To be furious with my oh?

[CauliflowerBalti]

He's a very clever man. A quality I really admire.

However.

Sometimes we will be having a conversation, or I will ask him a question, and I will know that he's talking bollocks. I'll say that I don't think that's right - or indeed, that I know it isn't right - and he will get very defensive: 'Trust me Cauliflower, I know what I'm talking about, I'm right on this.'

In those instances, there's no point in continuing the discussion when we are both putting forward opinion as fact without any means of verifying, so I inevitably just change the subject.

Yesterday he told me something that I knew was wrong, and that if he carried on believing would result in him breaking the law. I told him at the time he was wrong and he did his usual 'I KNOW this, I'm right thing' so I just shut up. I googled it when he got home though to check and told him - not to score points, but to avoid him breaking the law.

He went mental at me. I'm always doing this, always undermining him intellectually and doubting the things that he tells me. Why can't I just listen to him and accept that he knows?

Um. Because I'm not a good little woman who automatically believes everything that her man tells her in wide-eyed wonder. Because he's not God - he doesn't know everything about everything.

He says it is damaging to his self-esteem and that I am always doing it. I say I will check things if I think they are wrong and they matter - like inadvertently breaking the law - or if he's gone so OTT in his 'Just listen to me Cauliflower I know what I'm talking about I am right and you are wrong and I can't believe you are questioning me' schtick that it does become about childish point scoring and I will seek the evidence I need to wipe the smug expression off his face.

Yes. I know. That is childish. But he drives me fucking potty.

So. AIBU to be sitting here wondering why I'm with someone who has such a deep-seated desire to be right that he can't stand being questioned? Or is it my problem, because I need to be right too? (No. It isn't that I have to be right. I only get cross when he tells me I am WRONG and I know I am not.)

He says it is damaging to his self-esteem and that I am always doing it

and treating you as though you are stupid and don't have any intelligence of your own AND always doing it doesn't affect you in any way?

he doesn't know everything and he can never always be right..........does he have delusions of being a Savant?

I once had an argument with my OH about what year Chernobyl happened. I absolutely knew it was 1986, as it exploded while I was in early labour with DD2! He said 1987. No internets then (early 90s) so grabbed a friend who confirmed I was right. Omg the massive sulk and 'you're never wrong are you?' No I'm fucking not.

And are you going to remind DH of that at DD's 30th birthday next month?

I must say, I really like the sound of you and your DH. I think you sound like a pretty good team.

He's met his match with you, and that is a good thing.

Hi again - I thought he might work in IT. A field in which there are right answers, you puzzle things out until you find them, then you know. I know a few IT people, even some scientists (who do deal with more uncertainty) who are bright in their way but at primary school levels of naïveté when it comes to understanding social sciences, politics and human behaviour.

I remember a good example on a TV reality programme I saw years ago about training a group of bright people with other backgrounds to be stockbrokers. There was an IT guy (who'd thought he might play the markets in retirement) who dropped out because he said he couldn't cope with the uncertainty of there not being a right, reliable answer. (The vet did really badly too).

Your EU example brought back a conversation I had once with a bright, knowledgeable, generally personable IT person about politics. He'd been studying economics and told me that Fairtrade was a load of bollocks that did more harm than good (he was unhappy about his church supporting Fairtrade) and that unfettered free-market trade was always the most beneficial answer. He was a bit flabbergasted (struggled to hide his view that I was an idiot) when I said that that was his political opinion, not a fact.

Of course in that instance, his case (and no doubt your DH's on the EU) can be argued strongly using both theory and evidence. But it is naive to fail to understand that the choice to argue that case is in part politically motivated, that politics more than economic theory determines what approach will be taken in any real life instance and, that politics is, rightly, messy and human. Mistaking a strongly argued view on a political issue, with a basis in theory and evidence, for a fact, is a category error.

Anyway, good luck to you but don't let him put you down.

cauli - Ahhhh, his behaviour starts to make more sense now you've given some background.

It's always tough when there are vocal, confident overachievers in the immediate family: because those things are so socially and financially rewarded, it makes it harder for people who aren't intent on pursuing that path to feel comfortable in their own skin. More of an act of self-assertion, IYSWIM. If you add a dysfunctional relationship on top of that, where normal boundaries of behaviour have not been in place (not to mention normal parameters of rationality), then that can do a lot of damage, long-term to self-esteem and confidence too.

He sounds far more fragile than you are, actually. I suspect the over-assertiveness hides an awful lot of insecurity and fear. It will get better with time and trust, but if he's the type that might be open to it (and I suspect he may not be) it could really help him to talk to someone about all of this. It sounds as though he needs centring somehow - and he's looking for it in the wrong places, i.e. in your quiescence with his position and your flattery of his ego, rather than in himself.

I get this mostly about bringing up DC. I've had 4 DC, 2 are adults, he's had 1 and is therefore obviously the expert.

You used the word autistic a boy lightheartedly but I am wondering if he might be on the spectrum. My Dh who is ASD is a bit like yours. Loves to be right and does not see how his argumentative style puts me and others off.

BathshebaDarkstone - I am not as qualified on the children front as you, but have 100% more kids than my partner. In the early days he did venture opinions on things like eating everything on your plate (damaging, imo) , eating what you're given rather than what you like (I will cater for what my son enjoys, within reason, modifying what we're eating, as my tastes are no more important than his as long as everyone is happy) and controlled crying. He's stopped doing that now.

You see? Fast learner. Doesn't make the same mistake twice.

saffronwblue - I did use the word autistic lightly, but also deliberately. He is, by and large, emotionally intuitive but does sometimes need things pointing out to him. However, he is completely lost without routine and lists, doing things in new ways clearly makes him uncomfortable (though bless him, he will), he likes things to be tidy and in their proper place at all times, he obsessively pursues interests/lines of thought, wouldn't dream of starting something and not finishing it even if he isn't enjoying it (a book, a meal, learning a new skill...). He likes things to be black and white. Grey isn't an option, really. And yes, lottiegarbanzo, his job is all about finding answers.

I am the complete opposite of all of the above. He says he needs someone like me in his life. And only twitches a bit when I print the boarding passes the day before we fly, not when I get the email telling me I can. Or when I book tickets for a gig without immediately sorting out childcare/hotel. In my world, things sort. In his, they get sorted NOW.

Honestly, he is lovely. Super-thoughtful. My boy is poorly today so can't do the Lad & Dad thing at school tonight. It's the first time he's ever had a father figure to accompany him to such things - it's usually me, grumbling about how such bollocks makes kids without Dads feel like shit. So my boy is very sad. My partner is going to recreate the event at home, when he feels better. Not the same - but lovely. It made my pale, snotty boy beam.

It's worth blow ups like this.

"And only twitches a bit when I print the boarding passes the day before we fly, not when I get the email telling me I can. Or when I book tickets for a gig without immediately sorting out childcare/hotel. In my world, things sort. In his, they get sorted NOW."

The day before? And I thought I'd like you, it turns out you are in fact the Devil!

I have lots of plates to keep spinning and am an Olympic-level procrastinate who needs the pressure of impending crisis to motivate any sort of action