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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To be angry HR made this (relatively minor) assumption?

731 replies

SpaceCadet4000 · 16/04/2016 15:33

My DH and I got married last August. I made the decision to keep my surname and continue to use the title Ms. I don't mind if other people choose to change their name, but I personally am uncomfortable with the historical and gendered connotations of name changing. This have never been an issue- I just select the Ms box when filling in forms, and I don't shout about it to other people.

However, I have recently started a new job. On my second day I went for my induction with HR where they collected details about my next of kin (mentioned it was my husband as they needed the relationship stated), whether I wanted a pension, my NI number etc. All fairly innocuous, and actually very little form filling on my part, and certainly no disclosure of my title.

As I joined close to payday I received my pay check late through the post- it's addressed to Mrs Space Cadet. This suggests that the HR advisor has clearly assumed I'm a Mrs based on our conversation.

It's minor, and I assume fairly quick to rectify, but I feel really angry that someone else has made this decision about me. I'm no special snowflake, but I'm dismayed that my identity has been so casually undermined. The office culture is fairly conservative, so I also feel like I'll be judged as an SJW for asking for it to be changed.

AIBU to just email them and ask for it to be changed?

OP posts:
LikeDylanInTheMovies · 18/04/2016 13:47

Yes Bo as I've said on my very first post on this thread and several times since.

I have no interest in what you have to say either so we're even Stephens. But who's shutting down debate now?

BertrandRussell · 18/04/2016 13:48

i'm not castigating or putting down. It doesn't help the discussion to throw allegations like that about.

MrsBoDuke · 18/04/2016 13:49

I am not shutting down any debate on the subject Dylan, just making the point that your opinion on this has no relevance to me.

AppleSetsSail · 18/04/2016 13:49

Obviously you have a perfect right to call yourself Mrs if you want to,. But. If you do, you have to do it in the knowledge that you are helping to prop up old fashioned views about women and their place in society and their worth. It's shit- but it's true. You're perfectly free to make the choice that you feel is right for you, but you have to accept that it might not be the choice that is right for women as a whole.

Do you feel the same way about women who wear makeup? Which is essentially mimicry of youth, fertility and the physical attributes that men find attractive in women.

Of course, women might wear makeup because they like the way it looks, but you could call this is an unexamined preference.

HarlotBronte · 18/04/2016 13:50

Quite, bertrand. The problem is with people making assumptions that an assessment of the impact of one's choices on others necessarily amounts to a criticism.

LikeDylanInTheMovies · 18/04/2016 13:51

As I say Bo likewise.

OneMagnumisneverenough · 18/04/2016 13:54

there can be no gainsaying the fact that the free choices of other women stop me from having mine.

the women who choose to change their names are actually making it harder for me to have my free choice

Maybe I think that the choice you make has an effect on me, that doesn't give me right to stop you making your choice either or blame you for it. Maybe I have inferred more than you meant given the points that had already been made and if so I apologise.

ElanoraHeights · 18/04/2016 13:55

That is, that you are perpetuating and reinforcing the idea that a woman who chooses to be Mrs as an adult female (married or otherwise) is only trying to advertise their marital status.

What other reason is there for changing your title to 'Mrs'?

MrsBoDuke · 18/04/2016 13:59

I am too old to be 'Miss', as an adult female I am 'Mrs'.

What reason is there for changing your title to 'Ms'?

HarlotBronte · 18/04/2016 14:02

Apology accepted onemagnum and no worries. I thought I'd been clear in my post, but just in case I'll restate. I want a neutral term equivalent to Mr with no connotations, and that can't happen while other women use Mrs because while we have multiple terms, none will be neutral. However I wouldn't seek to stop them from doing it, because I think adults should have the right to call themselves what they like. Interference with that personal freedom would be unacceptable to me.

lorelei9here · 18/04/2016 14:06

Harlot and Bertrand - yy to all your posts.

BoDuke - I am so confused by what you say. If all these brilliant posters haven't got you to understand Ms, I won't even try.

props to those who can bear to carry on making the point.

MrsBoDuke · 18/04/2016 14:10

BoDuke - I am so confused by what you say. If all these brilliant posters haven't got you to understand Ms, I won't even try.

Was a reply to this, from Eleanora:

...a woman who chooses to be Mrs as an adult female (married or otherwise) is only trying to advertise their marital status.

What other reason is there for changing your title to 'Mrs'?

I don't understand what is confusing you.

OneMagnumisneverenough · 18/04/2016 14:13

I actually think that all this choosing, deciding and insisting actually makes it worse as it implies titles matter and I don't think they do, they are an irrelevancy. It's a distraction from actually just seeing that people are treated fairly regardless of any other factors. I appreciate that others see it as a key fight though.

I use Mrs as I hate Ms for reasons I've already given, I felt too old at 29 when I got married to be a Miss so I became a Mrs as and when I am required to state a title. I am happy to be married and I changed my name as I wasn't that bothered about my existing surname and I like us all to have the same one as a family. DH would have changed to mine if I'd asked. His is rarer than mine though. We both wear wedding rings. I've never encountered any bias to single or married women or indeed to women at all. maybe I'm just lucky.

ElanoraHeights · 18/04/2016 14:18

I actually think that all this choosing, deciding and insisting actually makes it worse as it implies titles matter and I don't think they do, they are an irrelevancy.

A number of people are saying that titles are an irrelevancy while at the same time saying that they prefer to be called 'Mrs'.

If it's such an irrelevancy, why change it in the first place? I don't like 'Ms' either but I use it because of the principle that there is no equivalent Miss/Mrs differentiation in use for men.

What do those who have change their title to Mrs think of there being no equivalent for men?

Maybe we should make something up for married men....

OneMagnumisneverenough · 18/04/2016 14:26

I prefer to be called by my name but software models for most things require the input of a title, so where I have to, I will use Mrs. If I wasn't forced into using a title I wouldn't bother with one at all. I changed it as I didn't want to be a Miss any more and I didn't like Ms.

I don't care that there is no equivalent for men, that's up to them to fight for more choice if they feel the need but I suspect that they actually don't care one way or another.

I don't think men care what titles people use or read anything into it.

Maybe we should feel sorry for them not being able to choose? Wink

TeatimeForTheSoul · 18/04/2016 14:26

Onemagnum really, no sexism?
Have you never had a mechanic/plumber/technician come up and side step you to talk to a male person with you? I have frequently. I love the look on their faces when supportive DH or male students cut in with 'no idea why you are talking to me, you need to talk to her'. One tech I was waiting for actually got me to step out of the way so he could get to my male student. Why?
I suggest you google everydaysexism.

OneMagnumisneverenough · 18/04/2016 14:29

There is also form for women using Mrs even if they aren't married.

I'd be perfectly happy if we didn't have titles or if girls went from Miss to Mrs in the same way that boys go from Master to Mr.

ElanoraHeights · 18/04/2016 14:29

I don't think men should have another title - I only make the point that it's ridiculous that women change their title on marriage and men don't. There really is no good reason for women to change their title on marriage if men aren't going to in these days of (supposed) equality.

BertrandRussell · 18/04/2016 14:35

"There is also form for women using Mrs even if they aren't married."

Yes. And single women are given the title as a honorific. Because marriage confers status. Over a certain age, people tend to use Mrs if they don't know a woman's marital status-the implication being that there is an implied insult in Miss...........

OneMagnumisneverenough · 18/04/2016 14:36

No Teatime I've never encountered that but then I tend to take charge of all those things and I don't tend to take my DH with me to the garage - he knows less about cars than I do. We don't have a conventional set up though, well we do more now that the kids are older.

I tend to pay in restaurants/shops etc as I tend to carry my wallet with me whereas DH is a bit more scatter brained. I take charge of the family finances etc.

I really don't have any issues. I do however see lots of sexism aimed at my sons - maybe I would see the same if I had daughters though. In my family anyway, it's always been the woman that run everything. The boys have always tended to be really laid back.

OneMagnumisneverenough · 18/04/2016 14:38

But men do change their title on maturity so there is an equivalent of girls/woman not continuing to use Miss in the same way as boys stop being called Master.

BertrandRussell · 18/04/2016 14:41

Interesting that you say you "don't have a conventional set up"..................

BertrandRussell · 18/04/2016 14:43

"But men do change their title on maturity so there is an equivalent of girls/woman not continuing to use Miss in the same way as boys stop being called Master."

I don't think I have used Master in my entire life. Certainly my son has never been called it and he would be bemused if he was. But when it was used, you became Mr when you became an adult. Women remained Miss til marriage. So not even remotely equivalent.

MrsBoDuke · 18/04/2016 14:44

It is interesting.
It^^ is interesting that a lot of women who don't have a 'conventional set up' are not as vociferous about being called Ms.

BertrandRussell · 18/04/2016 14:44

" I do however see lots of sexism aimed at my sons "

Really? What sort of thing?

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