restraining children.....

[wannabehippyandcrazycatlover]

www.facebook.com/itvnews/videos/10153677541037672/

I've just seen this footage, and the comments are pretty disturbing claiming 'well if you're going to misbehave' etc.

AIBU to think you should never body slam a 12 year old?!

HP, the cop would have been trained to get her to the floor as quickly as possible. I doubt very much he intended to 'bodyslam', he just wanted her on the floor so he could cuff her and control her. DD goes to judo - she's a skinny 11 year old and I have watched her bring down a 15 stone 30 year old! (It's all in the hips apparently).

During riot training we were taught to get a leg/knee in between an aggressors legs to bring them to their knees, and then to use our body weight to push them from knees into the prone position. It's easy enough to do, but actually takes more time. The American technique seems more efficient to me.

When I read the news headline my gut reaction was - it's wrong.
Having seen the video I have backtracked now. There's not enough context but it did look like she was resisting pretty hard and trying to kick the officer. I suspect his thoughts were simply along the lines of sorting things out as quickly as possible. I don't like what happened, but I wasn't there, I don't know how threatened or otherwise the officer happened to have been feeling.

There are proper ways of restraining children. I'm trained to do so as I work in a school. I've never had to physically restrain someone and I do wonder if the time actually came if someone was really kicking off, if I'd remember to do it properly! However a police officer is in such situations frequently and really should be expected to stay collected and restrain a child without excessive force.

It was to much force and I say that as someone that's related to members of the Police here(in the UK)and they've said the same.

That child looked like she was knocked unconscious by the looks of it and that officer didn't even seem to notice.

But who goes in with riot techniques when called to a school to deal with a minor dispute between a teen and a member of staff, which is probably a typical call out in most police stations most weeks?

I have seen the UK police in action with stroppy and violent teens and they don't do this in the middle of the school day in ordinary schools, I can assure you! They would be looking for a much bigger threat to take action as well. They depend very heavily on their natural authority and good communication, and really really do use force at the end of that (which does not involve body slamming anyway precisely because you can't then control what the body hits on the way down).

Policing football and other public order events such as protests is very different, but again, there's evidence that disproportionate force actually makes the crowd more, not less violent.

America is different - there were lots of people around he would need to control the situation quickly as he wouldn't know if the others would join in -

We have no idea of her actions or known behaviour -

I would be appalled if my child got themselves into that situation - rather than the police actions

I'd hope they have more respect for the law - her parents will now be paying huge legal fees to sort her out!

If a teacher or a mental health worker "restrained" a child like that there would be an inquiry and they would most likely lose their job.

As lem said, there are approved ways to restrain children and it isn't unreasonable to expect the police to be 1) trained in the methods and 2) use them.

And 3) only use restraint when restraint is truly necessary, otherwise go for non-violent means.

If a stroppy teen refuses to get up and go to the headmaster's study, do you think the teachers all run in, body slam them, and knock them unconscious? Resisting authority is extremely common, this response to it is not.

I'm not convinced she was knocked unconscious, her leg is still moving, her shoulders tensed and her hand turns. But it is possible.

I don't think this is automatically a case of 'police brutality'. My personal belief is that the cop treated the girl as he would have any other violent subject, but overestimated the amount of force needed to bring her to the ground, which turned it into a 'bodyslam' rather than just a grounding. I could be wrong of course, but it's a viable explanation.

The girl seems pretty violent. She was suspended after the incident and her mother has stated that she had got into other fights at school leading to suspension - the school has said if she gets into yet another one she will be expelled and the mother fined. The girl said on the news that she didn't know why she was arrested or cuffed and is quite "poor me" about it, but the video clearly shows she resisted, so she needs to own that.

The police force have done the right thing suspending the officer and launching their own investigation. I hope the outcome has as much airtime as this incident.

HP, the cop was already there. Some American schools have them on the inside (so to speak) especially after previous violent encounters. The crowd was there ready to see a fight between this girl and another who had been 'saying bad things' about her (according to mum).

Yes, I agree that it's hard to see off this one snapshot, and it's very likely that this teen has issues. I don't think that makes an exceptional case though, there's probably a lot of children like this in pretty much every school in the land. I went to school with some quite violent and unpleasant characters, I don't remember the police ever being called into school, and if something like this had occurred, I think it would have made the national news as well.

So- do we want a school environment in which police are routinely stationed in schools and incidents are dealt with at this level of violence?

There is no evidence this makes teens or schools safer places, and for all the reasons I outlined above (based on the latest research), this doesn't have better outcomes in terms of de-escalating crowd/group violence.

In fact, a lot of things US policing and justice do are not supported by the research in producing a more pro-social, less violent society (e.g. very long prison sentences, using short sharp shock and boot camps for off the rails teens).

That's why I'm always so surprised everyone weighs in on here in their defense. But then I've noticed a massively conformist trend on here in which authorities are always right (school holidays, anyone?!)

Umm.... I dont know the ins and outs of what had happened but was it necessary to body slam one person who is relatively smaller and not as strong as you to over power them? by all means i get that they have to over power them physically but a body slam?! that thud she made when she hit the concrete made me shudder.

So- do we want a school environment in which police are routinely stationed in schools and incidents are dealt with at this level of violence?

God I hope not. But America is a whole other kettle of fish from the UK. Routine bodysearches, metal detectors on doors, kids bringing in knives, drugs and guns. If UK children start that up then I can see us having to follow suit.

The American police and Forces are far more heavy handed than ours - it's one of the reasons that the British Military is far better at Peacekeeping/UN duties than our American counterparts. But they are a product of their own legislation.

Wait I thought it was a police woman not a police man

Huh. I obviously mis read somewhere. It is a man.

I know it shouldn't make a difference but I would have thought a man could control a 12 year old a bit better than a female police officer

MrsDeVere
"This is a small, 12 year old female being manhandled by a large, adult male."

I don't often disagree with you but she isn't that small and he isn't that large.

What more information do you need

It's brutal force on a child from a grown man

Yea she might have been very difficult, vile even but that is no excuse for such violence police are expected to be able to deal with such situations but it's well documented how violent US police force often are when its not necessary

but it's well documented how violent US police force often are when its not necessary

And as an American she should know this!! I'm in the UK and know not to mess with US cops - and it onus is on the arrested to prove they aren't guilty not the other way round

In the uk I witnessed a very aggressive 13 year old girl decide that she wanted to walk straight through a taped off crime scene. When two police officers told her she couldn't she went WILD trying to get past them, clearly she thought being a young girl they wouldn't lay a finger on her. It took 3 officers (2 men and me) to restrain her, her strength kicking out was incredible. Just because she wanted to walk through a crime scene and was told no! Anyone watching would assume that 3 officers on this girl would be excessive but I can assure you that if anything an extra pair of hands would have been useful!
I see in that footage a single officer surrounded by teens trying to restrain one that is kicking off. The officer brought her to the ground in the best way he could under the circumstances which resulted in her hitting the ground harder than he probably wanted or anticipated. Don't judge until you've had to deal with similar.

And as an American she should know this!! I'm in the UK and know not to mess with US cops - and it onus is on the arrested to prove they aren't guilty not the other way round

Exactly

It was excessive, she had concussion afterwards. He didn't give her opportunity to calm down, there is a longer video, which shows he grabbed her and slamed her, rather than restraining her.

I saw this on FB, there's been a lot of violent incidences against children as young as seven, coincidently, they've all been black.

It's interesting that there was a video showing an Officer kick a man to the ground, who had full motor bike gear on (so he could be seen as threatening), yet all of the comments supported the White adult man who'd been assaulted.

Yet the comments are mostly a lot less positive about the black students that are assaulted and sometimes sexually assaulted by Officers (and ignored by fellow Officers/Staff).

Some of the US Police do seem to think that they are above the law, especially when it comes to female and black/minority 'suspects'.

American police and with all police should be able to handle difficult situations without using violence

Just because too many of them do doesn't mean that it should be acceptable

They are not living in a police state where police violence is accepted as a way to control the people into submission it's not Saudi

So we are saying that a 12 year old is responsible because she should know that the American police use excessive violence?

If the police response is considered reasonable and an appropriate use of force with a child and in front of other children, I'm not surprised that America is significantly more violent than here. Children learn how to live in society by watching and copying the adults in that society

Oh and I have had to restrain a 14 year old with ADHD in a rage. He was already taller and heavier than me, but I managed it and got him calmed down. If I can do it, a trained police officer shouldn't have any problem.