Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Only the apps you allow.

Meet the Other Phone.
Only the apps you allow.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Why do people still think it's ok to use racist terms re gypsies?

249 replies

GingerbreadGingerbread · 19/08/2016 15:43

I am from a Romany gypsy family but a couple of generations ago. You would never have a clue if you met my parents and came to my family home as it was only on one parent's side and my mum and dad are wealthy and I am privately educated and have an academic career. However I am ashamed to say that I am nervous to tell anyone of my heritage. I am proud of my family and my gypsy grandparents who I was closer to than anyone in the world and spent the most time with whilst they were still alive. They were honest, principle led and amazing people. However I lost count of the number of occasions educated seemingly nice normal people come out with: "they are just disgusting gyppos aren't they?" Just now a colleague burst into my office saying someone had stolen his fork and they must be a "thieving pikey gyppo". Why is this seen as acceptable? It's disgusting and just makes me dislike the arrogant ignorant idiots! Are any MN willing to come forward and admit to using this language and explain why they find it acceptable?

OP posts:
yorkshapudding · 19/08/2016 16:10

I dont think bagina was saying she thinks it's OK to be racist. She seemed to be giving examples of problems that she feels may have led to racial tension between travellers and non travellers in her local area. Not the same as condoning the use of racist language at all.

UnderCrackers5 · 19/08/2016 16:12

Since when were travellers a race ?
Prejudice is wrong obviously but we mustn't sling words around with abandon

JeanGenie23 · 19/08/2016 16:14

choccy I thought that prior to meeting the family at the refuge, whilst some people do feel like that, not all do, and if you belong to a community that hold such differing views to your own, sometimes it's safer to appear to agree than not. The lady I had met had been beaten black and blue and escaped with her kids at night, they arrived at the hostel in their pjs.

QueenUrsula · 19/08/2016 16:15

I come from a family of Irish Travelers and I work in the public sector.

It's absolutely shocking how many people in my workplace think it's okay to use racist language when talking about travelers, Roma, Gypsies etc. I always challenge them and try to educate them on how wrong it is but I'm usually met with "oh I wouldn't have said it if I knew you were in the room" FFSAngry

Original poster
GingerbreadGingerbread · 19/08/2016 16:17

choccy

As you say, the travelling community is not one homogenous mass, but it's not a defence of prejudiced views to say: "well they are prejudiced too!"

OP posts:
Original poster
GingerbreadGingerbread · 19/08/2016 16:18

ArseHair

Flowers
OP posts:
QueenUrsula · 19/08/2016 16:18

UnderCracker under The Equality Act, Gypsies and Travellers are recognised as ethnic groups and are therefore protected against racial discrimination.

BoffinMum · 19/08/2016 16:20

I am quite shocked at this. If Ronnie Wood can wear his heritage proudly, it's a shame other people feel they can't. I certainly would be interested in a background like this from an academic point of view because it features in research quite prominently, but I certainly couldn't imagine a situation where I would think it had any bearing on status. It sounds like some people think there's a caste system in this country Sad

wasonthelist · 19/08/2016 16:20

Same reasons the settled community getting called Gorgers amongst some Travellers I guess. Not excusing it, but like all racism, it's not all one way.

OpenMe · 19/08/2016 16:21

I wouldn't use any of those terms. my dad grew up in a county well known for regular visits from "gypsies" and has fond memories of being welcomed into their camps to play and share food when he was a child in the 1940s. I was always taught they were honorable hardworking people.

However most people's only recent experience of this community is that they turn up,leave a tip behind them and the drain covers disappear while theyre there. I have know idea what % of travellers (I know different to Romany) are responsible but that's the bit people see. The communities don't mix like my dad's experience so "we" dont see the good bits.

ZippyNeedsFeeding · 19/08/2016 16:21

It doesn't matter (to me) if a community or racial group does have a high rate of anti-social behaviour. There could be all sorts of reasons for that and I can't control any of them. What I can do is to make a choice not to use hostile or hateful terms about or to that group. In any case, every identifiable group of people has a percentage of people who are rude, filthy (the filthiest person I know is a member of the House Of Lords),violent, thieves or any other negative character trait of your choice.

It's basic human kindness to not want to use terms which are intended to humiliate or belittle others. I've certainly had some problems with travellers in the past, but not because they were travellers, and I certainly wouldn't call them names because of it, any more than I would call a black, Jewish, Muslim person (or members of any other group) names.

I'm not saying this because I want to show how nice/politically corrrect I am either. I just don't call people names because I know better.

Original poster
GingerbreadGingerbread · 19/08/2016 16:22

Thank you Zippy your post has made me a bit tearful!

OP posts:
shovetheholly · 19/08/2016 16:22

I agree completely.

I wonder if the attitude you are witnessing (and I have witnessed many times) is due to the fact that what is on display isn't just racism, but a kind of class prejudice too. I think people don't 'see' racism as clearly when it's mixed in this way, because the latter is still viewed as more acceptable. (It isn't, but it's viewed that way).

I'm amazed at the number of times I hear the word 'chavs' from middle class people!!

Vickyyyy · 19/08/2016 16:23

I have to say I have had nothing but trouble with members of the travelling community I have came across. Expecting the whole bar to stay open all night to accomodate them (threatening to shoot my barman for saying no!), fights, one punched his child full force in the face for beating him at pool.. pissing on the wall outside instead of using the loo etc etc. However, it is likely I have came across travellers who I didn't even know were travellers as they didn't feel the need to shout on about it all of the time. I certainly wouldn't tar all of one group of people with one brush. I just seem to have been unfortunate with the people I have met in a lot of cases I think...

Have used the term pikey once as a teen about a carnival worker who may or may not have been a traveller. To me pikey actually meant the chavvy young guys who work on carnivals and try to pick up young girls. As an adult, I do try not use any terms I know people find offensive, whatever the reason for the offense. A girl I know gets seriously offended if someone says cunt, so I never say it around her. No need to cause offense for the sake of a word tbh

OpenMe · 19/08/2016 16:23

Sorry that doesn't excuse the racism. I think most people using the terms wouldn't believe they are racist but simply derogatory, which they feel are deserved because of the behaviour of the community (or that part if it that they know/see)

heknowsmysinsheseesmysoul · 19/08/2016 16:24

Irish travellers are recognised as an ethnic minority and have legal protection under the race discrimination act.

So offensive names ARE racist.

currentlyunavailable · 19/08/2016 16:25

Caricatural TV "reality" TV shows don't help, neither do frequent items in the news about clashes between communities don't help. People will justify it because they don't judge a colour, or a race, but a behaviour.

Bagina · 19/08/2016 16:25

Obviously you were keen to pounce from the outset...

GahBuggerit · 19/08/2016 16:25

like Bagina the only people who ive heard making derogatory comments towards trsvellers (i thought gypsy was a no no?) have had their lives turned upside down by them. not saying its right but considering what they have been through i think a few not very nice words in frustration is sort of understandable. think its exacerbated by the seeming reluctance by tge polife to DO something about the bad ones giving the majority a bad name

Dawndonnaagain · 19/08/2016 16:26

Stands firmly with Zippy

NeedACleverNN · 19/08/2016 16:26

My dh has Romany gypsy roots

His grandad was Romany. We don't have contact with them though so no one knows unless dh tells them. He won't tell them though because he gets no end of comments

currentlyunavailable · 19/08/2016 16:27

Blush apologies for terrible typos, can't see to proof read properly on my phone

SukeyTakeItOffAgain · 19/08/2016 16:29

In the Six Nations there was a furore when Samson Lee, a Welsh player from a Traveller background, was called "gypsy boy" by one of the England players. And rightly so.

shovetheholly · 19/08/2016 16:31

Travellers and gypsies are not the same thing!

Meowlster · 19/08/2016 16:32

I don't understand at all why it is considored acceptable. Good post from Zippy and I whole heartedly agree.

My DC 1 (10) was called a " Gypsy" as school a few months ago. School didn't do anything at first, until I kicked up a stink; DC was very upset . It is absolutely not acceptable, and was definitely meant in a derogatory way, although I couldn't say if the name-caller knew exactly what was they were saying. When it was passed to the head, they agreed it was a racist insult and dealt with it accordingly.

Please don't be shy about your own ethnic heritage (although that's easy for someone else to say).