To think Owen Jones is childish

[sandrabedminster]

Owen Jones storms off sky news

I don't even get what his issue is, he's invited on to discuss the headlines and then runs off as he doesn't like how much attention the biggest story is getting.

[supersoftcuddlytoys]

Not only Saudi. All Muslim countries reflect each other, in that - freedom of speech doesn't exist and the treatment of women and gay people is utterly abhorrent, in all of them.

[Tabsicle]

I thought he claimed allegiance to three different terrorist organizations which are currently at war with each other and also picked up men via gay apps? He sounds more like a very unhappy man trying to attach himself to any cause, no matter how little he knew about it, that would help him wipe out the parts of himself he couldn't deal with.

[AlPacinosHooHaa]

The American killing very similar IMO to many of the mass shooting style killings which take place regularly in the USA.



^^ On that I agree but ISIS is a religion and it shares the same strand of Islam with Saudi. Saudi the uber rich nation pumping out this Safli strain round the world......we see it seeping everywhere. We must address it!

[AlPacinosHooHaa]

Has anyone seen that sketch,

I am a Muslim, I kill in the name of Allah according to the Quran etc but they still dont think I am muslim etc?

I think rather like Baron Munchhausen syndrome by proxy some posters get their nuts off by saying what I consider to be quite rude things like
" slightly brown, or forriners....." Maybe they are closest racist, or have to do it to feel morally superior...who knows but I find it odd as they are the ones who assume things that are not there, and write such dodgy things.

Anyway in this case I think we can safely say there seems to be strong ties to Islam.

[MangoMoon]

Reading your own agenda into any of my posts too.

I am perfectly able to distinguish between 'a Muslim' & a nutter who murders & maims people whilst claiming it to be in the name of Islam.

[ForHarry]

If you are including my post then you are reading your own agenda into it.

[iniquity]

I'm not implying ISIS is a religion, quite the opposite in fact, they kill more Muslims than anyone else.
Sadly on this thread people seem to be saying look what these muslins are doing, why aren't we discussing the problem about Islam/Muslims.

What I'm saying is they may have watched similar videos online, who knows.
The real influences behind the attacks probably are closely related to the culture and experiences from their respective parts of the world.
The American killing very similar IMO to many of the mass shooting style killings which take place regularly in the USA.

The increasing attacks in France from Beurs is a different issue. You would have to understand the history and culture of the region to get an idea where this new wave of anger is coming from.

[BertrandRussell]

"sound like a religious war" - its not a religious war we have declared but it is a bunch of religious nutters who have cells, followers and sympathizers all over the world. And they hate the West and all that (they think) it stands for and they want to attack it"

Agreed.

But I do have concerns that every time a Muslim- or even a slightly brown person- does something evil, the immediate assumption is that they are doing it in the name of that religious war.

[ForHarry]

Iniquity :why read into my statement that I think there is a religious war? I think that's a jump to make and implies IsIs is a religion.

[MangoMoon]

Agree Helmet.

[Helmetbymidnight]

See, that attitude I find confounding and really, really bizarre. I can't see what it serves you to deny that they both claim ISIS and they both have been claimed by ISIS.

But you don't think it's relevant? We shouldn't talk about it?

We're not "making it sound like a religious war" - its not a religious war we have declared but it is a bunch of religious nutters who have cells, followers and sympathizers all over the world. And they hate the West and all that (they think) it stands for and they want to attack it.

Your failure to acknowledge even that is ridiculous.

[iniquity]

I doubt the American killer and the French killer had very much in common other than perhaps a similar delusion.
Making it sound like a religious war will not benefit anyone.

[ForHarry]

Sadly not random.

There is a pattern of Isis inspired lone wolves. See the horrible murders in Paris yesterday.

[derxa]

He sounds like a random nutter to me Not really.

[supersoftcuddlytoys]

"Random"? sounds like a specific sort of nutter to me.

[AlPacinosHooHaa]

It is a gun crisis there in the states.


If they dont want to give up their guns why not have far stricter controls. This man was already on FBI wanted list, as person of interest

why not control it?

Of course people in the EU also have far easier access to guns now don't they...I expect to see a rise in this sort of crime there too.

[AlPacinosHooHaa]

thats interesting I cant wade through all the reports, what groups are they ?

[MangoMoon]

Agree, it's the easy access to a gun that makes the random nutter way more deadly on a larger scale.

It's just so bloody pointless, wasteful & soul destroying.

Yet another load of people picked off - and for what?

It's just so bloody sad.

[StrangeLookingParasite]

I was directly accused of not giving a fuck about violence against LGBT people here on the thread.

Heh, Morris, that was actually me, but I won't fight you for it, being equally disgusted.

[BertrandRussell]

He did. But he also said he was allied to another two completely different groups. He sounds like a random nutter to me. And this being America- a random nutter with a gun.

[MangoMoon]

Probably more likely to be linked with Islamic terrorists when the person doing it says themselves that it is in the name of ISIS/Islam though.

Which he did.

[BertrandRussell]

And any random gunman-(how many massacres in the US in the last year?) by a Muslim or by somebody who looks a bit brown will be blamed on Islamic terrorists........

[AlPacinosHooHaa]

Do we actually know that him being a Muslim was specifically relevant?

Well his family hail from Afghanistan, whats that countries attitude to Gay people? Whats his culture, his back ground? States, yes, but his father his mother> Has his father said anything in the aftermath .

what is Islams policy towards gay people? etc etc etc This guy was muslim and went to saudi, again what is saudi form of Islam> how does Saudi treat gay people? and so on.

I think then we may get an idea of its relevance.

[Helmetbymidnight]

yes, I agree that it looks like this was an attack by an individual who then gave 'ISIS' as a reason - but that's where we are now - these twats aren't needing ISIS organisation and direction anymore, they are self-directing.

The leaders of ISIS don't need to do anything: they can just sit back and watch disaffected young men the world over decide to murder on their behalf.
It's horrific.

[Justanotherlurker]

TBF helmet, he did also say the Tsarnaevs were the other "groups" he swore allegiance to.

I think the more that comes out this wasn't an ISIS lone wolf attack, this was an attack by an individual who then gave 'ISIS' as a reason, something that anyone could do, no matter what the level of connection they have with that group, that isn't to say his religion and messed up family didn't play a part, he did go to Saudi a couple of times etc