to think it's not odd my baby wakes up at night?

[hereagainalways]

DS is 4 months old, EBF. He goes down for the night between 6 and 630 (early I know but he just can't stay awake past that) and is up for the day around 6am, sometimes 5.30. During the night he wakes (to feed) at approximately 10, 2 and 4. I have tried resettling him without feeding at the 2am feed (dummy, white noise etc) but he won't have it and it's just easier to feed him peacefully and have him go straight back to sleep tbh.

My NCT group look at me like this when I tell them how much he wakes up and say stuff like oh sorry you have such a dreadful sleeper. Their babies either sleep through or only wake up once apparently.

Don't get me wrong as I would love it if he slept through obviously but I really thought this was quite normal for babies??

I'm not judging you for how you do or don't parent your babies. I do think you're being smug to the point of ridiculous if you think that what works for your babies will work for all babies, though, and that people with non-sleepers just aren't as good at parenting as you.

Mine was (still is, to a degree) an awful sleeper. There were times when I would have happily chewed my own arm off if someone promised me it would make her sleep. That you think I and parents like me were actively choosing that level of exhaustion, and could have simply fixed it by... something?..., just makes you sound daft.

Coffeelover56 - those are the same times mine woke up :D

I do think you're being smug to the point of ridiculous if you think that what works for your babies will work for all babies, though, and that people with non-sleepers just aren't as good at parenting as you.

This.

And my baby, despite the night wakings, gets a good 15 hours of sleep per day, which is exactly right for his age. He wakes, he feeds, he goes back to sleep. It takes maybe 30 mins of my night in total. He's an excellent daytime napper.

Why can you not accept that some babies actually do need feeding at night??

And yes of course I'm judging, just as you are judging me for not jumping up every time my baby wakes in the night.

I'm not sure you're reading my posts. I do attempt to resettle in other ways. I do give him a few minutes to see if he resettles himself. When these things don't work, I feed him. No bother. No problem for me or for him.

The only other option left to me is leaving him to cry. Is that what you think I should do?

My eldest was never a fan of sleep, bar a small phase at around 2 years during which she would sleep for 16hrs plus at night. On one memorable occasion from 7 at night until 12 noon the next day, when I woke her and couldn't figure out whether to give her breakfast or lunch. Didn't last, and at nearly 6 she still doesn't need as much sleep as others. She's going to bed at 9ish at the moment as we are camping and still waking at 0630. It's just who she is.

Demand feeding is totally normal. Even at an older age. As is needing comfort to sleep.

Re should I let him cry? Up to you. We certainly let ours cry for longer than a few minutes yes. We judged it on type of cry, age, state of health, how the day had been etc. Part of teaching a child to sleep means weaning them off night dependency. If people choose to do it longer than absolutely necessary, you go for it, but don't be surprised when people express shock, dismay, pity etc when you are up in the night with quite a big baby/child.

And I don't agree that when children wake in the night that they automatically need comfort from a parent. Of course they do sometimes, but not always and certainly not habitually every night. They need to learn to self settle at some point, if they are not to be jumping into adult beds in the middle of the night when they at 5/6/7 resulting in the whole family being disturbed and knackered. In my view, the earlier the better, and for us that was when it was clear that they didn't need more milk.

When ours slept through (meaning from 11-7) the blanket of exhaustion lifted and everything in life got easier. Why wouldn't people want that for other parents?

Hard though it may be to understand, I'm not living under a "blanket of exhaustion". I'm fine.

He's four months old ffs. Not fourteen.

If my four month old was waking up 3/4 times a night, and had been for four months, I would be murderous. That's why I made the decision to actively ensure our nights weren't disturbed.

When I said earlier that you obviously don't need much sleep I was criticised, when clearly it's true and you make your parenting choices accordingly. I think most people disturbed that much for a long period of time would be hanging though, a state to which previous posters have attested.

Well the criticisms are still valid, as I've outlined I've done many things to make him sleep longer, and none have worked.

As it happens I'm not hugely fussed. But if I was, there wouldn't be a huge amount I could do, given the above.

Short of leaving him to cry, which I don't agree with.

hereagain, I'm with you. There may be a time for a child to learn "independence". When they are a few months old and completely dependent on you for everything is not it. You keep trusting your instincts.

My five month old big baby wakes up a few times (at least) each night for food, for a cuddle, whatever. He's a delightful, happy little fellow, so it doesn't bother me at all. It would only be a concern if it seemed like something was wrong.

Similarly those parents who teach their kids to sleep through very quickly should also trust their own judgement that their decisions are not irrational and that many other people choose to do it. It doesn't mean you don't love your kids, it doesn't mean you are choosing not to comfort them, you are making the best decision for your own family, based on its individual needs.

Is there a way you could try feeding at 11 then 3 and then wait until the 6am wake up? Maybe by making the feeds a bit longer (feed - nappy change - feed again).

Do you genuinely think you baby is hungry at 4 after having had milk at 2? I am only asking because when my DS was around 11mo he started waking up in the middle of the night (used to sleep through) and drink a huge amount of milk, which made me think he was hungry. After months, I tried replacing the milk by water. He stopped waking up.
So, sometimes it could just be a habit.

However, you know your baby, and 4mo is still very young. The nights will get easier, I am sure!

But sleep training doesn't always work. I'd love to have mine sleeping 11-7 but nothing we've done has helped including controlled crying (which I now feel was a huge mistake, it made him worse, not better.)

For some kids, sleeping through is just not something they do until a bit later, and that's ok. He wakes, he needs me, I go to him, he's ok. That works, just about, for us.

If my four month old was waking up 3/4 times a night, and had been for four months, I would be murderous. That's why I made the decision to actively ensure our nights weren't disturbed.

My DD's record was 16 times in one night at that age. I was too bloody tired to be murderous, but I was certainly not happy.

But tell me: what active steps could I, or people in my situation, have done? Settled without feeding? (Did that; quite often she didn't even want feeding when she woke, even if I did offer.) Leave her to fuss and see if she'd settle? (Tried that, too.) Made sure she was drinking plenty of milk during the day? Good bedtime routine? Blackout blinds? Shush-pat? PUPD? White noise? Cosleeping? Not cosleeping? Believe me, I tried bloody everything. The only thing I was not prepared to try was leave her alone and screaming for hours covered in her own vomit.

Some babies just don't sleep. It is not a measure of your parenting, it really really isn't. That would be like me saying "I couldn't deal with ear infections, so I chose to make sure my child never got any. If you chose differently, that's up to you!" Some things are not actually within our power to choose, whatever we might prefer.

Some babies just don't sleep. It is not a measure of your parenting, it really really isn't.

Hear hear!

They are lying...

They're not lying.

The point of this thread wasn't to have a go at parents of babies who sleep through. Or to insinuate they're lying.

There's a massive range of "normal" babies. I was merely pointing out I didn't think my DS should be labelled a dreadful sleeper for simply being one example of a normal baby.

I was not after advice on how to sleep train him, stretch out his feeds or similar. I can't force him to take bugger feeds if he doesn't want them.

Bigger, not bugger!

Sleep cannot be compared to ear infections. Some babies are very demanding and get used to those demands being met with cuddles and milk and love even at anti social times, long after they actually need parental assistance at night. Letting that baby get used, very gradually and very kindly, to those cries being met with a neutral reaction followed by no reaction, is not the same as leaving a baby in pain to cry. They just aren't on any level equivalent.

inlove

Is there a part of "my baby is four months" you don't understand?

He's barely out of the newborn stage.

Err, 4 months isn't newborn. Newborn is newborn. After a month or so, they are still delicious, but no longer newborn. Your expectations then change accordingly.

The newborn stage lasts for the first three months.

I am with inlove however I also understand the other approach - I don't necessarily agree with it but I accept that others will not agree with a somehow stricter way of handling nights.
Everybody, no need to argue with eachother, we are just giving advice and talking about our experience. Obviously we all love our children.
I have DT, and I can tell you the same approach/amount of milk/etc has different results with different babies!

Not if you go on John Lewis baby labels it isn't

Potato, potahto. The term itself is irrelevant, though if you consider a four month old to be a newborn then of course your views on what they need may be a little off kilter.