinced that they are right, and nothing will shake them into contemplating that they might not, but I don't know how they can be so sure.

If Theresa May gets this flagship policy through (and I don't, not least because she needs to save all her energies and political capital to manage Brexit), then maybe the next generation of mothers, with children like mine, will ask the question.

Yes we are in Kent and access arrangements for SEND for 11+ are very hard to get, the council are reluctant to grant extra time and at open days the head of KS3 basically said that they have no time or resources to support a girl with dyslexia and we should look elsewhere. I've heard the head express similar sentiments. It is hardly welcoming. I am pleased that it is different elsewhere and maybe a more universal approach would ensure that these standards are adopted more widely.

Yet more reason for comps not grammars.

var - something to think about might be the option for specialist - which may include selective - provision post-16, which is where it really starts to make some sense (I don't understand why people get their knickers in such a twist about GCSEs, really). Your older son, for example, would, I think love this place.... I'd seriously consider having my two commute!

Thank you, notanetter. This looks really good. I didn't know such things existed. I even found myself calculating journey times!

You are right, GCSE is not a big deal compared to everything that comes after. When I used to review CVs for new graduates / people in their first few years in their career, I would have found it very unusual if the GCSEs got a mention at all in someone's CV.

A country needs all sorts of skills and talents, it is naive to think all kids should be degree educated. So what is wrong with separating kids who are more academic at the age of 11 from the non-academic? Those who aren't good in studies can proceed to skill based learning like vocational training. Germany education is doing exactly that.

In my family I am the only one with degree, my brother who did not go to uni became self employed and he is earning BIG bucks... his biz income is at least several times more than most BSc, MSc and PhD graduates, plus the biz can pass on to his future generation!!!

Actually I welcome more grammar schools. It would be good if my children can pass the entrance test. I would expect them to apply Oxbridge if possible. It would be equally fantastic if they fail the 11+, I would encourage them to learn a skill and become self employed.

To me, the worst type of education is the exam oriented one, not the selective grammar.