to drink on holiday with newly teetotal friends?

[cowardlylion99]

Several months ago we booked to go on our summer hols with close friends.

To be clear, DH & I could never be classed as heavy drinkers. Yes, we enjoy 3 or 4 drinks on Friday & Saturday nights. We don't tend to drink midweek unless it's a special occasion or we're on holiday! When on holiday we look forward to a few glasses of the local vino in the evenings. Until recently our friends had similar drinking habits to ours and we were looking forward to a few drinks on holiday. However, since booking the holiday, they have stopped drinking completely.

Must admit I was a bit surprised. I'm certain that if there was some hidden drink problem, health issue etc they would've told us and would know we'd be supportive. They're too old for it to be ttc/pregnancy related either. I did ask my friend why and she just shrugged and said she'd gone off it. Obviously, it's their choice but I do feel a little sad as I did enjoy having a few drinks with them (selfish I know). We've been out for dinner with them a couple of times since they went dry. My friend told us to feel free to go ahead and drink but it was said with a bit of a cat's bum face so we stopped at one as we felt a bit uncomfortable, plus it's not so much fun drinking when half the party are stone cold sober! We still see them regularly but during the day for coffee etc rather than the pub. I guess it's no biggie as we have other people we can go out drinking with, but the holiday......?!?

Would we be U to carry on as we would normally do and have a few drinks in the evenings while away? DH has said there's nfw he's not drinking for the whole of HIS holiday and I see his point but on the other hand I don't want to piss off a good friend. In addition to the cat's bum face, friend has been quite vocal on Facebook about the fact that she doesn't drink and got snippy with a fb friend who didn't realise she was now a non -drinker and tagged her (and others) in a jokey meme about drinking. I've not judged her for not drinking (well not outwardly!), but feel a bit judged myself and I'm hardly a raving alkie!

Oh well, maybe they'll fall off the wagon by summer......

I don't know anyone who doesn't drink.

Even saying that statement implies all my friends have a drink problem. They don't. We're all sociable drinkers who enjoy a few whenever the occasion arises. I'm looking forward to my wine tonight as I aim not to drink during the week. Even saying that sounds like I'm desperate. Maybe I am, maybe I'm not. It's just something my DH and I do on a Friday - share a bottle or two with a nice meal. Repeat on Saturday.

I think anyone who was blatantly disproving of anyone drinking wouldn't get very far in my social group and long may that continue!

I just don't understand why those who give up something just don't carry on life quietly without having to make announcements.

Even saying that statement implies all my friends have a drink problem.

I don't think it does it all!

I don't get really this 'all or nothing' mentality - I mean, fine if you don't want to drink, but most other people aren't actually getting trashed and blacking out every night.

They're in that happy medium zone, whereby they can enjoy a few drinks, not get drunk, and wake up feeling just like any other day.

This seems to be overlooked, judging by the many responses on this thread along the lines of, 'it's really nice to wake up the next morning without a hangover, and remembering what I did the night before'.

Yeah, it is, and that's also the experience of people who enjoy a few alcoholic drinks.

Rousette - that's us exactly!

Dowager - you've said what I wanted to say but SO much better!

Dowager - I'm one of the 'it's nice not to wake up with a hangover' poster because for me even a couple of drinks gets me drunk and gives me a hangover. Having been someone who drank alcohol and now who doesn't (might have a few in total across the year) there's been far more judging from people who still drink. It's impossible, it seems, to wind down or have a good time without a few drinks.

I.e. - people who drink.often express amazement at the fact I don't need a drink to have a good time/unwind. I felt like I am constantly justifying myself.

And that's not great, SirCh.

But, for example, it's Friday night here, and DH and I are sharing a bottle of wine.

My alarm will go off tomorrow at 6:30 for DS's football, and I'll get up just like any other morning, feeling just like I do any other morning.

For most of us who enjoy a bev or two, that's perfectly normal. It's probably why we enjoy it.

I just wonder if "drinkers" are naturally drawn towards other drinkers. I am wondering why I don't know anyone who doesn't drink!

I'm sure it is Dowager - but I was responding to your comments about us non drinkers implying that everyone who drinks is getting plastered. I don't think that at all and I'm not sure it's the case for many non drinkers. It's that alcohol doesn't agree with me. Judging on either side is a bit off.

Yes, I'm the same Dowager. Can drink a fair amount before it affects me next morning. Last hangover I had was at least 2 years ago after a wedding where we'd been drinking all day but that is a VERY rare occurrence. Most weeks I'm well below the recommended 14 units a week, only sharing a bottle of wine on Fridays & Saturdays. We're all difference - some of us can tolerate alcohol well, some can't, others can tolerate seafood/dairy/coffee well, some can't......

Dh and I don't drink. He doesn't drink at l, I maybe have a glass of bubbly every 6 months at a celebration or something. We both used to drink more regularly. Neither of us would care if whoever we were with was drinking, we might turn down an invitation if it was going to be a complete piss up cause tbh, they're tiresome and drunk people can be quite irritating. But that doesn't mean that the people having the piss up are in the wrong!

I have found it sad how many times we have either been excluded from groups of friends meeting up for dinner in a pub with their kids etc because we don't drink...they say they assume we won't be interested but in reality, it is because non drinkers, even non judgemental ones make them uncomfortable. Equally it is hotly infuriating the number of people who react incredulously as if it is an obscure lifestyle choice, or who pester for 'just the one', or 'come on, have some fun' etc etc.

In your circumstances I would happily drink as I would have done.

I just wonder if "drinkers" are naturally drawn towards other drinkers. I am wondering why I don't know anyone who doesn't drink!

Yes, I think we are! As I said in an earlier post (& got a bit flamed) I do tend to prefer people who like a drink (not pissheads ) and most of my friends drink at least a bit. I do feel even one drink relaxes me, allows me to open up and take a friendship to the next level (& I think that's true for many people if they're honest). I remember years ago I worked for a big company. There was a girl in another department who I had very few dealings with and found a bit scary tbh! Then came the Christmas party. At the end of the night there was a group up for going on elsewhere including this girl (found out it was usually the same people every time, they didn't necessarily work together but had something in common - they like a drink!). I tagged along and soon became part of that crowd and we collected many others over the years we worked there, some of whom became friends away from work. Years later I'm still close friends with scary girl but, if it weren't for the fact we both like a drink, I doubt we would’ve got to know each other.

Same thing with school mums. There are some I'll have coffee with and maybe even meet up with the kids in the holidays but it's the ones I've been out drinking with that I know much better are much closer friends.

Can relate to all of that, cowardly. Especially the school mum thing!

Op you asked if YABU to drink with your teetotal friends, to which the resounding response from a large majority of both drinkers and non drinkers is no, YANBU - go ahead and knock yourself out. It seems now like it's more like you're saying you don't actually want your non drinking friends to spend time with you on your holiday. Shallow, much? I bet you have an amazingly well formed cats bum face yourself. Sounds like your friendship is now incompatible and you should do the decent thing and go separate ways.

It seems now like it's more like you're saying you don't actually want your non drinking friends to spend time with you on your holiday. Shallow, much?

*cowardly's only saying this because of the disapproving vibe she's getting off her friend, who doesn't appear to want to spend time with them. So maybe the 'shallow, much?' comment should be directed to her friend...?

Eh? Someone asked why drinkers tend to be friends with drinkers and I said why I thought this was the case and that many of my friends I met through initially being drawn together on nights out. Doesn't mean I don't want to spend time with people who don't drink - we won't be pissing it up all day long, we just want to enjoy a couple if drinks in the evening without getting cats bummed!

Everything you have said op suggests you believe non drinkers are in some way inferior/ less interesting/ less fun and you even stated you'd rather spend time with other drinkers. So maybe you should.

Where on earth did I say I thought that Little lion? Yes, I enjoy a few drinks a couple of times a week but it is a VERY small part of my life, I enjoy sports, seeing new places, gardening, craft oh and hold down a good job. On holiday I intend to sightsee, swim, shop, jet ski (all preferably with DH and my friends), oh and have a nice meal in the evening with a couple of glasses of wine - SHAME ON ME.

OP "feel even one drink relaxes me, allows me to open up and take a friendship to the next level (& I think that's true for many people if they're honest)".

This is interesting, as someone who rarely drinks, I don't find one drink relaxing. One drink does nothing for me and sometimes two just makes me feel oddly tired and unwell.

So drink has no connection with me opening up to people, I either take to them or I don't. Now I'm wondering if people who find drinking such a big deal are feeling as you do. as I've said, my closest friends are big drinkers but I've always just thought they like it. Your description sounds like you need it in order to bond?

I really don't get this weird societal obsession with alcohol. Whether people choose to drink or not, why is it such a big thing? Do you feel the same about other food or drink groups?

I feel closer to someone after a night out perhaps, but because we have spent time together in a really informal setting, booze is irrelevant!

As I said before, we're all different e.g. I get nothing from smoking. Actually, I remember a lot of the smokers bonded when freezing their arses off outside! By no means have all my friendships developed over a drink, but a fair few certainly have. Of course there are some people who I may have bonded with on a night out but realised I don't like them half as much sober, but for the ones I do, it's certainly an icebreaker for me. Obviously I don't need a drink to feel relaxed with holiday friend (known them for years) but that is not the issue here. I enjoy a drink on holiday, I also enjoy jetskiing on holiday. If she was being disapproving about the fact we planned to do that I'd be feeling just as disappointed!

go ahead and knock yourself out

I'm also a bit confused why, as someone whose alcohol intake is consistently well below the recommended weekly amount, is being painted as a teetotal hating piss artist. All because I want to enjoy a couple of drinks in the evenings on holiday without feeling judged.

But that's not what I've said OP, if you look back I've said I totally understand you wanting to enjoy a few drinks on holiday - I'm the same (or would be if I wasn't pregnant!) It's your subsequent comments that lead me to think that although you may well be right about your cats bum faced friend, your own attitude is not exactly totally beyond reproach is it? You were surprised and sad about her decision in your op. You then use the anecdote of your mum's attitude towards those who don't drink and at 09.57 today you state, quite clearly I do tend to prefer people who like a drink. You seem very defensive and seem to think I'm having a go at you for liking a drink. I'm not. I like a drink too. I dislike your attitude to non drinkers, which has come across very heavily in your posts.

And the 'knock yourself out' comment was a turn of phrase meaning 'do what you like it's of no consequence to me' not a dig at your alcohol intake.

I've changed my view as well OP; I'm very live and let live but if you'd actually prefer somebody's company based on whether they have a drink or not then I'd say that the issue is yours, not theirs. You don't sound as tolerant in your subsequent posts. Many drinkers think that they're more amusing than they are - ditto non-drinkers.

Alcohol doesn't make you 'fun'. If you're not fun without it, you're not fun with it either.

Agree with LittleLionMansMummy and witsender and I HATE the way that non-drinkers/drinkers are a 'them and us' disparate grouping.

I am the only one in my family and friendship groups who doesn't drink.

I don't like wine. There are some liqueurs I quite like but I'm really not bothered so I usually have a soft drink.

No-one cares and I'm not excluded because of it. And I don't think I've missed out on getting to know anyone well because of it.

Hasn't spoiled any holidays either as far as I'm aware.