To think that children will fit in around OUR lives, not the other way around?

[HonestQuestion]

I am sure I'm going to get flamed for this but maybe there will be some good advice too! (I have NCd)

DH and I were talking last night about how we intend to bring up children. We have seen friends and family where DC rule the roost - everything is organised around the children. The children aren't ever left to their own devices to play; the parents are constantly playing with them and distracting them with activities. The TV is always switched to children's channels, not the news or anything adult. Evenings with the family have to be run on the children's schedule for naps and snacks and feeding.

Even when they are in bed, the mums are held hostage to the DC speaking over the walkout talkie and summoning them to the bedroom plenty of times before they finally go to sleep. We meet up with our friends for lunch or dinner or a day out, and always seem to come home not really having had much of a chat or catch up with our friends - because the day or evening is always all about the children - we all have to be in their thrall!

It seems the experience of raising a child these days is so far removed from how DH and I were brought up. We remember being left to our own devices to play, watching the news and learning about the world from it, we remember that the adults ruled the house - my dad would never have dreamed of having kids' TV on all evening when he got home from work!

And it's so far removed from how we want to raise our children. We don't want to lose 'who we are' and what we find interesting. A friend of ours said on FB the other day that she is going on a mini break and leaving her DC alone overnight for the first time in 3 years! I can't imagine being like that! And I can't imagine having a DC, meeting up with friends but spending that time constantly entertaining the children.

AWBU? I have my hard hat ready...

Well... I never felt I was my DC's best friend - I was Mum and that is far more important than being best friends and yes it is about parenting - it's just clumsily put and sounds a bit Victorian.

My parents would agree with you OP and did raise me that way. I was always very polite around adults and did as I was told. But I've had anxiety about sleeping ever since I can remember, loathe staying away from home and am generally a bundle of neuroses. This is probably not connected but my DD has a very strict routine which she relies on and yes, sometimes we make decisions about leaving friends because it's her bedtime but not always. We just tend to prioritise her need for sleep.

The result is she sleeps brilliantly and we get a lot of compliments from family when we are with them because she isn't tired, hungry and ratty all the time.

I nearly gave you a biscuit but I have a friend who raises her son like that and hasn't let any of her social life slide and it works for them. My DD hasn't spent a night away from both me and DH yet. She's 2.4. Make of that what you will.

Regarding the news. The news today is very different from when I was a kid. It's more graphic (pixelated images can still be awful).

My dd (11) watches the news and asks questions and we discuss it. Doesn't bother her at all. 5 years ago, a documentary that dh had while she played gave her nightmares. We and she didn't think it was that upsetting at the time. 2am found me sitting in bed with her calming her down.

In today's society you can watch the news whenever you want. After a long day with the kids, I assure you, there will be times you put to on for them to get five minutes to do something or get some peace.

I would be interested to know how old the OP is.

The only bit I agree with you on is conversations. When we were out with friends, and the DCs came to talk to us, unless it was urgent, we told them to wait until we had finished talking. Others often stopped every 30 seconds when their DCs came up to them, to have an enthusiastic, vaguely educational chat with them, completely losing track of our adult conversation. Used to drive me mad. It is possible to have boundaries, and NT DCs can learn to wait.

No one watches cartoons all night? Why do you think that's special?!

Cartoons are for after school. Bedtime is 7pm, after that it's all the gore you can possibly stomach

I think you imagine every other parent is doing something different to what you would do. They're not.

And good luck getting a conversation with your DH if you can't plug your kids into the screens for half an hour. Mine watches iPad from 6am when she gets up, next to me in bed so I can doze. If you want to get up at 6am and do craft then you're a better woman than me, no question.

A friend of ours said on FB the other day that she is going on a mini break and leaving her DC alone overnight for the first time in 3 years! I can't imagine being like that!

make sure you both earn a lot or have family willing to have the kids then.

my birth plan will be, "You're the experts, I trust you to do whatever you think it necessary to keep me and my baby safe, thank you".

that is a very shit birth plan.

That was my birth plan (twice) and I was quite content with it luck was involved in the actual process obviously but I saw/see nothing wrong in trusting professionals to know what they're doing.

Also, telling the op she shouldn't have children because her pre-child views on child-rearing are different to yours is just plain mean.

Bathtime, sorry my birth plan for my non existent birth doesn't meet your approval - it was in response to the poster who said she thought I would want to micro-manage every aspect of it when in fact that couldn't be further from the truth. That's all I was trying to convey, but thank you for calling me an "opinionated asshole".

YNBU we said EXACTLY the same before we had our daughter 10 months ago BUT.....like some of the other posters have said, little ones come with personalities and our little one has a really strong determined personality already! She LOVES interacting with people and chooses the company of people over toys all the time which makes it very hard to leave her to her own devices. She will play with toys but will bring them to you so you play with her. She's also very nosey so won't sleep if we have company or are out with her.

In principal I still agree with you. We've allowed our 10 month old to stay overnight with grandparents twice now to give us an evening/night to be a couple again. We always try to have her in bed by 8.30pm so we get a couple of hours to ourselves and we also plan to have a couple of weekends away on our own this year.

I thought that we were realistic about what would happen to our lives when we had our DD but it was so much more all consuming and life changing than we could have imagined. We don't pander to her, she doesn't have screen time yet or a walkie talkie but we have changed out lives for her, and I don't begrudge it in the slightest.
I believe that you will find how little dinner parties, watching what you want on the TV and even lunch with your friends means compared to spending time with your child. Watching them laughing and happy is worth so much more than anything else you have mentioned.

Yes I agree re wait till talking too.

I do have too many friends who cut off adult conversations without even an 'excuse me' to talk to their kids.

It's rude but also it teaches kids they are the most important person in every room when they are, of course, not.

I think, as most posters have said, it's all a balance.

Sometimes your child's needs come first - whether that's feeding them, consoling them, explaining something to them, helping them. Sometimes they don't and they can wait for their parents time and attention.

Most of us do an okay job and we are all winging it.

Oh and YY to the poster who said you don't know yet how you will feel.

You love your kids so much more than you can ever imagine and that in itself will change the way you act and behave more than you can ever imagine!

HonestQuestion I am sorry but laughed at your husband remark of no cartoons at all
I suggest you try him babysitting actively (without other people helping) a very little baby 2-3 months old for one day, or a 2 year old toddler, just to have an idea what it's like.

I never had a birth plan - I'd never heard of them until MN!

I think you're getting a rough ride here op. I think what you think most parents do is actually not what most parents do, and once you click onto this we'll all be in agreement and we can go and gunfight somewhere else

Yanbu. We parent how you describe you want to in your op. It's worked for us. But, a few compromises have been made! We still have a good social life, but it's more dinner parties at other peoples houses and the dc fall asleep on the sofa rather than out for dinner.
I think different countries approach parenting differently. My dh is South African. My English friends are much more child focused than they are (and interestingly, the dc of the sa parents are just as close). For example we were invited to 2 x Xmas parties, one with our sa friends, one English. The English one was all children's party games, secret Santa, the sa one was good food, lots of wine, children off doing their own thing.
I am also pleased, and smug, that when we just had 1 x newborn, our lives didn't change at all, she just came everywhere strapped to one of us. I think a lot of people don't realise how portable a newborn can be until it's too late.

Ignore the birth plan judgements.

That was my plan for my first.

My birth plan for my second went out of the window. My waters broke and I didn't dis late for 9 hours. I was already in hospital so was being checked. 40 mins after the mid wife checked me I was 8cms and ds was on his way. I was rushed down to the labour suite where I was manually dilated the last two cms as he was trying to come through and pushed for a whole 6 minutes.

My birth plan wasn't used at all. There was no time.

That's fine Mersey, as I said I knew I would have to have my hard hat on! It's interesting, some posters seem to agree or agree with some elements, some seem to have taken my OP very personally as though it were an attack on them, and the majority say, "nice idea but in reality you'll have to compromise, especially when they're very young", so fair enough. I wanted to ask because I wanted to know what the reality is, and how likely it could be to stick to our guns. And I think I've found out!

TBH Katenka I'm not even sure how or why it's relevant

I've always chosen things for my kids to do because I enjoy making them happy. Or they need to do like learning to swim. Meals out with friends just didn't hold the same interest! So to a certain extent having children changes your wants and needs too.

I've broadened my horizons though and experienced things I'd never have tried if I had not had children.

As for using an iPhone, well I found I wanted my 11 year old to have one. You see I have my own life, but I am still responsible for her so when she's out at a friends or at home and I'm at work I can text her to tell her it's time for tea, or whatever. It's part of building her independence.

It's like getting married. Life no longer revolves round you, but both of you with a bit of give and take.

Isn't the key word here compromise?

No one has to fit in 100% with anyone else, but both parents and children have to compromise.

I had a year between DS being 2 and 3 when we went out every Saturday night. However we went to friends for dinner and drinks. Kids would eat first then go feral entertain themselves whilst the adults ate and drank

So we both compromised. Kids enabled parents to have a grown up dinner and chat round the table. Parents compromise was having dinner in rather than out at a restaurant so that the kids were more entertained.

Don't forget, the more you keep the kids entertained the more time you then have for yourself. It's win win.

Hmmm I kind of see your point in that I think children don't benefit from 'helicopter parents'. They need to learn to play independently etc BUT it there are so many factors that determine how you raise your children. If, for example you have a child with a medical condition then yes you probably will have to fit in with their routine for medication or physio etc.

If you don't have a good support network then your options of maintaining a normal social life are limited. A work colleague of DH's just spent her first night away from her DD and DH since DD's birth 3 years ago but since then she's had nothing but grief from her DH about it. She probably feels going out just isn't worth the hassle.

As others have also said it depends on your baby's temperament. My DS was a lovely baby but didn't sleep at night so his bedtime routine and naps were precious. When he was a toddler we found if he had a night out of routine (if we went out to a family party for instance) it would take over a week to get him back on track. Sometimes you have to weigh up the pros and cons.

TBH Katenka I'm not even sure how or why it's relevant

Which Post?

OP

You forgot one thing.

You see, because you and your partner are special and not like all rge other parents out there, your baby will also be very special snd not like all the other babies out there.

You see, and then your very special baby will need special treatment, and only eat special organic food handmashed by special fairies, and it will have no need for i-pads, oh no, but baby will love Mozart so you have Mozart on in the background all day, and baby sleeps in your bed as she is not like all the other babies, and can't be left to cry.

Then as a toddler, she will be so advanced! Ahead of per peers and needs special sensory activities and you will turn the living room into a sensory haven for her, guests will just have to sit in the hall, on the floor. But mostly you won't have time for guests, what with the suzuki violin lessons, the toddler poetry club and baby karate.

It will be amazing, because special parents have super special kids.☺️

And you'll be worse than all your friends combined

Leaving to own devices:

Leaving ds1 to his own devices meant finding him kneeling on our garden fence (30ft drop behind the house), standing on our bannister 5 storeys up, or flushing pens & towels down the toilet.

Ds2 was happy to be left to his own devices & would spend hours in make believe games with thomas TF tank engine (he preferred to play with someone else but would happily play alone).

Ds3 never wanted to play alone, always wanted to play with someone. He'll happily read a book now for hours, but was very difficult to ignore for years.

Always depends on the child. Of course the danger is someone having a ds2 first & then thinking they're the best parents in the land In fact ds2 has always been an easy child - he was born that way - nothing to do with us at all.

Well I rather think the party games one sound a lot more fun as an adult even. Those with just good food and wine are dull! Can't you have good food wine and party games? You'd hate our parties. They all have games whether the kids are there or not!

Katenka - My birth plan! I can honestly say I don't even know what one looks like, and I've never really given it any thought. So to be told that my plan is a terrible one made me then