AIBU to not want to work my arse off to educate my kids privately

[MoonStar07]

Basically ALL our family DH's and my are educating their kids privately. All paid by the DHs of the family who are sole earners but big earners. Think partners in top firms and consultants. We're not my husband has a good job but is mid career. I doubt by the time our first DC is 7 we can afford private school. I'm a SAHM me and DH got lucky and bought in a very good area during the last recession. We have 3 outstanding primary schools and an outstanding Secondary Acadamy. think it's 80% A-C at GCSE. Now I've been 'told' by a close family member that it's probably worth me putting both my kids in full time childcare and going back to work. Yes I earned a good whack and if I went back we could pay private school fees. Just to pay school fees. I worry my kids will miss out they literally will be the only ones NoT private school educated in our whole family. But we can't afford it unless I work and well I don't see the point we've got bloody good schools! In a bloody good area! Am I AIBU not wanting to go back to work? Should I work to pay the fees? Arghh it's sending me mad.

Actually, at a macro level (obviously there are always anomalies at a micro level) the independent system does produce higher grades, more A levels in 'facilitating' subjects, more pupils gaining places on the most selective tertiary courses.

Also, there is no argument that those who are schooled independently are over represented in industries and areas such as medicine, science, law, politics, finance, business (senior levels), media etc. In short all the industries that affect us all on a day to day level.

Couple this with what is about to happen in HE (a very clear tiered system) and we have the perfect storm

Do you mean home ed? What's happening there?

bobo whilst I agree that the extra curricular stuff is an important factor (and indeed the very broad, off syllabus, education that is offered in many independent classrooms), the raw differences are getting more pronounced.

And given the horrendous cuts to sixth form education, coupled with the changes to HE, I suspect we're going to see even more pronounced raw differences.

apple no I meant higher education. Apologies.

Ah, OK. I gather you mean that university will continue its current trajectory of less subsidisation?

apple yes.

Also, the expansion of assessment of HE 'quality' coupled with the differentiation of fees.

We're soon going to see the 'top' universities charging more than the rest. With a tiered system of costs. This will give us a very obvious pecking order. And no prizes for guessing which students will be over represented in that top tier.

My daughter in private school to facilitate her involvement in elite sport and academic success. However she firmly believes the teaching is just as good, if not better, in her previous school. The benefits of private, to her, are: small, quiet, all girls classes. Several 'frees' to get prep done etc.

DH was privately educated, I was not, but went to the kind of outstanding state school that sounds like the alternative for your children. We both did competitive degrees at prestigious universities, both got first class degrees, both did postgrads at Oxbridge. He absolutely has that extra confidence people talk about, but it hasn't materially impacted on him. He has a network, which impacted more- he thinks his school was as much of an influence as his degree in getting him his first job in the city. (As an aside, I think those networks are still much more effective for men, but that's another story)

But, here is the problem- private education supports and equips you for a particular world: if your children don't necessarily want that world, it can actually be a negative. I work in the not-for-profit sector, I love it, and I made the choice early on. DH spent years in the city because he 'could' and because of the prestige- he is re-trained, and happier, in a much worse paid area which he probably always knew he wanted to go into but it felt like a 'waste'. I don't know if it's education or temperament, but I have enjoyed a lot more of my working life than him, and have had a lot less self-doubt.

The problem with the almost hereditary expectations of education you're describing is that it's ultimately self-defeating, unless you have a particular kind of child who turns into a particular kind of adult. I have a lovely friend who works in the city with the plan of retiring at 50 once the school fees are paid and then doing the job he really wants, the job he has always really wanted. That job, btw, has a pay scale of 40-70k, so it's not like his plan is to be a starving artist. I remember being 22 and talking to him, way before kids were on the horizon for either of us, and him saying how he would love to work in X but it would never enable him to send his children to private school and he felt it would be unfair to deny them the chances he got. That kills me: private education is supposed to give your children the opportunities to be whatever they want, but hidden in that is the expectation that whatever they want better be well paid enough to keep the cycle going.

I don't think that's a message you should send your children, and it seems by going back to work for no reason but to feed the school fee monster that is exactly the message you would be sending.

I agree, Carl, that the cuts to sixth-form funding and the increase in pupil numbers at sixth-form are indeed likely to accentuate the difference in classroom experience between state and privately educated DC, Carl. Though I am by and large in favour of very large class sizes at 15/16+ - with the proviso that the pedagogical approach is appropriate.

I was privately educated and ended up ill. So much pressure to achieve, and at my school, if you didn't want to be a lawyer, doctor or accountant, teachers weren't interested in you. I was lonely as my friends lived far away. I joined a facebook group for my old school recently, and although some did join the professions or marry well, several didn't do any better than they would have done at state school.
I wasn't in a position to send my 3 DC's to private school and wouldn't have anyway. They all went to an excellent state school, and have done just as well IMO.

Thanks. Yes my DH and all his siblings were privately educated. It's so tough because I wasn't but I do know if my parents could have afforded it they would have done. I've seen that confidence in DH and his friends. Its borders on arrogance to people like me. Although I know it's not. They know I world I know little of. Culturally too it's the prep it gives you should you decide to go into law/city as there is a way of 'being' that fits well. That won't be hard to get at the local secondary to me however network is also one to think about. Wow so much to think about. I would work for the fees. It's hard. Now I'm worried about leaving it too late to go back to work although I'm still getting approached it will stop soon I'm sure

bobo the toruble is that the cuts are not just impacting class sizes.

The reduction in contact hours and subjects on offer (non facilitating subjects attract crowds so perversley are safe, whereas further maths, MFL etc suffer), the advice available to pupils etc are all already having a terrible impact.

No, I know they don't "just" impact class size. But the endless private vs stare class size argument isn't one I am sensitive or sympathetic to.

appal of course some people get themselves locked into jobs they don't like. But that's not the preserve of the privately educated.

But then again, lots of people working in highly paid jobs do like their work. Just as lots of people in less well paid jobs hate their's.

There are some valid reasons for using the state system, of course, but that's not one of them IMVHO.

I agree that small class sizes are less important where the ability range is (relatively) small and there is minimal disruption.

The thing is you can get that network at uni. If your children want to enter that world, with the family you describe, they'll fit in regardless. If they want to enter another world, it might be harder- DH has suffered from people thinking he's arrogant, (including me when I first met him), with people thinking he's not from where we're from because of his accent which has implications when it comes to a sense of community and fitting in.

Ultimately, there's no right answer, or at least not one people will agree on, but I genuinely doubt your children will have radically different outcomes regardless of the choice you make. The biggest predictors are family and peer group: both categories in both choices sound like they value education so I wouldn't worry. I am very happy and confident in my choice not to go private, and lucky enough most people don't realise that due to equity we probably could afford it or we'd probably face some of the rude conversations you're having. Ultimately, you're the parent, and you get to decide, but don't get too caught up in the minutiae because honestly, I expect your children will thrive either way.

We took our two DC out of state Primary as the education standard was dismal. They are are in a good local prep school and have come on in leaps and bounds. DH and I both work full time to afford the fees but both agree there is no way we can afford independent Secondary school. Luckily there is an excellent state secondary locally and they should get a place there. I am happy to keep slogging for another 3 years but even if we could scrape the fees for senior school, I have no intention of running myself into the ground to achieve that and DH is completely in agreement with that.

Getahaircut, the point isn't about not liking your job: it's about feeling you have to do a certain kind of job to be seen as 'valid'. Private schools - not all, but most - do push their students into the kind of courses and careers that are seen as prestigious, and yes, a lot of high earners are happy. But a lot of the ones I know who aren't feel they were pushed on that path by other people's expectations, and the expectations they now face - to have a certain house, to send their children to a certain school - mean they don't feel able to get off it.

appal I think you're generalising, from a specific example.

You can't possibly know what all/most or even many private schools are advising!

My DC are currently in sixth form in a school that is at the top of the table and neither have been advised to do anything particular with their life (other than to give of your best).

Getahaircut, the point isn't about not liking your job: it's about feeling you have to do a certain kind of job to be seen as 'valid'. Private schools - not all, but most - do push their students into the kind of courses and careers that are seen as prestigious, and yes, a lot of high earners are happy. But a lot of the ones I know who aren't feel they were pushed on that path by other people's expectations, and the expectations they now face - to have a certain house, to send their children to a certain school - mean they don't feel able to get off it.

I'm not sure I agree with this. In my experience there's quite a lot of emphasis on History/Art/English/Latin/Greek/Classics etc in the private sector and the teachers don't feel shy about assuming that their pupils will pursue these fields as a career.

apple indeed.

Ditto MFL (which is danger of becoming the preserve of the independent sector) and of course medicine (which people go into for the love not the money).

Yep.

In fact, I'd go so far as to say I think there's probably a strong current of anti-banking bias at a lot of the top schools. This is purely anecdotal and I can't back it up, so feel free to take this with a grain of salt.

Agree with a previous poster about choosing the school that is right for the child. I moved my Dd from state to indie after a horrendous year. Now ds is joining too.
If the state options were good I would have kept her there but it seriously damaged her mentally and stifled her development . We will probably go to 11 at the indie and then try them in state again. I work in state sector so no qualms about it, it just wasn't right for our dd.

One benefit of the indie is the wrap around care which we need. State had no after school club so it meant CM which became even more distressing for her as the routines were very choppy. She has ASD.

Where I live we have an excellent state sixth form college and private schools lose their age 16plus pupils to go there. Parents rave about the standards there and can't believe its free. I'm smug as I my kids went state comprehensive all the way and had an excellent education

Are you sure they don't get students who have been asked to leavedon'ttrust.

It was one of the least palatable aspects of private education, that they shed pupils who don't do well enough.