...to call my daughter beautiful?

[tangerino]

This is something I really struggle with. I'm a feminist. I want my daughter to grow up valuing herself for who she is, not her looks (as I imagine all mothers do, regardless of whether they identify as feminists). I keep reading things which say it's wrong to refer to a girl's looks, what they're wearing etc as it reinforces cultural ideas that this is what's important about them.

And yet...I find it physically impossible not to call my daughter beautiful (when taking to her, I mean). Obviously it's not the only thing I say about her- I also talk to her about her abilities, how hard she's tried with something, kind things she's done, whatever. But I do find that I call her beautiful a huge amount of the time- I just can't help it because I find her overwhelmingly lovely a lot of the time (I don't mean this in a "my daughter's a stunna" way, but rather that I just find her physically lovely as part of loving her, if that makes any sense).

Do other people find this tricky? Do you think it's harmful to girls to say too much positive stuff about their appearance? Am I overthinking it?

Children who are praised for their intelligence tend to avoid challenges because their reputation for intelligence can come under harsh scrutiny if they attempt something and fail. They like to think of themselves as achievers so they opt for easy tasks. They take the easy maths course, or whatever they sense may be their Achilles heel. Girls in particular who learn to read and shine in English/Reading/Spelling in early years and get the wrong sort of praise for this may decide therein lies their best option for garnering praise, the accolade of 'smart'. It is still acceptable in wider culture for girls not to be into maths, so it is relatively easy for them to check out of maths when the going gets tough. The work to accolade ratio gets to be too much.

They also become sensitive to their ranking relative to others and can become discouraged if someone else 'wins'. This can cause a tailing off of achievement in late primary school. They become discouraged and lack resilience, because finding that others are also 'smart' or finding (for instance) converting fractions to decimals difficult shakes the foundations of their self image. Children who are praised for being clever believe that failing indicates they are not clever. Lacking any insight into what really gave them the results they used to get, they do not understand how to try again. It can actually undermine a child.

'The Effect of Praise on Children's Intrinsic Motivation' -- Jennifer Henderlong and Mark Lepper authors.

'Praise for Intelligence can Undermine Children's Effort and Performance' - Claudia Mueller and Carol Dweck authors.

'The Effects of Person Versus Performance Praise on Children’s Motivation: Gender and age as moderating factors' - Jennifer Henderlong Corpus and Mark Lepper authors.

I tell both my dd and ds they are beautiful. I praise other things. I call them clever or smart because they are. I also praise actions and deeds.

Neither don't do things because they are afraid of failing. Because me and dh don't have that attitude. We have brought them up not to fear failure. To embrace it because you still learn something.

When it comes to parenting issues like this there is no right or wrong. 2 kids brought up the same can react differently.

I try to keep an eye out for reactions or see if a problem is brewing then adjust what I do or say. Parenting is fluid imo.

Ooh, it makes such a difference to grow up believing you're beautiful. I did - my mum told me constantly that I was (along with clever, funny, kind, etc), and it seemed to armour-plate my self-esteem. Even now, at pushing forty, with wrinkles, saggy tits and a post- baby belly, I look at myself in the mirror and think "yeah, looking good!"

I tell DD and DS that they are beautiful. As do other family members.

My mum arrived yesterday for a visit and the first thing she says when she clapped eyes on then separately was 'you're even more georgous '.

I would also tell them when they are looking ropey ( need to wash hair, wearing something disgusting/dirty).

As a kid I really didn't like being called beautiful (or pretty), so I don't use that word very much.

I've never worried about beauty. However, the smart label, which I did like, has been a two-edged sword. It boosted my confidence while simultaneously making me into a bit of a perfectionist. I struggle with feeling that I'm not allowed to fail.

I tell my dd every day she is beautiful. But she is a huge Roald Dahl fan and very aware that our beauty comes from good thoughts within and shines out of our faces like sunbeams.

I call my DD beautiful and gorgeous and encourage her to be clean and look nice (she's 11 so not at an age hugely bothered by appearance). But I praise her other attributes and achievements more.

It's a hard one. I'm very aware that my own parents didn't always appreciate the right qualities in their daughters. My mother hated the way I was so organized and scrutinized/analysed everything. Those are some of my most valuable traits IMO.

My daughter is so beautiful it makes me DRIBBLE. I think I want to inhale her or something. Honestly I could just lick her peachy cheek. I think it's nature. Otherwise you'd reject them wouldn't you, like a fox rejecting a cub they didn't like the look of.

Math anxiety you've described me as a child exactly

"Personally I don't think YABU. I wish my parents said it to me more often now/growing up."

"I would also say that I grew up to parents who appreciated many, many things about me, but I thought I was ugly and that they only thought I was beautiful to them and my self esteem is shit."

These ^^ really strike a chord with me as well. My mum always told me that I was attractive, but not pretty like my sister. I have always had issues about the way I look.

There is nothing wrong with telling your daughter that she is beautiful and has a beautiful personality etc.

What you're implying, is that to be a feminist, or to be equal to men, you have to be ugly. Why can't you be equal to men, just as clever, just as valid, earn the same, and still be pretty? You are not doing feminism any favours with this attitude, imo.

Good point BlueEyes

How is she implying that?

The two are not mutually exclusive. You don't have to be intelligent, caring, kind and ugly. Besides, I don't praise my daughter for being beautiful as one of her personality attributes. I'm just stating a fact. As I'm sorry everyone but my dd is the most beautiful

Math, I read the OP and immediately thought "oh I call DS clever too much" and you've really articulated my concerns.

I think it's because my only real positive trait is I'm quite clever (in quite a narrow sense I'm not a genius or anything). I grew up knowing I was ugly but that I did well at exams.

So I sort of invest a lot in having a smart child but I know I really shouldn't place that expectation on him. He's only tiny so I'm sure I've not done any harm yet but I'm going to really try to watch myself thank you.

What you're implying, is that to be a feminist, or to be equal to men, you have to be ugly.

Not at all.

What is being referred to here is that we (all of us) talk about women's looks far more than we talk about men's looks, and this starts from before children can even understand what we are saying.

From the moment we can comprehend what is being said to us, we hear girls being complimented for their looks.

We absorb the knowledge that the most important thing about a woman is how she looks.

tangerino you are right to want to actively try to use more varied praise. Even for those of us who are aware of our biases, we still HAVE those biases, we are all a product of our culture.

I'm a feminist, I don't have a daughter but if I did I'd sure tell her she was beautiful (maybe whether she was objectively beautiful or not). I tell my sons they are handsome (they are!). They usually brush it off.

I don't have a daughter but tell my son he's beautiful/gorgeous all the time ( as do random people who stop me in the street to coo and bask in his beauty ). I tell him he's funny, clever, kind and strong as well... because to me he is. I'm his mum and as far as I'm concerned he's the best thing in the world, and I will never stop telling him.

Whats wrong with complimenting your child and filling them with confidence?

It's true my praise is varied. In the last week I've praised DS1 for being resourceful, for not panicking when locking himself out, and for getting his homework done on schedule, and in the past I've praised him for being brave eg not showing pain when stung by a bee.

Oh, and just to add, I'm a feminist and would be the same if I had a daughter.

I do call DS beautiful quite a lot too - sometimes I look at him and he takes my breath away and I can't help but express that!

I just want to try to be more specific - like "oh you were so gentle with the cat, that's kind" or whatever.

I am sure you are perfectly balanced with your DD you are worrying to much about this your DD is beautiful stop with the over thinking it

mathanxiety I know this research, and my mum in particular is very into this, so she's always saying to the children 'I like the way you drew that squiggle' or whatever, but to me, it feels massively artificial. I just think having a mum or dad who thinks you are the bees knees not just in terms of your effort for stuff, but actually who you are (which may not be one way of being) is a very fundamental thing.

My parents tried to praise effort as I was exceptional academically and my brother wasn't, so they thought this would flatten the effect, it didn't as my brother also put in less effort than me which is kind of obvious- he achieved less when he did and the 'world' in terms of teachers/external measures of performance responded less when he did his work. So he jogged along with a medium to low effort, I used to put in a huge amount of effort, and effort/achievement interacted.

I always strive to just be very authentic with my children, which includes honest comments which may be negative, as well as lots of love and praise. If the only thing you are praised for is looks or intelligence, that's a problem, but I have never understood why these authors think it's an either/or situation. Surely there's room for 'wow, you look lovely in that outfit, it makes your eyes look so green' as well as 'I know you tried so hard on that test, even if you didn't get a good mark'. Why would one preclude the other?

My DD is 3 and I actually got a bit fed up of other people referring to her as beautiful, particularly how her hair was beautiful. My DD takes it very much to heart and I remember when she was 2 her having a complete and total meltdown after I had washed her hair, she was totally distraught because "my hair isn't beautiful anymore and no one will think it's beautiful anymore" in her own words.

It's taken me ages to work up to brushing her hair and being able to put it in a plait or ponytail because she thought people wouldn't think her hair was beautiful anymore.

I try very hard to compliment her in other ways as well, which is important I think.