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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Babies in travel systems

430 replies

Excusemeforpostinghere · 11/05/2016 08:03

Am I bu that I just get the rage when I see babies in carseats clunked to the pram?

Am I being a judgypants?

Fair enough on the nip in & out jobs like school run.

But supermarket? Theme park? National trust gardens? Running? Town? Zoo? Places were the child is likely going to have been in that carseat for a few hours!

They've already been in it for the car journey. I bet likely, some will only be out of them all day for feeding time.

I watched holiday supersavers last night and the baby did the walk to supermarket, around supermarket and walk nack home again in the flippin carseat!

I just want to go up to them and tell them to stop being lazy and think of their child's spine development.

OP posts:
NeedsAsockamnesty · 11/05/2016 10:45

Tbh, I don't like the infant seats in general. Baby in the back of the car, with restricted airway

It tends to be far preferable to baby through the windscreen all mashed up

Butterchunks · 11/05/2016 10:46

OP, you seem to be assuming that you are the only parent who has "researched" this issue (and by researched I mean googled). Do you think that no-one else bothered looking into the safety aspects of carseats prior to purchasing them? Do you have any formal education when it comes to finding, reading, and understanding published research?

Only1scoop · 11/05/2016 10:46

Quite Pregnant

The Op dreams up that if we use carriers we are so negligent and uninformed that we probably buy them for 2.50 on EBay.

AuntDotsie · 11/05/2016 10:59

Fuck me, how ever did my DS survive to 11 months?! And him having a beautiful spine, great balance and adequate lung capacity too.

I'm shocked, shocked I say, based on the quality of evidence presented here, that he isn't a wheezing hunchback since I was so irresponsible to pop him in a car seat travel system when he was younger.

We're taking him the zoo, yes the zoo, the zoo, for his first birthday in a month too.

JassyRadlett · 11/05/2016 11:05

jassey just buy a pram suitable from birth in the 1st place?

Yes, most folk do. That's not what you suggested though - you suggested that if people found themselves with babies for whom lying flat was a real problem, then they purchase a pram that was specifically suitable for newborns but that could also be inclined. Which suggests a double pram purchase.

That said, I'm not sure how much better for an infant an inclined back on a pushchair is than a car seat. There's a reason carrycots are recommended for as long as they are.

Mumandmummer · 11/05/2016 11:08

What a dull life you must lead, having time to be this concerned about other people.

Only1scoop · 11/05/2016 11:09

Yes Op some of us probably bought prams.....

And car seat carriersShock

arghhythu · 11/05/2016 11:15

Don't tell me how to raise my baby you sanctimonious cow.

BiscuitGrin

Squegg · 11/05/2016 11:32

Lily I missed the memo explaining that all parenting rules are set by you. Fuck off.

JassyRadlett · 11/05/2016 11:34

Quoting from one of those links:

Although there was no direct link found between sleeping in the child car seat and Lily's death, studies published on medical website Pediatrics have found that, because of restricted airways, oxygen saturation levels (the amount of oxygen in your blood) are lower when children are in child car seats. The average oxygen saturation level declined to 95.7% when a child spent 60 minutes in a child car seat, as opposed to 97.9% in a cot bed, with the lowest average level being 83.6%. Doctors have said that these levels do not pose an immediate risk, but are a good reason not to use a child car seat for anything other than travel.

The study quoted in the final link was on 8 day old babies - does anyone know if there's anything around on older babies? I suspect most people behave differently with an 8 day old and a 3 month old (and are more likely to be undertaking long car journeys / whiling away several hours in the comforting ambience of the supermarket with an older baby that with a cluster feeding very newborn).

Artandco · 11/05/2016 11:52

Jassy - they think it's the same with all babies, but risk reduced as they grow as they can support heads better and so less likely heads/ necks bent foward.
Like many sids the evidence is slim as they can't 100% that was the cause as unless they scanned baby literally just before they couldn't have known if they would have died anyway in diffenent circumstances.
It's like those who die of sids in cot. They think now it's safer to have baby sleeping near you as it regulates their breathing rather than sleeping alone. However they can't definatley say a baby who slept in cot with safe blankets and air space but who died from sids in own room, whether then sleeping in same room would have prevented or not. Mainly it's a case of being able to resuscitate quicker if near you so brought back in comparison.

I think it's just one of those things. Car seats in themselves are great. They save life's no doubtable. However they really are for that, the car and impacts. So the risk of being in car seat in a moving car outweighs the oxygen desaturation risks by miles, as let's face it babies wouldn't survive car crashes often otherwise. But outside of car, walking/ sleeping/ moving baby the car seat has no benefits on life safety, but do have several negatives ie oxygen/ spine/ flat head etc. So a higher risk

People need to decide what level of risk they want to take, and consider how to reduce it.

TheEagle · 11/05/2016 11:54

People need to decide what level of risk they want to take, and consider how to reduce it

This^^

JassyRadlett · 11/05/2016 11:59

People need to decide what level of risk they want to take, and consider how to reduce it.

I totally agree with this statement. I disagree with the OP's approach, though.

TheEagle · 11/05/2016 12:01

It's the OP's attitude that's annoying rather than the actual topic I think

RainyMornings · 11/05/2016 12:06

As a HCP I personally will be trying my best to stop my baby from sleeping or being in their car seat for longer than absolutely neccesary. This is after being part of two (failed) separate resuscitation attempts on babies who were left in their seats for 2.5 and about 3 hours respectively.
It's so easy to go out for lunch and then they're asleep so you leave them just while you put the washing on and quickly make the beds and it's been a few hours before you know it.

BUT the beauty of being an adult is that we can all make our own informed choices in life about what to do with our kids and ourselves so the OP is being unreasonable with their judgey pants very much on.

Just to say I will also be doing other crazy things that only paediatric HCPs would ever worry about that would never happen, like having my coat on ready to go to a&e the first time it has eggs Grin

DeadGood · 11/05/2016 12:42

OP, the fact is that many aspects of life carry an element of risk. I could say "AIBU to get the rage when I see people with babies in their cars? They could have an accident." I could choose to never take my child in a car at all.
But you have to live your life and weigh up the risks.

SovietKitsch · 11/05/2016 12:45

It's the SIDS risk that put me off using the car seat on the pram, have to say I'm surprised people still effectively use the car seat as the pram seat these days given we now know the risks

MaisieDotes · 11/05/2016 13:14

like having my coat on ready to go to a&e the first time it has eggs grin

Wasn't there a mner who would drive to the hospital car park before introducing a new food when weaning her baby? I think it was one one of the pfb threads or maybe just a MN myth.

eagle I salute you. I have a 20 month old and a 3 month old atm. Twins must have been hardcore. I also have a 14yo but she doesn't need a buggy

OP I agree with PPs who say your argument has some validity but your attitude is irritating and goady.

NickyEds · 11/05/2016 13:53

Soviet What SIDS risk? The lullaby trust says that there a too few studies in the use of slings and car seats to determine an association.

The way I see it there are two ways in which using a travel system makes life easier for parents, they often fall asleep in the car so you don't have to wake them to transfer them into a pram and sometimes you can't fit a pram into the boot of your car but you can fit a chassis. I don't have a car so my two have only been in car seats infrequently but I have seen nothing on this thread to convince me that it's not safe to use your car seat as a buggy for short trips out.

All of the links seem a bit wooly to me. On oxygen saturation, the difference between saturation in car seats and hospital cribs was small and doctors said they posed no threat. One article was about a child who sadly died but the car seat was used for over night sleeping, not a trip round the supermarket. The studies all seem to say the same thing, don't let your baby sleep unsupervised for long periods.

Using this as a stick to beat other parents, to question if they care about their children is just mn at its worst.

TheEagle · 11/05/2016 14:48

Thanks maisie, toddler + newborn(s) is a tough combo isn't it!

They're 2.5 and 13mo now so we're not out of the woods yet Smile

Cake and Brew for us

Sleeprocks · 11/05/2016 15:07

The OP says her car seat is from birth to 4 years. Is there such a car seat? I thought the rules required all babies up to 9 months (with the now I-size rules coming into force this is even later - about 15 months) to be in rear-facing car seats. A 3 year old or 4 year old would need a forward facing seat. Hence 2 car seats I assume. Anything suitable for a 3 or 4 year old is not safe for a baby in the car.

NapQueen · 11/05/2016 15:09

Many many four year old son still rear face. My car seat rear faces to 25 kg so roughly 5yo.

MollyRedskirts · 11/05/2016 15:09

It's been well proven that the general public are terrible at risk assessment, often thinking that things are far more risky than they actually are, and vice versa.

It's also been proven that I have no tolerance for judgemental cunts and should anyone in my life presume to make assumptions based on a snapshot moment, they'll deeply regret it.

NerrSnerr · 11/05/2016 15:11

There are 0-4 car seats, they start rear facing and you can then turn them round. Some also convert to a booster seat don't they?

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