To think this person should be in jail?

[FerdinandsMassiveBollocks]

www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/female-transsexual-walks-free-court-8546941

Anyone else not comfortable with this being counted as a crime committed by a woman? And really not comfortable with this person not going to jail? I don't care if there are no female specific classes, (there is a reason for that btw, because women don't do this shit) this person was male enough to commit the crime they are male enough to go to men's prison.

Yes Pearlman, I agree it's a mental health condition for which this is one form of treatment.

Pearlman, of course you can change your gender presentation to be more feminine and female-looking. But every single cell of your body will still be of the sex that you were born as. Men who undergo gender reassignment surgery and treatment may end up with a body that looks female, but it is a modified male body. I don't think you need to be particularly scientifically expert to understand this.

Exactly Babyzoo.

There are fairly firm expectations of how men and women are 'supposed' to behave. These expectations are socially constructed, usually to ensure that men are superior. If those expectations weren't there then a man who found himself feelings things that made him think he 'should have been a woman' wouldnt feel like he should really have been born a woman, he would just feel like, well, a man

This is what I mean when I ask what it 'feels like to be a woman'.

This is a homosexual pedophile who should be in prison. End of.

Direct whatever you like my way. Where is my extraordinary claim? That a man can't be in every way identical to a woman?

Then what extraordinary claim did o make?

*did I make

I think it sets a dangerous precedent to "absolve" someone from responsibility for a crime if they were in some way different at the time.

In Norway and I think Sweden, a person who has committed a crime whilst considered insane can later be judged sane and therefore not responsible for the crime and thus walk free. There was quite a bit of discussion regarding Anders Breivik and this law. Also Sture Bergwall.

Anyway, obviously the insanity argument is slightly different, but not hugely so and has worrying similarities.

I did say it's more complex than that but I would argue society's expectations must have some part to play in how someone feels about their gender identity.

In future there won't be any criminally insane people. They will just be differently brained and require society to make adjustments to accommodate their alternative perspective.

Nice one Pearlman. You can't disentangle anything, because I didn't make any extraordinary claim.

It's obvious isn't it surely?

If you e been bought up as a boy, with a penis and male hormones, if you've possibly lived part of your adult life as a man, you're going to have had very different experiences to a woman.

That doesn't invalided your own feelings and experiences or mean that you shouldn't be able to be who you want to be, but there's going to be a conflict somewhere along the line when it comes to women's issues.

Why the pedantic insistence on what you perceive to be and have experienced as being 'female' being the only definition of being 'female'? It comes across as prejudice, to be honest, and is a very ugly phenomenon indeed.

Because I have a huge problem with the concept of 'female' being completely redefined to include a subset of men. It completely disregards all the shit that women have had to put up with over the years.

I'll also again - are you ok with the idea of a woman who has been raped being assigned a 'female' counsellor who is obviously male and has a penis? Because that is the logical conclusion if you accept that 'male' and 'female' are just abstract concepts.

I've spent my life objecting to this idea of it being possible to be "psychologically female" as it is used by men to restrict and control women. There is nothing in it beyond socially constructed gender norms, and it is not innate. It is not prejudiced to state scientific fact.

Of course you can present any way you like, whether that is feminine or masculine or any combination. Doesn't change biological reality, and women have been restricted, controlled and had violence committed against them because of their biology since the dawn of humanity. Your insistence that this is unimportant to women is prejudiced and ugly.

You throw around the word "prejudice" because you're incapable of making a reasonable point in response to a legitimate concern being expressed. Because there isn't one to make, obviously. Not one which doesn't involve massively flawed reasoning and special pleading.

Well it's not quite job done.

As in the example that someone used up thread, if I was a woman that had been raped, I may very well want to be dealt with by a woman who has lived her life as a woman and had similar experiences.

Should I have to be physically examined by a person that has lived most of their life as a male and is biologically a male?

Absence of a penis does not make someone female

This person has undergone a sex change operation. I therefore presume that the accused now has a vagina. Are you saying this does not make them physically female? Really?

Absence of a penis does not make someone female

This person has undergone a sex change operation. I therefore presume that the accused now has a vagina. Are you saying this does not make them physically female?