or is anyone else feeling unsettled and just want today to be over

[Gowgirl]

Yes I have voted, but I am sick and tired of the unrest, I'm aware there has been a lot of discontent for a long time but its now feeling toxic and I want it to be over one way or the other.

Baccimama....... You can still bet but if you're going to bet on a simple remain / exit, if you're going to bet on remain, it probably isn't worth it at this point because the odds are so low......... For every £10 you bet, you'd only get £1 winnings (inc your original £10 obviously) .

But if you still fancy it, or want to take a punt on brexit, you can do it in any betting shops or sign up for an online bookies. I use paddy power.

I voted remain, I'm an ex-pat overseas and I know a fair number of others who also voted remain. I think the majority of people over seas will have voted or will vote remain.

is that EU or non EU dizzy?

I don't even care about the results right now, I just want it all to be over (including the inevitable 'fix' recriminations that will come).

In 'real life' I've heard people I like say things about how we have too many human rights, and have I noticed how many people of a certain skin tone are around these days. And of course online, every article and thread contains ugly comments about both sides. I'll be impressed if anyone has come through this feeling proud to be from the UK.

Thanks 19lottie I looked at ladbroke and could feel myself getting all excited at the prospect of winning lots of money but perhaps best not to sign up and develop a gambling habit at my advanced age

Isn't it illegal to publish exit poll date before 10pm tonight?

Another referendum ravaged 'Scot' here. Well, Scottish in that I've lived here for more than twenty years. Originally from a British colony. But I've never felt less welcome or comfortable as I have since the referendum. When Salmond et al talk about running a 'positive' campaign, they really aren't talking about MY experience of their campaign.

Times have really changed. My grandfather fought for Britain in WW2 even though he'd never set foot on British soil, and even though his own country faced zero risk. Risked his life for people he didn't know.

I keep feeling, in contrast, that today's vote has given scant regard to how dramatically this could change lives in Scotland, NI and Gibraltor. SNP supporters keep arguing that 'English' voters really don't care about Scotland. In the wake of this I feel I now have to keep my mouth shut. I don't like the self-engrossed selfish aspect of this referendum.

Today I was watching a heartbreaking programme on Falluja and the suffering there and felt deep shame that discourse on refugees and immigrants formed such a massive part of this campaign. Terrible shame. What have we come to and what have we lost as a nation as a result of this?

Sorry that should say data not date

It's so interesting to hear you guys talk about the Scottish referendum. I guess we didn't get anything like the same level of coverage in England. What struck me from the stuff I saw was that the debate seemed perhaps every bit as impassioned and divisive, but about a million times more intelligent. People seemed to raise their game, and there appeared to be so many civic issues on the agenda that just haven't been on display in the UK. I was watching the telly in slightly jealous awe at times - 17 year olds talking about what kinds of values they wanted to live by, incredible! I guess this might just have been a selective feature of what was shown.

cakeycakeface I understand what you are talking about. I've just had a big argument with a person on a FB group. They are arguing that 'England is full'. They quoted some statistic that said England has a population density of 413 people per sq km (based on 2013 data). Yes, I said, but Scotland's was 68 at the same time and that, at the last count, we were all still part of the UK. They replied that 'but I'm talking about Englad'. Unfortunately, it's not just England that would be dragged out of the EU.

All thoroughly depressing really.

I'm drinking wine tonight..

Yy, shove, it was definitely selective. The Scottish referendum was deeply unpleasant. This one doesn't feel anywhere near as bad as that up here, at least for me. It's possibly because all the major Scottish parties agree on Remain so there's less divisiveness here than there was. I suspect it's different in England.

That said, I do think this referendum has set a new low bar for debate. The level of misinformation from both sides was quite staggering, and very few answers were given to any of the questions. I realise that it's all about unknowns, but there didn't seem to even be attempts to answer the questions.

Grouchy - I am unreasonably disappointed, not least because I had Scotland pegged as this rational utopia compared to England! (Am half Scottish).

It is awful where I am in England. Because I've followed an erratic course in life, I have a lot of friends in all classes and they are so divided. One of the things that scares me is the way the referendum is revealing something I've always feared was there: divisions along other lines that go very deep. Even my neighbours are all on different sides (I live in the kind of street with a marked generational divide). I also have a fair friends who are immigrants of varying duration who are really hurt by the whole thing, which is horrible to see.

It leaps out in random places too. I was at a tiny plant nursery, and I was having this lovely conversation with a random guy who was also there, and completely out of the blue he said 'Has your city been ruined by foreigners, then?' Just like that, apropos of nothing, it went from being nice to being awful. I'm pretty sure that would not have happened before.

I wouldnt say I feel unsettled, I think it's an interesting time in politics. We were chatting about it in my office, some are in and some are out, there was no nastiness. I think the bulk of it's been on the internet, easy to be insulting behind a keyboard.
I voted out, but to be honest I dont think either prospect ( in or out), fills me with joy. I think there will be a big swing to remain.

Im interested in how things will pan out after the result, I think this may have a big impact on politics whatever the result.

I only recall covereage of "leave" in the scotish referendum, and it was all intelligent articulate stuff, covering all aspects of life and a very positive vision and clear plan post leave..

As such I was surprised at the outcome, it seemed a done deal from the coverage I saw, but I'm guessing it was highly biased and filtered from how posters here are describing it, which is doubly sad, sad that i wasn't a "decent" campaign, and sad that our media is such a propoganda machine that we don't even get to see what's really happening in other parts of the UK

I don't think the outs will win, it will be close but I reckon remain will take it. I have been changing my mind the whole campaign, went with my heart and not my head and voted out. Now I'm worrying I didn't make the right choice, all I can think is what will happen to interest rates as we have 2 mortgage renewals in the next year! I gambled and am now wishing I hadn't and hoping we remain.

I think the bulk of it's been on the internet, easy to be insulting behind a keyboard.

I wish that was the case, not that it's okay to be insulting behind a key board, but at least if people are keeping it to that then at least a part of them recognises that it's not okay and needs filtering in some circumstances.

The worst of it I've heard/seen has been in public, loud rantings on public transport, in waiting rooms for medical appointments, in the staff room… it's been really uncomfortable

Shove I agree with grouchy. I feel the Scottish referendum was far worse, although I have to say, the murder of Jo Cox trumped everything. That single moment dwarfed everything.

We had campaign offices trashed, MPs heckled unpleasantly with loudhailers wherever they went, horrible horrible language used towards anyone voting No - traitor, quisling. I didn't ever see a No poster that was untrashed, but every single Yes poster was intact. We were told we were feart, and that we were talking Scotland down. It was suggested we only voted No because we thought Scotland was 'too wee and too poor' (in other words, we lacked patriotism and loyalty to Scotland). Really really unpleasant stuff. Repeated over and over again. And bear in mind as well that the campaign went in for a very very long time. In fact, even now, we still have homemade Yes structures in fields around us, and people do still have stickers on their cars etc.

My lowest point was when one of the 'No' booklets was circulated around by Yes friends who were bantering on about how there were no red heads in it on Facebook. I.e. No 'proper' Scots represented. Same people routinely now, in political debate, refer to their kids red hair. (My kids do not have red hair and they also have a non-Scottish mother). Can you imagine how this reads to a person like me who comes from Southern Africa where 'whiteness' was once codified by the right kind of hair among other things. Incidentally, I stopped speaking to these people and probably never will again.

I couldn't watch the results. I went to bed literally quivering. DH stayed up and at 4am he woke me up to say it was almost certainly a No result. But he was raging. He was pacing the floor, so angry I thought he was going to cry, saying, "Right, I want my fucking flag back. They've stolen my fucking flag. I have as much right to that flag as anyone". Because the saltire was co-opted as a symbol of Scottish nationalism rather than a flag for everyone.

The thing is, people I know who voted Yes really don't recognise how deeply and painfully their 'positive' campaign scarred people. They dismiss all this. Which is why I think they'll have a very very hard time persuading them to switch to Yes.

... Except, that is, if there is a Brexit.

Gosh cakey I had no idea. I knew things had become very passionate, but I didn't realise it had reached that level. My eyes are opened. It must have been very traumatic for all of you; the kind of public hurt that takes years to heal. Your poor DH!

One thing that hasn't been discussed a lot here in England is the reopening of the Scottish question in the event of 'leave'. You hear people mentioning it in passing but that's it. I imagine it's a very different story north of the border.

Irish people have and still are suffering the effects of a terrible recession. There is no chance they would even consider leaving the EU at this point.

Whichever way it goes I can just see the next foreseeable years in politics being like a grumpy couple arguing over directions.
"I fucking told you it was that way, now look what's happened, we're lost"
"Well I thought you were LYING you LIE about everything else, like that time you said you were working late..."
"Oh I just KNEW you'd have to bring that up, one fucking time that happened, don't change the subject, this is your fault, it was left at the lights, not right, which I TOLD YOU if you ever bothered to listen to me..."etc etc. Everyone will be blaming everyone else for years to come whenever something bad happens.

Here is there an update on the 8 o/c polls?

An hour and a half to go, I've sent dh out for wine

Feeling unsettled, like you, OP. Would like to know if my pension is protected.

DH has just returned with posh crisps and Haribo.
I luffs him

It is. I suspect every single Scottish voter will have voted today weighing their decision against what it means for a second referendum.

During the Indy-referendum, Salmond tried to sell the idea that because the UK was a part of the EU, and Scotland was a part if the UK, it meant Scotland had an automatic right to the opt-outs that had been already negotiated and also that it meant an independent Scotland was already a part of the EU. (Brussels disagreed). This was how he rebuffed suggestions that Scotland would have no choice but to adopt the Euro and renegotiate entry into the EU as an independent nation.

In one of the recent debates in THIS referendum, he revealingly retorted to a Leave campaigner that it was Britain that would be leaving the EU in the wake of Brexit, not Scotland. Same position.

So my take is they need the UK to remain, so they can lay claim to those arguments again. If we are taken out of the EU then SNP will have a harder time arguing for Independence if they have to also sell the Euro and if they have no way to opt out of shengan, for example. The UK's EU deals are their 'ticket' out of a tricky corner, so to speak.

So some people here have deliberately voted Leave today, to thwart them. I voted Remain, because that's who I am as a person. I feel those values are consistent with my choice to be a part of the U.K. too.