To take exception to the term 'mumtitlement'?

[MerchantofVenice]

I'm sure many people have spotted this rather insidious word popping up on recent threads. Personally I find it unpleasant and misogynistic. Depresses me that a number of people immediately piped up about how much they 'loved' the term as soon as it was coined. Bleurrgh.

Why do we hate mums so much?? If someone's being unreasonably demanding, then that's one thing... But to try and link selfish behaviour to 'being a mum'... Wtf?

I get the idea that there is this general feeling that mums are marching around being all 'entitled' and, you know, trying to carry on their lives without apologising for being alive. This desperate need to belittle the whole of mumkind every time one mum gets something a bit wrong is so bloody annoying! Ok, if someone is a twat, call them out on it... But using a term like 'mumtitled' is confrontational to all mums - as if twatishness is peculiar to them...

A lot of the time, the issues seem to be about what women 'should' be doing - should they be going there, should they be breastfeeding there, should they just clear out of the way with their offensive offspring so that more important people can get on with their lives in peace? Pisses me right off.

Anyone else?

I could understand everyone falling over each other to slag off mums if this were, say, chauvinisttwats.com or similar....but it's, you know, mumsnet...

UseNameHistory

You say I've 'conveniently ignored' or claases as non-sexist terms like mansplain and man flu. Not at all. If you read my previous posts you'll see that my main objection was women colluding in the use of the anti - female terms. I certainly never claimed the (very few) anti-male terms are not sexist (OBVIOUSLY they are) - but they are not gleefully thrown at men BY OTHER MEN.

I think the fact that some women do take the piss by dumping extra work on childless colleagues is a bit of a red herring here. Not denying it happens. Just suggesting that inventing a brand new judgemental term to beat women with is not a solution to a vety specific work-bases issue. We all know that the word is ripe for lobbing at the next woman who dares to feed her child in a public space that doesn't meet with everyone's approval. Honestly, every time there's a breastfeeding uproar you get plenty of bitchy women tutting about other women 'giving bf a bad name' and 'making a fuss'. Women have HAD to make a fuss, historically, just to get the same respect as men. As a PP said, bandying the term 'mumtitlement' around is just another way of saying 'hush ladies. '

It is depressing how many women are still so keen to explain away misogynistic language.

(Apologies for typos)

IABU to take exception to ' mumkind'?

Or did I leave the human race when I became a mother.

And FWIW I know exactly what is meant by 'mumtitlement'. I am delighted for you if you have never come across this.

I have a colleague who has a grown up child but only works half days because of her dog, who cannot be left more than 4 hours... Her husband leaves for work late, at 9, and she works 6-12, so the dog is only alone 9-1pm max. She has a special shift pattern and only she works it...

Dogtitled?

Actually she is very nice and nobody resents it afaik, though it raises the odd smile (she has covered for me 6-12 before when I have had no before school childcare, and I went in and just did 12-2 as she has to leave at 12 ... when I've covered for her I still work 6-2)

The thing is if people have a reason to request part time working or an early finish or Christmas off they are going to state that reason if they think it will help them make their case; "please would you cover for me as I cba to work any longer" is of course going to get short shrift, whereas "please could you cover for me as my after school child minder has flu/ my kid is ill/ my elderly parent has had a fall/ my husband has been in an accident/ my dog has been knocked over/ my car wouldn't start and I need to catch the last train/ bus home/ get a lift with somebody who can't stay late or else I will have to spend my full day's wage on a taxi" are all reasons.

The same with part time working - it is rational to consider part time working if somebody needs to work part time due to family responsibilities (to the very young or the very old or others who cannot manage alone due to health or disability) - it is not Mumtitled to ask to work part time because you have children but fine to ask to work part time because you have another caring responsibility or health problems of your own, and to think those extenuating circumstances are more worthy of consideration than "I fancy reducing my full time role to part time for no specific reason except that it would be nice and I can afford it"...

It isn't a special kind of entitlement which needs the label Mumtitled to be female and state an extenuating circumstance related to childcare/ children but fine and dandy to state an extenuating circumstance not involving ones own children/ fine if you are a man...

I don't love the word "mansplain" but at least "mansplain" is responding to a sexist behavior. "Manflu" to me seems to be much more murky.

I think manflu and mumtitlement are both on about the same level. Manflu is somewhat sexist because it is basically policing men's "weakness". Stop pretending to be sick, you big lump! I know, it's supposed to be about men pretending to be sick to get taken care of but given that men take many fewer sick days than women (even childless women), men are much less likely to go to the doctor than women for similar symptoms and there is ZERO scientific evidence for man flu except people feeling that their partners are "useless", it seems more likely to me that this is policing unmasculine behavior and a way of "encouraging" men to complain less about their health issues.

Labelling things "mumtitlement" seems like a good way to get women to shut up about the strains and stresses of being a mum.

But who are these women who ask colleagues to leave a wedding to come to their kid's birthday party? Are they even psychologically well? Mostly "mumtitlement" is going to be used to refer to women stating that they have a caring role in their life in a way that pisses someone without that role off. How very dare they!

And this bit about women "dumping" work on others or going p/t? It's a bit like the MIL issue. Nine times out of ten the real issue is not your MIL, it's your relationship with your dh. In this case, nine times out of ten, the real issue is not the "mumtitled" individual but the manager/corporate entity who is responsible for workflow planning in your job. Take it up with them. It's playing into the hands of those who have no time for women at work in any capacity (be they women or be they men) to make it about the woman asking or being pissed off when they don't get something. It's a management issue, not an issue with "mums". Your hierarchy is wonky if you're blaming women who have produced or become responsible for child progeny for this stuff.

And yes, now I've seen the post about the wedding - no one who kicks up a fuss about anyone taking time off for a wedding (unless your dh is doing a Liz Taylor in a shorter time frame and is on his eighth wedding in as many years) is doing so because they are "mumtitled". They are doing so because they have serious issues.

Exactly fusion - too often the message is that if women have children they should act like old school men who have children (i.e. as if they don't have them at all beyond their role to fill a desk top photo frame) or get out of the workplace (or any public space) and back into the kitchen if they can't carry on exactly as they did when childless!

And yet the use of 'bitchy', it would seem, is ok?

Who said "bitchy" is ok Flo?

I like it. Especially for those who take pleasure in misusing facilities provided for disabled people because they're a mum don't you know.

Bastard? Male equivalent of bitch.

What about non-disabled mums using disabled parking spaces because the parent and child ones are taken? I don't think you can explain that as a mum just wanting to do the best for her family.
I've got several child free friends and on their behalf I get fed up with some parents who think they are far more important because they've reproduced.

That's what I mean. Plus non disabled parents in wheelchair bay refusing to fold, families using the disabled unit specially equipped with hoist etc in the swimming pool (instead of family cubicle), misuse of disabled (not accessible) loos...

I agree with OP but also I must say I've seen quite a lot of disrespect to women and mothers recently. I wouldn't know but my mum said when I was younger (I'm in thirties) there was a nice atmosphere between parents. Now it seems there's one puma ship & parents liking to see whose kid is the best behaved and who has the best pram etc . Anyone else find this?

Recently I parked on the top of a multi storey car with my young son. There was no prentice parking left available, there was some disabled bays but I didn't use them. The attendant came over to me and told me I should have parked in the disabled bay as there was no parent Parking left. I didn't as I don't think it's fair but that's what I was told.

OP I love you for starting this thread. You are bang on.

I love MN but the lazy, drone-like repetition of 'entitled!' whenever a woman raises a bat squeak of protest or dissatisfaction with the shitty, woman-hating, child-hating society men have built for themselves makes me want to slap people, quite frankly (unsisterly I know).

I've hung around with people who are mothers all my life and I've never once seen someone seek to justify shitty behaviour purely with reference to her kids. Heard accounts of it on Mn yes - seen it with my own eyes, nope. Seen women accused of being 'entitled' because she hasn't fully tugged her forelock and apologised for reproducing: thousands of times.

OP - I agree so wholeheartedly that I have just reset my password after about 5 years of lurking so that I can tell you so!

It is depressing realising that any attempt whatsoever to acknowledge the reality that motherhood does change life somewhat will inevitably be met sooner or later with the use of this term, and we will all have to carefully police every single thing we say to ensure that at no point do we dare express an opinion informed by having children just in case...

So no - YANBU!

Who said "bitchy" is ok Flo?
The op uses it up the page: you get plenty of bitchy women tutting

It's in the same post post where she despairs of women 'who explain away misogynist language.'

I've not seen a single person challenge it.

I agree that I think it's policing female behaviour - could it be a class thing too? that 'certain types of mums' are mumtitled? people are so class obsessed, more so than when I was a kid (the Am I Middle Class agonising and stereotyping that goes on). As an English mum living in Holland I have to say that everyone here is a LOT more relaxed about parents/children. You don't get this sort of labeling. Perhaps because everything is more child oriented, I don't know.

And yabu it's annoying as hell. So many names for everything we do.

I mean YANBU God it's late

YANBU. I've never met anyone whose behaviour would make even the concept of 'mumtitlement' cross my mind. Becoming a parent knocked me for six, the sense that this small helpless baby completely depends on me fighting her corner whenever necessary. If another mum seems a bit forceful in making sure she has what she and her offspring needs including getting the perfect coffee or whatever I think fair enough. It is really hard being a mum. All women deserve a break from being judged constantly - but women who are mums do in particular.