To think that smoking in a cafe garden is selfish?

[cupkakesandkittens]

I was in a cafe for lunch earlier, beautiful weather so sat in the garden at the back to eat, and there were a few people smoking as they ate/drank.
I understand that it's an outdoor space, and it's legal, but to smoke in such close proximity to other people who are enjoying a meal, is just selfish.
I also understand that I could have sat inside, but I didn't want to sit inside on such a nice day.
It just really irritates me, can they not last 30 mins or an hour without a fag?

YABU - if you don't like it, eat inside.

I don't think it's as simple as saying smokers don't need to smoke. It is an addiction so sadly yes they do need to.

I don't like smoking, Ds is a severe asthmatic who is triggered by smoke but I think it's unrealistic to expect people not to smoke in a smoking area,

Haven't rtft but when I was a smoker I would consider who was around before lighting up. If I was in a busy cafe/pub garden where no-one else was smoking, or I was near children or elderly people then I wouldn't smoke. I just think it is common courtesy to not inflict it on other people; their right to enjoy the outdoors without passive smoking trumped my right to smoke. It is frustrating when you are addicted and a rollie would really add to your coffee/drink in the sun but I just wouldn't want to feel I was annoying other people!

Smokers have to stand outside in winter and nobody complains then... so why should they be restricted outside when its summer?

As over 80% of the adult popluation don't smoke and indoor public spaces are smoke free, it's not something most people experience anymore. Smoking has gone from being a normal part of most people's lives to being rare thing to experience for most people.

I suppose if you are part of the 18% of adults who are smokers and so are many of your family, then it might seem like 'normal' behaviour, but it really isn't anymore.

It's only rare if you're MC. Otherwise it's still very common. If you're WC and know 3 adults you probably know a smoker. Also the smokers who are left are far more heavily addicted than the average smoker was, back when smoking was common across social classes. That's why the drop in prevalence has slowed to a crawl. At current rates it'll take about 20 years for prevalence to reach 10%.

yabu

they are sharing their expensive smoke around for free. very definition of being unselfish

Smokers have to stand outside in winter and nobody complains then... so why should they be restricted outside when its summer?

For precisely the same reasons that they're restricted indoors at all times of year.

For precisely the same reasons that they're restricted indoors at all times of year.

But the reason the indoor smoking ban was brought in was because of the health risk of SHS in enclosed spaces. You can't make the same argument for outdoor smoking.

Yes Augusta

I've given up and the smell is both disgusting and enticing at the same time and gives me the rage and cravings at the same time.

YANBU

Wish they would ban it everywhere. The things are horrible, addictive, pernicious killers.

Ex smoker here. I like it because I can pretend I'm still a smoker and reminisce about my Parisienne cafe days. I sneakily try to inhale the smoke.
Op you don't like it. That's fine. But tough really. I don't like some perfumes, or the smell of some foods but it's not a big deal, I can live with it. You can't control everything.

I don't smoke, however I find those who complain about smokers more tedious/self absorbed/annoying than the smokers themselves.

YABU (and tedious)

But, Plenty, you can't say that outdoor smoking is without health risks.

And I come back to the issue of ordinary human consideration for other people. If you can avoid spoiling someone's meal just by waiting half an hour to light up, or by walking away, why not do it?

I find those who complain about smokers more tedious/self absorbed/annoying than the smokers themselves

I feel the same way, and I'm an ex smoker - aren't we supposed to be the worst for judging it?

And does anyone else wonder if, with the more deranged posts we always get on this subject, there's more going on than just a dislike of smoke? I can understand folk feeling especially strongly if they've perhaps lost someone to smoking, but is it possible that, in some cases, a strange urge to control has something to do with it?

'If you can avoid spoiling someone's meal just by waiting half an hour to light up, or by walking away, why not do it?'

Maybe they cannot wait half an hour. Maybe there's nowhere to walk to. Maybe they want to sit with their friends. Maybe the people around them don't consider their meal spoiled by outdoor smoking. Maybe it's not a meal at all, but a coffee or a pint.

But, Plenty, you can't say that outdoor smoking is without health risks.

Yes you can. Well, to clarify, you can't say anything is entirely without risk, but a bit of smoke drifting your way from someone else's fag in the great big outdoors poses so little risk it's not worth worrying about (unless you personally are especially susceptible for some reason, in which case it's in the same league as pollen, cats, dogs, peanuts, eggs ...).

The evidence on even indoor SHS is a lot flimsier than most people realise, and was not enough to convince the House of Lords that the smoking ban was being implemented for the reasons stated. There are some small risks to children who live with parents who smoke indoors all the time, and of course there is the SIDS risk if a parent smokes, but for adult non-smokers who live with an indoor smoker the best evidence we have is still this study. Over 118,000 non-smoking participants were followed for almost 4 decades. The study looked for differences between those who lived with smokers and those who didn't.

Conclusions: The results do not support a causal relation between environmental tobacco smoke and tobacco related mortality, although they do not rule out a small effect. The association between exposure to environmental tobacco smoke and coronary heart disease and lung cancer may be considerably weaker than generally believed.

So no, I don't think you can justify an outdoor ban on the health risks of SHS.

Auguasta-
And I come back to the issue of ordinary human consideration for other people. If you can avoid spoiling someone's meal just by waiting half an hour to light up, or by walking away, why not do it?
I have to endure stinking aftershave or perfume. So strong you can taste it . Very considerate

It seems that the militant smoking lobby is hijacking this thread and have outed themselves for being so selfish and harmful to others. For those that tell me (and my unashamedly militant anti-smoking views) and others to chill out/have a drink/fag and say that you will continue to promote your selfish agenda, well I'm afraid, the OP wins.

I'm gladdened to see that there are smokers on here who are considerate to others, who though they choose to poison themselves, also choose not to poison others. Thank you to them even if they think the OP or I ABU.

YANBU!!!!! If you want to wreck your body, at least make sure others can enjoy their time! I understand it's legal, but where other people are eating. That's really inconsiderate can't they at least do it on street or something??

Plenty - you do know that there is a pub house in the House of Lords that you can too this day smoke in. I know cause I clean it.

it is classed as a private venue

The ban does not carry there. Or to the other 20 other private clubs the House of Lords has.

Fat - It seems that the militant smoking lobby is hijacking this thread

Know someone started the thread asking if it was unreasonable. Some think so and some think not.

Jellied, yes I knew that.

fat - and my unashamedly militant anti-smoking views

Your views are not just 'anti-smoking', they are 'anti-smoker' (there is a difference) and some of your posts are really nasty.

This is a few years old now but is still worth a read. It's about the unintended harms that are caused when stigma is used as a tool to try to meet public health goals.

Read the whole report plenty of pubes, not just the brief summary. It is flawed, and limited. It was also funded by the US tobacco industry

This is like the evolution or environmental deniers. It is accepted science that smoking and passive smoking are harmful to health and increase your chance of getting cancer. I wish people would stop trying to justify their behaviour by saying otherwise.

I don't give two shits about people harming their own health except for me paying for their nhs treatment, but they don't need to harm others' health with such gay abandon. Common decency is all that is required.

fat what about the drinkers and the Do you mind paying for NHS treatment for them?