To be furious with my oh?

[CauliflowerBalti]

He's a very clever man. A quality I really admire.

However.

Sometimes we will be having a conversation, or I will ask him a question, and I will know that he's talking bollocks. I'll say that I don't think that's right - or indeed, that I know it isn't right - and he will get very defensive: 'Trust me Cauliflower, I know what I'm talking about, I'm right on this.'

In those instances, there's no point in continuing the discussion when we are both putting forward opinion as fact without any means of verifying, so I inevitably just change the subject.

Yesterday he told me something that I knew was wrong, and that if he carried on believing would result in him breaking the law. I told him at the time he was wrong and he did his usual 'I KNOW this, I'm right thing' so I just shut up. I googled it when he got home though to check and told him - not to score points, but to avoid him breaking the law.

He went mental at me. I'm always doing this, always undermining him intellectually and doubting the things that he tells me. Why can't I just listen to him and accept that he knows?

Um. Because I'm not a good little woman who automatically believes everything that her man tells her in wide-eyed wonder. Because he's not God - he doesn't know everything about everything.

He says it is damaging to his self-esteem and that I am always doing it. I say I will check things if I think they are wrong and they matter - like inadvertently breaking the law - or if he's gone so OTT in his 'Just listen to me Cauliflower I know what I'm talking about I am right and you are wrong and I can't believe you are questioning me' schtick that it does become about childish point scoring and I will seek the evidence I need to wipe the smug expression off his face.

Yes. I know. That is childish. But he drives me fucking potty.

So. AIBU to be sitting here wondering why I'm with someone who has such a deep-seated desire to be right that he can't stand being questioned? Or is it my problem, because I need to be right too? (No. It isn't that I have to be right. I only get cross when he tells me I am WRONG and I know I am not.)

I have had just one conversation like this. We disagreed about 2 versions of a thing. I had been doing research and every source said that version A is little more expensive, but more low maintenance and more durable than B. He wanted B, because a company selling B had told him that this is better, and why can't I just trust him.

Well no. If you want to change my opinion then you show me some facts and arguments.

So what is his reply when you point out that you cannot just accept it's true when he says he 'KNOWS', as in some cases where he has claimed he does, he was in fact wrong. Maybe he could stop arguing he's right if he has not verified he is?

My DH thinks he's always right & has only grudgingly admitted he was wrong about twice in 25 years. He once said "I only argue if I know I'm right* & wouldn't accept that I wasn't arguing because I thought I was wrong

I tend to just say "I'm not arguing - you can think what you like" these days

What I do for a living is a variation on what he would like to do, but doesn't.

If he were actually clever he would see this as an opportunity to learn, from you, more about something he's really interested in.

BoomBoomsCousin - the fact that I can't see him ever taking that view is seriously depressing.

The more I think about it, the more I think he just doesn't respect me, as an intellectual/professional being. Shit.

On a different note, it appears you've given up pointing out his wrongness except where it will cause you or others risk of harm.

In other words, you don't necessarily feel the need to prove your rightness to anyone else.

He probably thinks you think he's wrong about all important things, because he doesn't notice (a) when you think he's wrong about minor things and (b) when you think he's right about major things.

If I were you I'd cultivate my slightly sarcastic "yes, dear" for use whenever he mansplains or persists in wrongosity.

My very gentle DH does this! Along with other men. Women on the underhand often underplay what they know.

A serious discussion needs to take place. He has to realise that his belief that he is never wrong and his refusal to accept that you might be right are going to irreparably damage your relationship. It shows such a lack of respect for your own knowledge, opinions and feelings, it can't continue.

Next time just say 'oh we will have to agree to disagree'

I just sent him an email saying we need to talk more about this. We both work better if disagreements are handled initially in writing. I can make sure I am clear and non-judgemental, while being direct - in verbal confrontation, I tend to withdraw. He can read an email and take time to digest it, rather than be immediately defensive.

*'He probably thinks you think he's wrong about all important things, because he doesn't notice (a) when you think he's wrong about minor things and (b) when you think he's right about major things.

If I were you I'd cultivate my slightly sarcastic "yes, dear" for use whenever he mansplains or persists in wrongosity.'*

MrsHathaway, you should be a marriage counsellor.

Cauli does he do it with other people or is it just you he tries to use like this to make himself feel better?

This thread reminded me of this

I've not noticed him do it with other people but some of the anecdotes he tells me after his day at work suggest that people thinking he is wrong when he is right is a trigger for him, so maybe other people are annoyed by it too.

I bought that book for myself for Mothers Day, Pebbles. YES.

Merci du compliment

Then it might not be that he doesn't have respect for you, but that he has been brought up to see admitting being wrong about anything to be a sign of weakness in some way. Which doesn't make the immediate question of how you disagree easier, but may not damn your relationship so much.

I think sons inherit from their fathers in very domineering patriarchal families. DH is becoming increasingly like his father which worries me. This is his father who gave DS1 a bottle of formula (without my knowledge) when he was 2 months old (and exclusively breastfed) because 'he knew that all the fuss about breastfeeding was a load of hype'

I'd do what Spandex suggests- smile blandly and say "Oh well, we'll just have to disagree" and disengage. This will drive him mental so when he follows you around trying to continue the fight just reiterate the same sentence. So he will have to come up with new evidence to continue the argument. Which he won't be able to.

I should have the Wendy Cope poem pinned up somewhere prominant OP

He Tells Her

He tells her that the Earth is flat -
He knows the facts, and that is that.
In altercations fierce and long
She tries her best to prove him wrong.

But he has learned to argue well.
He calls her arguments unsound
And often asks her not to yell.
She cannot win. He stands his ground.

The planet goes on being round.

Someone upthread said this is about his self-esteem. They are right.

It does sound very irritating to live with though. Not sure I would.

An ex of mine was like this. He knew everything (in his opinion) and would never back down or apologise when proved wrong. He used to tell me i was stupid, used big words and when i asked him what they meant he would give me a dictionary and say "the only way you are going to learn is if you look it up".

I was very young when i was with him and the funny thing is I now know that i am more intelligent than him and it probably made him completely insecure so he made out i knew nothing and was stupid!

Now with the invention of Google i know that he was full of shit, he was wrong on a huge number of things and i believe that if he didn't know something he just made it up.

He was also a sociopath and looked down on everyone he knew but that is another story.

I hate the term 'emasculating', and particularly the fact that there is no female equivalent.

Men need to get over thinking that their balls will drop off if they admit they don't know everything about everything. Sometimes it's a misogyny issue, sometimes it's a poor self-esteem 'All I'm good at is being clever so I must be the most clever' issue.

YY ^ He says it is damaging to his self-esteem

That's the bit that jumped out at me. It's HIS problem if his self-esteem needs bolstering by squashing you down. Or are you there to help make him feel superior? Even when wrong? It doesn't sound as if he sees you as his equal.

People who are truly clever don't think they're right all the time. They know what they don't know, IYSWIM.

I couldn't live with someone that couldn't cope with being wrong.

OP needs to ask her husband to think hard about how he thinks the pattern of their arguments affects her self-esteem.

I hate the term 'emasculating', and particularly the fact that there is no female equivalent.

The whole point is that it's making him like a woman . Because apparently being told you're wrong is a thing that only happens to women.