Brexit rage

[holeinyourhead]

What's happened in the last 10 days has really affected me. It's all I think about tbh and I feel so enraged at seeing the politicians lie to us so lavishly then bail on us so swiftly, yet I'm completely powerless to do anything. I marched, I wrote to my MP, I've signed petitions. I'm obviously one of the 48% who wanted to remain. I can't find fault with the 52% who voted to leave, it's not their fault. It's a democratic process, I understand that of course. Everyone's entitled to their view and it's not that I'm a sore loser. But the catastrophic fallout isn't what even the most hardline leave voter would have wished for, there's no Brexit plan, and the future looks very bleak. I was at a conference today and a Conservative MP and a Brussels Eurocrats both agreed a recession in the medium term is now inevitable. People around me seem to be getting on with things - I wish I could too - but I've been very tearful and sleepless and worried sick. I run a European business just out of start up phase, employing a handful of people who by chance are not British born and who are now very nervous themselves about the future. The more I read the more hopeless I feel with each passing resignation. AIBU to feel like this? Does anyone else feel the same? Am I going nuts?!! I feel very alone.

Oh certainly, if an election were held before brexit- then ukip would take much of the Thames estuary now. this is a densely populated area - 7 million(?) and its certainly been a very powerful part in the leave vote.

Never put anything important to a referendum as people vote on issues other than the one on the ballot paper

also
What will be the immigration tariff for a lettuce picker ?
or a Care home assistant
or a late night office cleaner
as without immigrants for the last 100 years none of those jobs would get done

But it's not just about it not being known - nobody even seems to know what we are aiming for!

I see Wales is now regretting it's decision to vote leave. A bit bloody late..

Bengal In answer to your earlier question: no, they would not pay us if we choose to be in the EEA. Think of the EU as a members club. We would pay to get the club benefits. But EEA is like the basic package and what we have now is like a special rate membership. We get all of the benefits of full membership but tailored to us. The UK currently has the most preferential deal in the EU. But we just stuck two fingers us to that. It took decades to put together and now we've trashed it. This is why the rest of the world think we are morons. We may well end up paying the same membership fees as we do now but for fewer services and no support.
Does that sound like a good deal to you?
Quite frankly, we need the collective bargaining of the EU. When first joined the EEC the world was a different place. We were a stronger part of the world economy and had a third of the world behind us. We changed since then and do has world economics. Over the next few decades we will see China, India and Brasil really take over. Being outside of the EU block as they negotiate with these countries is going to put us at a distinct disadvantage. This is especially true if France and Germany are successful in luring away financial services.

StrictlyMumDancing I received this today after emailing Rossindell. I knew he wouldn't vote against the implementation of Article 50 but how patronising

fell there there little lady, stop questioning numbers now and talking madly, back to the kitchen

Tbh the reason I didn't write to him myself was that I knew that would be his response. It's just so sad the closest challenge he has had was ukip last ge.

A very long time ago on this thread I said Gisela Stuart was hypocritical in signing a letter asking that EU citizens abroad and at home should be safe and someone questioned it. Just to say, the reason I think she's hypocritical is because she fronted the Leave campaign, she led everyone to believe that a Leave vote would lead to more 'control', and in week 1 after the vote, we have far less 'control' and no chance of any sanity arriving soon. Fine to make sweeping statements when you are pretty sure you won't have to actually act on them or anticipate the very predictable result. I don't think she's being 'consistent' at all. She's my mum's MP, I was THRILLED when Labour got elected in a very traditional Tory seat and I'm sure she's a decent woman..

So China is starting to reach out to the UK for a trade deal as they are so frustrated by the EU and USA, far from putting us at the back of the queue is also gearing up diplomatically to cut a deal ... Any good negotiators out there in MN land, the next two years are your oyster ....

I'm been feeling very depressed and hopeless about this situation too. Part of it is this horrid feeling of powerlessness, and this feeling that the whole thing should have been avoidable. (And when I hear leave voters talking about regretting their vote "oh, I just wanted to protest, I didn't think Leave would actually win" I actually want to tear my hair out and scream!)

Like you, I've emailed MPs and marched, but I think we may have to accept that for the time beginning, we've done all we reasonably can, and take a step back. Trying to control things not in our control is only going to make us more miserable. I'm trying to wean myself off checking the news 20 times a day! It's hard but I'm making progress.

I think you need to focus on what you can control, and that will make you feel more positive. You need to fight for your new business and concentrate on making it as successful as it can be, for you and your employees. It's hard to say exactly what's going to happen, but it's looking very unlikely that anyone already legally in Britain will be asked to leave. Your employees will look up to and take their cues from you. Go in positive and ready to face challenges head on, and they will slowly start to feel reassured. Same goes for your customers / clients. I know it's hard, but I think that's the quickest way for you to start feeling better.

yanbu op. I'm really, really shit scared about the future, I wake up crying.

Whatever happens it won't be the fault of Leave
next.ft.com/content/4aa912fa-4423-11e6-b22f-79eb4891c97d

I got a really patronising email back from my MP (John Penrose) saying pretty much the same as Rossindell - that we should unite behind the decision. He was a remainer as well. It just sickens me.

Strictly I knew it was a waste of time but me and husband both emailed- like fools. Luckily we did get the same letter back, his wasn't any less patronising. Small mercies, I guess!

Yeah, the UKIP thing is demoralising. Maybe we should move?!?

Steely it makes me feel slightly better that I'm not the only one with a wanker for an MP.

Oh god steely, at least rossindell was an out and out leave guy, if he wrote that as a remainer I'd have lost my crap.

We can't negotiate with any other trade countries/ blocs until we leave EU; and again is all a matter of negotiation; so to say this or that is lieing.

But obviously I feel your pain at lack of leadership, and lack of direction of what we should try to aim for (ie. what deal we would like to achieve if possible)

Actually, the choice not to set out what Leave were aiming for was a conscious strategic one and one that won the referendum (alongside some good old-fashioned hatemongering).

If people had known what kind of model the Leave advocates were advocating - or if we'd got into a proper debate of what was even possible, the result would have been a massively splintered Leave vote as those not getting their desired model - EEA, EFTA, Canada, pull up the drawbridge, whatever - would have been less likely to vote leave (or vote at all). I know a significant number of people who thought they were voting 'to be like Norway', which was always incompatible with the end to free movement promise made to others.

Instead they left it to people's imaginations and dissembled just enough about the options that were out there without pointing out that some were mutually exclusive or impossible or awful for Britain's circumstances that everyone got to feel they were voting for their Brexit model.

It actually makes me angrier than the £350 million lie 'possibility'.

My upset and disappointment is a bit less than the day after the vote. Mainly because Boris Johnson nor Michael Gove are not going to be PM, which I feared.

Of course we negotiate before leaving the EU. The diplomatic service exists precisely to do this stuff under the radar. Real Politic rot large,

citroenpresse Thu 07-Jul-16 11:55:58

where you live perhaps, I was In Amsterdam on Brexit weekend and was chatting to anyone and everyone about it.

Some people said they and their friends were desperate to Nexit, others not so keen.

I find it strange you feel you can offer up - Netherlands total feelings here.
There is a movement to leave and there is a party offering a referendum!

i see, so you go and negotiate house prices do you when its not even for sale

fell apart from disagreeing with you, I cant see the issue with the letter, he is stating his case thats all.

Sounds great to me