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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Son with older guy

129 replies

ninaneedshelp · 04/04/2016 19:12

Hi all, could do with an opinion or two.

I have two sons, one's 20 and at university and my other's 15, about to turn 16. Recently I found texts on youngest son's phone of a flirty nature from an older guy, this took me by surprise as he hasn't come out to me, but I did always wonder. What shocked me more was that the messages were from someone who sounded awfully familiar, turns out it's a friend of my eldest son that went to school with him.

Now the thread title may be assuming more, but either way, it seems they're quite close. I'm not cross and I love him to bits no matter what, I haven't spoken to him about it yet, but I'm wondering how to? Do I wait for him to come to me or do I sit him down and tell him that I know? If there are any members on here with gay children that have experienced this, your replies would be a great help. And AIBU to be a little worried that he's seeing this older boy? I really don't want to see him getting hurt, but maybe I should stay out of it and let him make his own mistakes? I just feel so conflicted on how to handle this!

OP posts:
Vintage45 · 04/04/2016 23:55

I do understand everyone above by the way.

Once you have a child you worry constantly about everything (I even worry that their toothbrushes may be out of date) I just wanted to highlight what actually does go on probably more from their point of view than ours. It's difficult to let go. Ive lived it so am coming from that perspective rather than on the precipice.

BreakfastLunchPasta · 04/04/2016 23:55

I have a 16 year old and I'd be pretty freaked out if she was seeing a 20 year old (male or female). She's my baby, I'm responsible for her safety and her physical and emotional well-being. She's not an adult yet or I wouldn't have to give her money for the bus and chips. She still needs protecting from the big bad world.
Just as a boy her age does.

I'd notice it if she got a text if her phone was in my sight because it shows up on the screen.

OP, you need to let him discuss his sexuality with you in his own time, for now discreetly make sure he knows your reaction would be gay-friendly.
Also, for now be protective about where he is, when he's coming home. If dd tells me she's having a sleepover at a friend's, it has to be a friend I'm familiar with and I am given their parent's number to check its all ok. If she's going out for the evening, she's to tell me who with and agree on a time to be home by. I'd be the same with a son if I had one.

My parents (who are lovely but were wrong in this) thought I wasn't a kid anymore when I was 15, lets just say it didn't work out very well for me.

Vintage45 · 04/04/2016 23:58

My parents were the opposite and also wrong Breakfast.

VashtaNerada · 05/04/2016 00:03

As others have said, the same-sex thing is a red herring, the real issue is an adult flirting with a child. When I was 20 I would have been horrified at the thought of a relationship with a 15 year old!

Vintage45 · 05/04/2016 00:07

15 nearly 16 and 20 is not such a gap in real terms. 15 and 30+ is.

Jw35 · 05/04/2016 00:20

Yep I'd be concerned. 15 is a child, a 15 and 20 year old is a big gap because the 15yo is a minor whereas the 20yo isn't. Couldn't give a stuff what passes as normal or ok in this day and age or what the stats are I wouldn't want my 15yo exchanging flirty messages with an adult. Personally I think 15 is also too young to know if he's gay or not also, plenty of time to work that one out. I fancied girls when I was at school and I'm not gay. I think it's very common to have strong feelings for either gender at that age. He may be gay he may not be. Either way he's too young for a relationship with anyone over the age of 18 IMO. I'd be having a word and finding out what's going on

Furtyferret · 05/04/2016 00:21

Adam Johnson is currently at the start of a 6+ year sentence, Jeremy Forrest was released from prison in 2015, after serving half of his 5+ year sentence.

Their victims were both 15 year old girls, both of whom in the eye of the law are deemed to be children & therefore unable to give consent. There isn't a difference, in the eyes of the law he is a child, & the 20 year old could be in just as much trouble as Johnson & Forrest, because he is an adult.

op, maybe just general chat, my son told me he was a-sexual during a chat about relationships, friendships ,& his friends getting "girlfriends" etc, he was 14 at the time.

herecomethepotatoes · 05/04/2016 06:41

I'm not sure how I'd approach the situation OP. I assume the other boy is 20 (the same age as your older son).

Have you had the safe-sex talk? Perhaps time for it / a refresher course. I don't think I'd broach his sexuality and there's no need for it. Safe sex is the same for gay / straight and all in between.

How mature is his older brother? Is he in a position to discuss it with him?

I wouldn't force him 'out' though. Just be there and ready for when he is.

For what it's worth, I wouldn't class what you did as snooping. I will absolutely (when mine are old enough to require it) know every single key stroke, mouse click, url viewed and sms sent ie. snoop. They'd only ever know if it was a life and death situation. It may mean needing to feign ignorance but sobeit.

To people who are saying they would be livid if you did it to them, he is a child. You are adults. Surely you know the difference.

acasualobserver · 05/04/2016 07:59

Adam Johnson is currently at the start of a 6+ year sentence, Jeremy Forrest was released from prison in 2015, after serving half of his 5+ year sentence.

Your comparisons are not good ones. Johnson's victim had just turned 15, the OP's son is about to turn 16. Forrest was the girl's teacher which, in law, makes his crime much more serious.

WhatTheActualFugg · 05/04/2016 10:04

When I was 15 my mum thought it was 'sweet' that my older brother's 20 year old friend wanted to take me out.

He took me out, let me get drunk, then tried to rape me.

Have the nice talk with your son, OP. Then call your eldest son, or the guy direct, and ask him to let this 'friend' know in no uncertain terms that what he is doing is not OK, it's illegal and if he doesn't stop pursuing your CHILD you'll be informing the police.

Your DS might soon be 16, but hopefully this will put the guy off long enough to move on to someone else.

No 20 year old adult should be finding a 15 year sexually attractive.

Who here at 20 wanted to have sex with a 15 year old? That would have made me feel quite sick.

differentnameforthis · 05/04/2016 10:18

Seems Im the only one who doesn't see the problem with the OP looking at her son's phone Nope...I check dd's, although she is 12, I'll still be doing it at 15! She knows that is the rule of having a phone/ipad etc.

What people need to remember is that this is a child, receiving messages from an adult...I can bet the if this were a 15yr old girl, those who have an issue with op seeing/checking the phone would be shouting grooming!!

15 is not a child. Bollox, of course it is.

LordoftheTits · 05/04/2016 10:21

I know it's slightly older but I was only just 17 when I started dating my friend's 22yo brother. We went out for three years and everything was totally above board. I wasn't taken advantage of - in fact, I asked him out and he was the virgin in the relationship when we first got together!

I agree that you should sound him out and see what's going on but it's not always as cut and dry as "adult sniffing around a child".

HazyMazy · 05/04/2016 10:27

I would wonder about his phone being left around if he knows you clean his room.

Is he v relaxed about it all so doesn't care who sees messages?
Is he hoping you might see messages?
Is he normally sloppy about stuff and would normally have phone hidden?

Bluelilies · 05/04/2016 10:29

Trouble is if you take the "15 is a child" view in this situation, it'll backfire in a few weeks time when the DS turns 16 and takes the "16 is an adult" line back at his mum.

The realitiy is that children do not become adults on a fixed date, whatever the law says. That's just not how growing up works, physically, emotionally or socially. 15 and 16 are both ages where many need a bit of support and guidance, but also need a bit of automonmy and privacy to form their own relationships. They're not the same as 12 year olds, and neither are they the same as 22 year olds. They're teenagers, in a state of semi-adulthood. And insisting on a right to snoop and see all mobile communication is not likely to be compatible with encouraging an open and trusting relationship with them.

The OP hasn't said her 15 year old is in a sexual relationship with an older partner - just that he's recieved at least one flirty text. There is a bit of a difference.

differentnameforthis · 05/04/2016 10:30

And really, does anyone actually think I would give a shit if my daughter "was angry" that I looked at her phone, if I saw on it was essentially grooming??

She'll live, her anger will fade & eventually she will realise that being in a sexual relationship with an adult, while still a child, is NOT appropriate.

The majority of 15 year olds are having sex however shocking it may seem. Are they? With adults? Some may be, with peers, but not many are having sex with adults, and if they are, they are not able to consent to it.

Are you of the mind that the girl who was abused by that footballer knew what she was doing? Because that is dangerously close to what you are saying...

differentnameforthis · 05/04/2016 10:32

Bluelilies 16 isn't an adult either.

Owllady · 05/04/2016 11:11

No, 16 isn't an adult either Confused

SuburbanRhonda · 05/04/2016 11:24

It's itrelevant what any adult on here thinks about reading someone else's texts. What matters is what the OP's DS thinks about it.

If he thinks you're likely to look again, he can easily change his settings so the message or even part of it is not displayed. He can also change contact names to something innocuous.

If we're dragging in cases that have been in the news, just remember things went downhill very fast indeed when Breck Bednar's mother forbade him to contact the man who was grooming him and eventually murdered him.

Bluelilies · 05/04/2016 11:30

16 year olds are adult in the sense of being allowed to have sex with anyone they want, of any age and it being none of their parents business. (unless they have an open, trusting and helpful relationship with their parent of course, and choose to tell them and listen to their advice)

cunningartificer · 05/04/2016 11:45

How close is your son to his elder brother? If he has confided in him about his sexuality, it is possible that he made the initial connection between his friend and his brother, as a way of giving him some support--he may not be aware that a closer relationship has developed (if it has). It would make sense to ask him did he know that X and DS were friends, and perhaps move conversation on that way.

TheNewStatesman · 05/04/2016 12:16

"Safe sex is the same for gay / straight and all in between."

Not exactly the same. When two people have anal intercourse, extra strong sheathes are generally recommended, and plenty of lube is a must. There are likely to be other things. It may be a good idea to look for some resources on safe sex for gay men. Of course, not all gay men have anal intercourse.

EnPapillot · 05/04/2016 12:39

When I was 16, I met a guy who was 20. We liked each other, there was a bit of interest but my dad wouldn't have been particularly accommodating so it didn't go any further. A couple of years later we met up again and now at 26 and 30 we're married with 2 children. Just making the point that an age gap might be ok later on.
Love that OP isn't concerned re gender of either party and more concerned re ages.
I don't think it's wrong of the OP to be checking the 15yr olds messages, but as explained previously she wasn't, enough messages came up to tell the story of the relationship.
I think I'd bring it up in the line of 'just wondered if there was anyone on the scene you might want to bring home; male, female or whoever else' and see what comes out. Ultimately OP, only you know what the relationship with your Ds is like and how he'll take your questioning, however gentle.

herecomethepotatoes · 05/04/2016 13:12

"Not exactly the same."

No, bums weren't designed for willies and need a little more prep. but the basic principles are the same. We're all adults and don't need to discuss details.

This seems to be a balancing act between forcing the OP's son out and giving him sensible, parental advice. The caveat "remember the KY and extra-strongs" may not be the best ending to an emotionally charged conversation.

BIWI · 05/04/2016 13:16

One thing that occurs to me, though, is that you say that your son knows the other boy. Does this not make a difference?

Without knowing what he texted your son, could it not just have been banter?

And if the boy knows you know him, surely he's less likely to be grooming your son?

Haffdonga · 05/04/2016 13:39

There was a thread on MN a while ago when a mum found her 15 year old dd was being sexted by a guy in his twenties. Another where a teenaged ds was texted in an over friendly way by an older man in his hobby group. The great majority of posters on both threads told the OPs they should report the men to the police in case they were grooming. Others insisted that all phone contact should be monitored to protect the children involved.

Yet here the OP is being castigated for seeing her ds's texts and told to let her son get on with it. MN is a funny place sometimes Confused

I wonder if people are so careful not to be homophobic that they are actually prepared to turn a blind eye to potential abuse? This is a vulnerable child . Vulnerable because he is a 15 year old in a relationship with an older guy, and without having openly discussed his sexuality there is more potential for holding risky information secret. Child because legally and emotionally at 15 that is what you are.