At the pool - other adult behavior

[CousCousDefinitely]

I was at our local leisure centre today. It's a private hotel one, if it makes a difference, so it's users would be a combination of members, hotel guests and you can also pay for a day pass. I'm a member.
It was busy as it is normally on a Saturday afternoon. There were two guys I hadn't seen before in the lanes section (where you can do serious swimming, up one side and down the other). I wanted to do 50 or so lengths but it was tricky as it was me and them in the section and they were doing handstands, diving in (under the no diving sign) and generally getting in the way. I get this with children sometimes but not usually adults in their 30s or 40s.
Im laid back so I just sort of went around them as best I could. They were swimming under me and making me nervous. So after about 20 lengths I gave up.
I went into the steamroom and they arrived in about 10 minutes after and stared at me up and down in a pervy uncomfortable way.
So they it clicked that the pool annoyance was probably on purpose.
I left and was pissed off that it made me felt so uncomfortable.
I was pissed off that I couldn't do anything to stop them staring, that they'd intrrupted my swim and that I couldnt complain to the lifeguard while I was there as it would have been awkward, or as I was leaving as I didn't want to appear racist. The two guys were speaking Arabic to each other which is pretty uncommon in my town.
My dh went to the pool after I got home, for his turn at a bit of child free peace and I described them to him. He came back and said they were in the hot tub (this was 2 hours after me) so they'd probably got a day pass and stayed to piss off more people.
Was I unreasonable to just leave and say nothing and if so, what should I have done or said? Either to them or to the lifeguard. I feel like such a chicken.

mean that women in this country have to settle for less than equality

Women in this country aren't settling for less than equality. Huge strides have been made and feminists continue to speak out and campaign against issues where disparity exists.

The only acceptable misogony appears to be the Islamicaly inspired one to the faction so keen to ignore and minimise it.

Debate ? What debate ? There's none to be had according to you and many on here.

"MistressMia
Your one track approach to all discussions doesn't help the debate. Nobody is apologising for what happens in those countries "
Yes they are.... Indirectly, they are apologising by not wanting to talk about it and saying it is irrelevant. Metropolitan BBC left liberal bias is hard to flush out of people. MistressMia was spot on in describing the reality (as opposed to the rhetoric) about everyday life in Muslim Arab countries for women and girls.

Solomon

Who is refusing to talk about it?

Saudi Arabia has been roundly criticised for years but it hasn't stopped our Government dealing with them nor British companies selling them arms.

Why are people so reluctant to recognise the problems women face in this country too. We are not a shining beacon of equality just because we are not as awful as other countries.

Blonde - Hi, just to answer why, initially it was when I was swimming laps of the pool that they began diving crossing my path, diving under me, and I have had this with children before. I kind of dismissed it as high jinxs or that they weren't aware of the lanes. It was when I got out of the pool and felt their eyes on me and into the steamroom that it clicked that the pool behavior probably wasn't just innocently messing around for the sake of it. It was more likely that they were doing it on purpose because I was there.
I had already given up trying to swim at that stage. So that, coupled with my general reluctance to complain was why I didn't do anything about it.

I know this thread has gone way above my head in parts. But I just wanted to add that it was in the Irish news in the last couple of days about male students in an Irish university who have been sharing nude photos of women they slept with. The college is introducing mandatory sexual consent classes to try to address the problem.
This is aimed at a group of individuals who have committed a disproportionately high rate of sexual assault/abuse in an effort to fix the problem in the college.
So, in effect, the full group of males in that college have been tarred with a reputation.
Why is it acceptable to do that but not acceptable to group the males of a certain culture together where that culture also has a disproportionately high rate of sexual assaults and abuse attributed to them?

"Solomon Did you read the article you linked to. The surge of women wanting to be nuns was 45 countrywide. hmmconfused"
Ok, so you have problems with trends and absolute numbers now. I didn't say there were millions of nuns in the convents. I said that recruitment was at record levels, which it is, the highest intake for 25 years.
But as you mention it, Godless Europe to one side, there is a boom in recruitment in religious orders and indeed churches globally.

It's not my brand, I'm guessing you've never read or heard of something like this:
www.vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/ccc_toc.htm
It's take it or leave it. There's generations of people, even those gone through Catholic schools who have no real idea what the faith is all about.

couscous those classes are for everybody-not just male students.

Yes I know they are Purple. But they are addressing an issue regarding the male students.

the catholic church denies women autonomy over their own body

there is no argument anyone can put forward to claim that this is good for women and supportive of women

"the catholic church denies women autonomy over their own body"
Wow the bullshit is coming thick and fast now.
The Church reminds women of what is good for them. Women (including Catholic women) are free to do whatever they like, but there are consequences to all actions.
If you think the Church does not believe in granting & respecting free-will then go and live in an Islamic country; you will see what real women's autonomy looks like there.

Why do you think if someone intentionally stabs a pregnant women in the abdomen and kills her, there are two murder charges, one for the mother and one for the child?

I think the whole christian message is deny yourself and take up your cross and in an ideal world sex would be for marriage only. I'm not a catholic but that is the broad message and I know it is not fashionable in this day and age.

Yes I agree the Magdalen launderies were pretty awful and lacking in christian charity but what was society as a whole like in Ireland at the time?Where else could the women go?

thanks for posting back OP. Their behaviour was unacceptable whether they were blue green or pink end of:)

Solomon
"Why do you think if someone intentionally stabs a pregnant women in the abdomen and kills her, there are two murder charges, one for the mother and one for the child?"

Not in the UK there isn't. You can't be charge with murder of an unborn child. The only possible charge is child destruction which is hard to prove as you have to show the attacker intended the child to die as well as the mother.
www.bbc.co.uk/newsbeat/article/32332040/too-hard-to-convict-people-of-harming-unborn-babies

Sorry to be more accurate "not in England and Wales" rather than the UK as the Scottish position may be different.

Oh you have not heard of the Irish women who come on shopping trips to London and have abortions they have to leave their country to do so - yes what freedom

I have lived in an Islamic country

so I know what it is like

but a progressive country where women didn't wear niqabs (never ever saw a women wearing one) and it was rare to see a women under 50 to wear a hijab

most the women I knew were highly educated degree plus level, had careers as scientists, doctors, teachers, pharmacists they choose their own husbands and all the families and friends I know were decent people (who knows what goes on behind closed doors but the doors I was closed behind people were loving and kind as I have known here as I believe most people are)

abortion was legal

contraception was legal for married and unmarried women

I did start to really appreciate that I have freedoms that very few woman have but more and more were starting to and also that there were men that had awful attitudes but any harassment I ever got I was able to deal with and others around me gave the men a good telling off (unlike on the tube here) but I know other women have unfortunate been harassed terribly

my experience was good and the people both men and women were good people who respect others no matter what their sex or religion even my own atheism, even though they found it a little strange

but that does not mean I can not find fault in the religion or certain aspects of all cultures and yes I do believe ME cultures are on the whole very oppressive for women and I believe Catholicism is too

Saudi Arabia has been roundly criticised for years but it hasn't stopped our Government dealing with them nor British companies selling them arms

WTF has British arms sales got do with women's rights in Saudi ?

Classic deflection - the West is complicit / we are just as bad / we are to blame.

Why can't the Saudis improve women's rights irrespective of foreign policy, commerce or anything else ?

I'll tell you why..because of Islam.....but then that'll be me just going off on my predictable but true diatribe.

Tough if you don't think that's helpful. Recognising and admitting the source of the problem is key to being able to take steps to solve it. Not equivocating and waiting for some utopian society to take hold here.

cous cous does this hotel you swim in happen to begin with the letter V?

EnthusiasmDisturbed, Chances are, you lived in a Gulf city-state as an expat. Exception to the rule, and hardly that as I think if you scratched beneath the surface, even in the "developed" Gulf states, you would have seen the real picture.

"Saudi Arabia has been roundly criticised for years but it hasn't stopped our Government dealing with them nor British companies selling them arms"
No because all some people care about is money!

and another point

I do not need the church, the pope, imams, religious experts, priests or another other god messenger to tell me what is good for me

I am able to make that decision myself

no I didn't

if I had I would have seen women wearing niqabs all the time

No NotGonna

MistressMia
"Saudi Arabia has been roundly criticised for years but it hasn't stopped our Government dealing with them nor British companies selling them arms

WTF has British arms sales got do with women's rights in Saudi ?

Classic deflection - the West is complicit / we are just as bad / we are to blame."

Can you not see that if the West says "we don't like the way you treat women" and then happily carries on trading with Saudi Arabia then they are going to assume that what we are saying is just a load of hot air and that actually the powers that be don't give a stuff about Saudi women (which they probably don't). Do you really think that the problems in Saudi Arabia are just due to religion? You think the institutionalised nepotism and corruption is due to religion. The lack of political freedoms and the appalling treatment of South Asian foreign workers. Yes, religion is one of the tools they use but the problems are much deeper than just religious dogma. Saudi Arabia won't change because the ossified corrupt ruling elite are very happy with the way it is.

Secondly, nobody has said we have to wait until we have a perfect society here before we raise issues elsewhere but neither should we ignore the issues here because other places are worse.

The Catholic Church treats women terribly. Women do all the work such as cleaning the church, and the Priest comes along and preaches and takes all the credit. And he preaches that women's role is to be a good wife and a good mother.

The difference is that the Catholic Church and it's supporters have very much been forced to face up to what happened, stop hiding it and take responsibility for it and stop it happening again

yes and you can freely talk about it without fear of being called racist or being targeted by a fatawa.

The new film on abuse - spotlight, imagine the world wide out rage if a similar film were made about rotheram et all?