More of a WWYD? Moral dilemma

[Zarathustrasilver]

NC for this.

I have been separated from my husband for 5 years and we are now finally getting round to sorting out the financials and our divorce.

We were together for 7 years before getting married and married for 2 years before we split up. I'm currently renting with no chance of getting onto the property ladder until I have saved a deposit.

We met in 2002, I moved into his house in 2003 and I went onto the mortgage in 2005. We then married in 2009. We have no children together. I left the marriage with nothing, he is still in the house with our 2 dogs. I contributed to the house financially from when I moved in, 8 years before we split up.

The split has been more than amicable, we are still friendly and have met up for a few times for coffee and a chat to discuss the financial stuff and text and chat on the phone every so often.

We have joint debts amounting to approx 10k. His suggestion was that he will pay off the joint debt and I will come off the mortgage and then we would be completely separate from each other financially. This was agreed about a year after we split. I was in complete agreement about walking away and not asking for anything else. The reason for this was over my guilt over how we separated because I left him for someone else who I now have 1 child with.

Last month we got the ball rolling by going to a solicitor each to draw up a separation agreement.

My solictor told me that I would be legally entitled to a substantial amount of money after the debts are cleared off.

I was aware that I would be legally entitled to money as we were married and I was on the mortgage however I had decided years ago that I wouldn't ask for anything because of the guilt I would feel asking this after I left for him someone else and that it was his house to begin with.

So really what I'm asking is what would you do in this situation? Would you ask for a cash lump sump sum as well as what we'd agreed?

Stick to your word.

Solicitors (from experience) will always encourage you to fight financially for as much as you can irrespective of how this will affect your relationship with your ex. That's not their problem.
It's great you've managed to stay on good terms and that's worth it's weight in gold.

No I wouldn't ask for anything, you agreed to nothing, legally you are entitled, I will leave the moral side to you and would you be able to live with the guilt,

You must separate your personal issues from the financial issues. You need to look after your financial situation - no matter what went on in the relationship - after all you have no children together. In order for you to be in a sound financial position you need to keep your finances at the best level you worked hard to secure. And that means you take your solicitor's advice and get the proper settlement, despite the fact that you made a verbal agreement - an agreement made when you were ignorant of your situation. You'll regret it later in life because you will not be able to get on the housing ladder / secure your pension etc. If the shoe was on the other foot, make no mistake that this new agreement would be forced on to you. Be sensible about your finances. Your future life depends on it. Best of luck. Be brave.

Unless doing so would leave your ex in a truly awful position, I think you should pursue the money you're entitled to - particularly if that's the advice you've received legally.

I appreciate you gave your word but many things are said during break ups and not always upheld. (I'm impressed so many on MN would stick to their word!)

And it's great that you've managed to keep things amicable but does that really matter - surely your financial security and own future without him is more important... (Sorry for being brutal). I hope you can find a way forwards...

This ridiculous convo wd never happen if the op were a man. WOmen have been so brainwashed that they wd voluntarily give up what the law says they are entitled to ? It's hard to feel sympathy for such self inflicted martyrdom. At least think about your family. It's not only you being affected by this foolish decision.

You are legally entitled. You could give your child a nice start or pay a deposit down. However you shafted him 5 years ago. You didn't make any financial requests then or aims to sort out your situation. I think you would screw him over again if you did. Write that money off as rent for that period. It's the decent thing to do. Poor you, what a crap situation.

If you could do with the money, I'd sound your ex out how he'd feel about basically giving you some back. Explain that you felt guilty at the time and just wanted things to be as amicable as possible, but that he's surely over that now and you chucked in for the mortgage for years.

Could you speak to him? Say that you appreciate you made the agreement but you understand what is legally yours is 20k. Could he give you enough for a deposit for a house (don't know how much houses are in your area). Where I live, a 12kdeposit gets a nice 3bed house. You don't have to go for 20k, or for a 3bed house. You also, if his reaction is negative, don't have to pursue this (I wouldn't).
I don't see anything wrong with explaining your concerns to him if you really are on very good terms. He might agree to give you more with no bitterness.

More interesting points from you all! Emotionally it would be easier to walk away.

I am terrified of bringing up the prospect of more money with him. Once those words have been said there's no going back and I have no control over what happens next. It actually makes me feel sick thinking about it.

You married him which means you promised to be faithful. You broke that promise. You agreed to not go after him financially and now you are thinking of breaking that agreement. Everyone makes mistakes but sometimes you need to learn something from them. For example, if you treat someone badly you will feel guilty so maybe stop treating them badly ?

Sometimes the law isn't the moral thing to do!

I would leave it and do as I previously agreed! The poor man was left for another man and then you're going to ask for more, not good!

I expect he would quickly get nasty if you asked for more, so if you do you first need to have made the decision onwhether you would pursue it legally.

That's like paying rent for a home then expecting it to be refunded at the end of the tenancy...you lived there did you not you say you get along well then why stick the boot in to someone who is treating you quite frankly better than I would treat my DH if he fucked off with another woman. Look at it as paying for your rent after you moved into his home. Don't play dirty, he's been through enough.

Important point that may have got missed upthread: this £10k of debt arose because the DH was putting £400 per month into share assets (presumably in his name only) which should have gone into household expenses.

If the £10k debt had arisen because the two of you couldn't live within your income then it would be fair for you to share it, but that isn't the case. Effectively his offer to "write off your share of the debt" is meaningless because it's not a debt you should ever have owed if he hadn't been siphoning off assets like that.

OP you are morally entitled to half of the assets which were built up between the two of you over the course of the marriage. Everything including these shares, both pensions, the equity gained on the house both from mortgage payments and any increase in value, and then take away the £10k debt from that amount and halve the remainder.

I do see that you might feel that you want less than you are entitled to, due to your guilt, and that's not unreasonable but given that the so-called debt was not legitimately accrued you are getting zero, and that's not fair.

I stand corrected muststop
My apologies op
Perhaps this is a case of going with your gut and doing what will help you sleep at night, but as it's been pointed out by pp it seems you are entitled to something and perhaps he has used your guilt to manipulate you.

Perhaps he has. I'd still stick by my word - and sleep the better for it.

As a matter of interest, what advice has your current partner given you?

I have been one of the posters encouraging you to ask for some equity though much of that depends on details I haven't given - did the property increase in value etc.

Purely morally - when I ended my first marriage I didn't take "what I was entitled to". It was a short marriage, I was much younger than ex, we both had a child each. I took the value of my deposit plus what it increased by in that time.

After 8 years of contributing everything I earned whilst the other person syphoned off £400 per month I would have fought for some equity provided the house had increased in value in that time. It is not the same as renting when you are in a relationship regardless of who ends it.

I don't think your "word" before you had been advised is the same thing as a proper decision, and frankly knowing when to change your mind and not stick with something is more adult than regarding yourself as bound by a silly statemen . I do think you should carefully way the financial consequences. Personally I would not walk away from a deposit on a house. Good luck.

zara Given the result of the referendum it is now a big possiblity that house prices may crash. If the house goes into negative equity and you are still on the deeds and mortgage, legally you will be jointly responsible for the negative equity in the outstanding mortgage amount. Question is, what will your ex do if that happens? Will he renege on his word and force you to pay? Or will he stick to the agreement that you made when he thought he would be quids up?

I would ask citizens advice. from my understanding (although I am not expert). You are entitled to half the house plus half of your husband pension pot.
At a minimum you should get bought out of the morgage ie get half the profit on the value difference from the original price. Assuming your not in negative equity