Re: expectations of adult son

[Tink06]

I genuinely don't know. He is 20 and home from uni. Mil lives with us as she can barely stand without her zimmer. She doesn't need any personal care but we do all her meals, drinks and tablets. We don't use carers but have 3 older children, all of whom have finished college etc and between us we manage. I don't think its unreasonable to say to any of them you do nans lunch as you are at home anyway (to whoever - probably shared evenly). One of us nips home if they all have plans. I nearly always do the evening meal, dh does breakfast it usually lunch n doesnt have to be elaborate. That's all - no care, a basic meal, a drink n take tablets from a nomad n put them on her table. Don't expect them to stay home but do it when they are in anyway. We are all except eldest son going away for a fortnight shortly. He has a holiday job but the plan was always he was taking 2 weeks off, looking after Nan , dogs n other pets n getting paid for it. Sightly less than his wages but he was happy as not exactly hard work. Would also involve washing her clothes n probably other minor jobs but thats all. Much easier than his job n she didn't want carers coming in. Today though things have deteriorated to such an extent that I don't even trust him to feed the animal's. Twice this week have come home to her in tears. He burnt her lunch the other day, forgot it was in the oven, went back upstairs n then told her to stop whinging when she said it was inedible.
Similar thing today. Boiled a pan of soup almost dry, then left her to shoot back upstairs n she smashed the dish as he ignored her shouting him to take it away n get her tablets.
Aibu unreasonable to think he lives here rent free, we help him out (and so does she with an allowance) at uni? These aren't horrible strenuous chores n he can't even manage them. We are going away in 2 weeks and now having to source very expensive care (which she really didn't want) and to be honest I don't even trust him to feed the pets. I have visions of him forgetting the fish n Guinea pigs and dread what we might come home too. Am going to have to ask someone to have them. Money isn't the main issue, she has had carers before and didn't like it. To be honest I am livid with him
I feel like telling him to pay board himself now. I feel like he needs a dose of reality n we mollycoddle him. If he can help out, even when he is being paid then why should we sub him? It costs me a fortune when he us home especially in food. Aibu?

Everything bran said.

I think it would be far easier to care for strangers in a care home than to have to listen to your own grandma slagging off your family behind their back and throwing bowls on the floor. I'd say if she is throwing bowls, she definitely has needs that go beyond just having to be fed.

I seem to remember that when my gran developed dementia my elder brother, who was well into his twenties, kept carefully out of her way and for decades afterwards denied that grandma (whose favourite he had been) had ever been senile. I dealt with it, but did not find it easy. I judged him at the time, as a teen: I don't judge him now.

he simply has no manners and just doesn't know how to treat people at times.

Wow. Why is he allowed to carry on through life with no manners?

However tricky your MIL is, it just doesn't sound as if he is mature enough to do anything you need. Not even being home alone, quite apart from pets and gran.

RB68... "people need the choice of contributing rather than being forced to". Great idea! I'll tell that to my landlord when the rent is due! Seriously, no adult gets a "choice" of contributing. If you want to eat, you contribute financially. If you are unable to contribute financially (e.g. through illness or being genuinely unable to find work), then you contribute in other ways, like doing chores. Opting out of responsibilities should not be an option. I do still think though that forcing him to look after someone with serious care needs is a bit unfair. She's already thrown plates, what if she becomes violent? Get your DS to spend the 2 weeks at his job instead and get a carer. Start taking digs money from your son too.

Can I just say she didnt throw the plate on the floor or scream at him. She was trying to carry it back to the kitchen and dropped it as he didn't re-appear (think he was on his Xbox).
The holiday care was something they were both happy with not something we were pushing for. Its much easier than his job but involves a degree of commitment and reliability - both of which he said he could do. She doesn't need any care - just meals, cups of tea and clothes washing and a bit of company. It would mean him getting up early to do breakfast and also making's sure he is here at meal times. All of which he is perfectly capable of doing and they usually get on. She isn't vile at all - was just trying to point out that she isnt a sweet old lady either. Just normal I guess.
Her needs are probably on a par with basic stuff I do for my youngest (age 9) although she is a lot less mobile. This is the first year she has lived with us and maybe very naïvely thought they would both be okay. It must be horrible for her relying on others all the time.
He insists she is lying so don't know what to think. Mistakes happen but she has never been in tears before.

Have people actually read the whole op?

Op expects her ds to take two weeks off his summer job to care for his grandmother and the pets while the rest of them go on holiday. It's not just a bit of lunch, this is prepping and serving up and presumably clearing up after 42 meals. And all for less than he earns in his job.

I don't know many 20 year old students who would be happy with that.

In your post you said she smashed the dish as he ignored her shouting at him to take it away and bring her her tablets. Doesn't sound the same as she dropped it whilst trying to walk.

Would you leave your son in sole charge of your nine year old for two weeks, if no then why would it be OK with an elderly person with the same needs ?

Normal little old ladies don't slag everyone off behind their backs. That is pretty vile.

Was this holiday arrangement made before he came back from uni. When you see someone every day you tend not to notice them getting worse he may be seeing a change in her that has passed you by and is a bit scared of it especially knowing how much you need this break . I think you need to calm down and talk to him about how he views how she is. He may be feeling very guilty and trying to hide it as when all is said and done she's his grandmother and their relationship is usually good.

In the nicest possible way OP, you're giving inconsistent accounts here. You've said she's not vile and just normal, but the behaviours you describe don't really fit that picture. You do know constantly slagging her loved ones off as soon as their backs are turned isn't just normal, standard old lady behaviour don't you?

Anyway whoever you believe, I don't think the planned holiday care arrangement is going to work. You do need to get those carers. Quite apart from anything else, you'd be worried sick. And while I'd certainly address his lack of housework with him, I'd make weight pulling a separate issue to the care arrangement. Because DMIL being there has no bearing on that really. If she left tomorrow he should still pull his finger out of his arse.

Aspergers my arse, he's just a selfish shit. Kick him out if he can't sort himself out.

And I'm not just talking about his attitude to his grandmother. He should be helping around the house even if he is working. We all work in our house, DSS included and we all chip in with the housework. He does dishes, hoovers, etc without being asked.

You have indicated that she is emotionally manipulative and abusive to family members and now appear to be minimising your original post.

My parents both died before my wonderful Granda. My sister and I did everything for him and looked after him the best we could. I absolutely wouldn't have had it any other way. My dsis was still at Uni but that didn't stop her. We shared the workload, bearing in mind I had a newborn too.
My grandad had a fabulous relationship with my eldest until he died when she was 3.
Your son is being extremely immature, ungrateful, selfish and pathetic.
I hope you manage to get things sorted and you are able to relax and enjoy your holiday. I hope he, in time, will be ashamed of himself.

Annaff to be fair you said your grandfather was lovely, this mother in law/grandmother appears to be emotionally abusive to her family. Different situation

I think that all parties here are very guilty of not thinking this holiday arrangement through at all.

OP, when you are all at home it sounds as though you and DP are working as a team to care for MIL. That is great if it suits you that way.

DSS is around mainly in university holidays, otherwise usually not. Suddenly, the rest of you are going on holiday and leaving him in SOLE charge of what sounds like an increasingly difficult elderly relative (MIL). MIL is very likely frustrated and depressed at her declining faculties and increasing reliance on other people, in addition to having cantankerous tendencies and the possible onset of memory problems.

DSS, having recently returned from uni, will probably be seeing much more of a decline than you do, but for the fortnight you are away there will be NO teamwork for him. He is not exactly experienced in care work, yet is being thrown in at the deep end and will be on duty 24 hours a day for two weeks. It could well seem very daunting.

I don't think it is a fair ask. Get carers a couple of times a day and meals on wheels for lunchtime. DSS could go to his job, but would be home in the evening anyway, so company for her then and around if a problem occurred.

I think you have ploughed on ahead and possibly asked too much.

When I was in my late teens my grandma had to spend a few months living with us following major surgery for ovarian cancer. During that time we all cared for her and even as a team it was very hard. Whenever I had to spend just a few hours on my own with her I found it terrifying. I was so scared about how to cope. I knew then that I was not cut out to be a carer.

I think you have plumped blindly for the easiest and cheapest, but wrong, option to allow you to have this surely much needed holiday, and it is unfair on your DSS.

I really don't know what to say.

It seems clear to me your mil has problems that you aren't acknowledging. Especially the memory problems. She is going to a memory clinic, she says her grandson is boarding on abusive. He denies it happened.

You have changed the plate incident from 'she smashed the plate as he ignored her shouting' to 'she dropped it trying to put it away'.

Either her mental health is worse than you acknowledge or you know you son is a complete shit to her.

Your mil, who has form for taking about people behind their back and is having memory problems tells you something. Your son denies it's happened. But you believe her story and related her side here.

If you fully believe her, under the circumstances, you must have known he wasn't a suitable carer before these incidents.

When my grandad started lying, I knew beyond a shadow of a doubt my aunts would have done the things he said. Like taking money out of his bank. And then we proved it. He believed they had until the day he died.

I think there are problems here on both sides. Your son has no real experience of 'granny sitting' and 'granny' can be a cantankerous, selfish mare. He has given 2 weeks of his holiday job up to 'care' for the house, pets and granny, he will, no doubt, get things wrong, but it works both ways and from what you have said there is a background of bad behaviour from granny. In future you need to let him carry on with his job and get someone in to care for a person who is not capable of looking after herself.

Your son is being extremely immature, ungrateful, selfish and pathetic.
I hope you manage to get things sorted and you are able to relax and enjoy your holiday. I hope he, in time, will be ashamed of himself.

This is a very unfair and judgmental comment indeed. Not everyone is cut out to be a carer, and not every person needing care is easy to care for or readily accepting of it.

There are many complex issues involved. I know that I am not carer material either. I just couldn't do it 24/7. I absolutely know that. I am not without empathy, nor am I immature, ungrateful, selfish or pathetic. I am not ashamed of myself for being that way either.

I am a caring person, I do what I can when I can but I know my limitations. I would have been utterly crapping myself if I had been asked to do what this young man is being asked to do.

Arrrgh! Bold fail there.

Once again, I agree with bran: your account is so inconsistent that it is impossible to get an idea of what is actually happening and like her I feel that this is probably about your not wanting to acknowledge how bad the problem is. You cope, perhaps partly by sticking your head in the sand (which may be a sensible survival tactic) and can't see why everybody else can't do the same. He comes from outside and this may well be a greater shock to him than to somebody who lives the situation day out day in.

We took 16yo ds up to visit his dying grandmother the other weekend. She had a really good day as far as dh and I were concerned: not too much pain, recognised us, was able to attempt a conversation. But he saw all the things we have stopped seeing: her shrinking body, her struggling to make herself understood, her loss of physical control, her occasional confusion. He is a brave lad, and would have been willing to go up again the next weekend, but I could see that it was hard for him, though he would not admit it.

Your son sounds extremely slapdash, but to be honest more careless and forgetful rather than cruel. Your mother in law sounds very difficult, (smashing her plate, shouting) so I think she needs carers; she does seem to dictate what goes on in your household.

She's his grandmother! This is family not a job. Why should it all fall on the OP? He's an adult member of the family and as such should be capable and willing to do his share. He didn't have this 'job' forced upon him, he agreed. Not saying that your MIL isn't difficult, she probably is, but all the 'poor diddums he's on his holidays and it's all too much for him' is pathetic. When you live as part of a family you pitch in or ship out. He needs to get used to that.

Cory, I think I know what your 16 year old felt there.

I remember at the age of 18 being taken to visit my paternal grandmother (not the one I mentioned in my earlier post) in hospital, where she virtually lived after having many, many strokes which had virtually destroyed her.

Apparently she was having a really good day on that day, and was alert and all of that. I couldn't see it though. She couldn't get out of bed, was a tiny fraction of the size and weight she had once been, and I wasn't sure she even knew we were there or who we were. She just didn't look at all like the independent and outgoing person I remembered. I found it shocking.

I pay rent to live in my parents with my daughter. I don't have any grandparents and i miss the silly things my grandad used to do at xmas (£1 and an orange in a sock with a mars bar seems trivial to others but to me it meant a lot) i would never treat my gran/grandad like this and if my daughter treated my parents like that she would be out the house. Get some carers in at least you will know she will be looked after.

It doesn't all fall on the OP shelaghturner. She clearly describes managing the duties between herself, DH and the older children.

Perhaps he doesn't feel comfortable looking after her and secretly hopes you will sort something else out.