To think Owen Jones is childish

[sandrabedminster]

Owen Jones storms off sky news

I don't even get what his issue is, he's invited on to discuss the headlines and then runs off as he doesn't like how much attention the biggest story is getting.

(Qur’an 7:80-84) But actually I dont think it matters much. Its all about interpretation anyway and when you have speakers ans imams etc preaching poison (and yeeees fundamentalist Christians have been known to do this too). There will always be those ready to pick up the gun / strap on the explosives. .

So when OJ said something like (sorry can't remember the exact words) ""the killer was motivated by a twisted interpretation of Islam" he wasn't being a terrorist apologist after all?

So when OJ said something like (sorry can't remember the exact words) ""the killer was motivated by a twisted interpretation of Islam" he wasn't being a terrorist apologist after all?

He's saying that the terrorists aren't like the people he shares platforms with, whose Islam is not twisted. Even though they want to kill, say, British novelists, or (like his friend Mehdi Hassan) think that non-Muslims are uneducated cattle.

I find it interesting that nobody is prepared to answer my question "Is "kill all homosexuals" a central tenet of the Islamic faith?"

Well, it's not I'd presume (disclaimer, I do t have intimate knowledge of Islam or the Quran).

Did you actually genuinely not know? Or is it that thing you do where you chuck ridiculous 'questions' in to have your 'haha!' moment & 'catch people out'?

Oh, and supersoft answered you at 8:28, a full 32 minutes before you posted about 'finding it interesting that nobody is prepared to answer you'.

Totally agree with TheNewStatesmans response. Straw men piling up indeed.

Of course kill all homosexuals a central tenet of Islam. Nobody has even hinted it might be.

What a bizarre debate.

On one hand, trying to direct anger at the American religious right because they are anti gay marriage, whilst simultaneously trying to defend Islam because most of them aren't murderers.

Oh blimey. Missed out a very important word! Of course kill all homosexuals ISN'T...

"Did you actually genuinely not know? Or is it that thing you do where you chuck ridiculous 'questions' in to have your 'haha!' moment & 'catch people out'?"

Nope. I know the answer. The problem is that if anyone says "But that isn't what Muslims believe" they are instantly called "terrorists apologists".

I do think Owen was childish and unprofessional acting as he did.

However, all the squabbling over which is 'more important' leaves me cold.

It was an attack on the LGBT community, carried out by a nasty piece of work nutter, who used Islam as his 'reason'.

I think there's a very large probability he'd have done it regardless.

The discussion required (in my mind) is yet again about America's lack of gun control.

And if a Christian had gunned down a club full of gay people, nobody would be blaming Christinaity or Christians in general.

"was an attack on the LGBT community, carried out by a nasty piece of work nutter, who used Islam as his 'reason'.

I think there's a very large probability he'd have done it regardless."

Absolutely

And if a Christian had gunned down a club full of gay people, nobody would be blaming Christinaity or Christians in general.

No, they'd just content themselves with blame the "American Right" in general. What, all of them?

The reason Islam is even in the mix is because ISIS claimed responsibility & he'd already been investigated for possible terrorist links Bertrand.

Are you being deliberately obtuse?

The Islamic Hadith is a collection of sayings attributed to Muhammad and discuss sexual intercourse between males. In relation to homosexuality it says:
"When a man mounts another man, the throne of God shakes.",
"Kill the one that is doing it and also kill the one that it is being done to."

He did it in the name of his religion. His religion isn't like his hair colour. It is central to his actions. And he allied himself with a real terrorist organisation who are a credible threat globally.

So peachpudding rather appears to nail it, would you not say, Bertrand?

I wonder how Corbyn is going to explain this the next time he's appearing on gay-hating Russian TV stations or gay-killing Iranian TV stations? Similarly Livingstone? If the British left don't like people who murder gays, why do they take money from people who are mad keen on it?

If it's true that this was the work of a person extremely confused (violently confused) in his sexual identity - with a history of terrorising women - then I think it is clear that he needed access to psychological intervention, positive models of sexuality and masculinity, NOT firearms.

Unfortunately, it would seem he lived in a country where it was easier for his murderous rage to be normalised (hatred of LBGT people and beating up women is not enough to get you flagged up as a risk to society) and expressed, rather than flagged up as aberrant and treated.

The thing is, he was on a site which had a "kill list" and supported lone wolf attacks. I'm sure the guy was unstable to say the least, but he was encouraged by religious extremists to take his hatred to an unspeakable level.

Interestingly, Telegraph reports today that perpetrator was on a gay dating app. I don't know whether that was for some perverted research for his crime or whether he had self-loathing.

Man speaks out against homophobia, but appearing on homophobic TV station.

Bertrand, totally unrelated to thread and you don't have to answer obviously - are you a teacher?

It's just dawned on me that you do the thing that teachers do where they ask a series of open questions to try and lead people to a conclusion, rather than just flat out stating the answer or conclusion.

I really don't mean that in a snotty way, honestly, it just struck me today is all.

Why do you want to ignore LGBT hate everywhere and only discuss Islam? You seem to be doing what people are worried about. Only making it about Islam and ignoring the massive LGBT hate out there.

Why do you sidestep every link between Islam and murderous homophobia and head off on some tangent instead?