To absolutely, categorically NOT want to go on this honeymoon

[Greatsowhatnow]

Bloody sodding zika virus

The websites are contradicting themselves! In one paragraph it says that once the virus is out of your blood/system, you're fine to TTC. In the next it says for people TTC to avoid the areas affected. They're also telling people in Brazil to put off pregnancy for another two years: why, if it's not an issue after two or so weeks?!

We're due to be going on honeymoon to a very much affected area, called our travel agent who said if we swap destinations within the next 3 days, we only have to pay a small transfer fee and will be refunded any money, if our initial holiday costs more than the one we choose to swap to.

I'm a natural worrier anyway so not sure if I'm blowing this out of proportion and falling for the 'hype'. My partner absolutely doesn't want to cancel or swap, says that:

It might hit Europe anyway eventually, so we'd be cancelling for no reason.

We've paid extra to book our seats, if we choose another destination, the flights would have already been opened and we may not be sat together. For both of us it will be our first long haul flight.

If we're to believe the fact that once it's out of your system, you're all good to go: we'd be cancelling for nothing. I reckon the bloody thing will cause long term effects

It took us weeks to choose somewhere: there's a lot of places we can't go (same sex couple). So Morocco, for example would be out.

Flying in April: a lot could happen between now and then (good or bad). Planning on TTC when we get back. But if we wait until then, and cancelled, we would lose thousands a lot of money.

I know nobody can say what the right thing to do because nobody really knows if hing has mutated, or if there are long term effects because it's still pretty new. But WWYD? The two of us are in totally different mindsets, with neither wanting to budge.

I haven't done any research but I'd want to be cautious. Unless I was willing to put off Ttc for a year+ I think I'd want to swap the destination.

The news says they are expecting it to hit Europe by summer.

So in fact it could be here within months.

But ion understand your concerns. How much would you mind putting off ttc if you got sick?

Yanbu. It must be awful for you and everyone else with holidays booked

But there are so many beautiful places you could go. I doubt you would relax or enjoy the holiday if this was on your mind

(Obviously we both know the real tragedy is that this is sweeping across so many countries and affecting so many children)

The websites are contradicting themselves! In one paragraph it says that once the virus is out of your blood/system, you're fine to TTC. In the next it says for people TTC to avoid the areas affected.

These two statements aren't actually contradictory. In the first refers to people who are not yet TTC, and thus not pregnant, the second to people who are TTC and who might be pregnant before the virus has cleared.

That said, I would also be worried. If I wasn't prepared to delay TTC until the position has been clarified, I would probably switch destinations.

If you are not going to enjoy the holiday because of the health risks then cancel and go elsewhere. It's a shame but it's too much money to waste if you are not going to relax and enjoy the holiday. Could you stretch to Australia? Or a nice part of America?

I would be of your mindset.

I don't see how it will end up in Europe: the mosquito that spreads it had been in Brazil for ever, it is the same mosquito that spreads dengue fever, and dengue isn't in Europe.

You invested a lot in choosing the destination , planning, and it's hard to let go of the dream. Can you offer a new dream rather than say 'we have to change'?

Start a thread in travel asking for suitable destinations, laying out all your criteria, or see if anyone else on this thread has ideas and present as an alternative.

You will get seats together in April. If not at check in present your marriage certificate and say 'but we are on honeymoon ' and you might even get an upgrade .

If you go to Brazil you will fret constantly about every insect bite , and quite apart from the longer term issues, it sounds as if the immediate flu like illness is very unpleasant.

I too think you should cancel. A holiday really isn't worth all this anxiety.
It's all very well for your partner to say you're overreacting but would she really want you to be worried, for months about your honeymoon?

The holiday company have offered you a great deal to swap destinations. Swap, otherwise your honeymoon will be one stres may affair when all you want to do is celebrate with your partner. Swap your honeymoon to somewhere safe & enjoy!

Congratulations by the way!

...stressy affair...

It seems its not just a risk from the pregnancy point of view, there are some articles suggesting that it can cause Guillain-Barre Syndrome which (if I've understood correctly) is capable of affecting anyone.

Don't know where you're going but it's already in Australia as well.

I don't think YABU to be worried about it; but I also think that you can't live your life worrying about every bad thing that could happen to you.

I would imagine the conflicting advice is due to the Brazilians still very much being in the area where the virus is rife, so waiting for longer just in case they catch it again. I doubt anyone yet knows categorically whether one dose is all one can catch - so that would probably account for the extra caution in endemic regions.

Go on your honeymoon, have a good time, and don't worry about ttc for a few months yet, just to be on the completely safe side.

DH is a scientist, he says it won't be a problem for Europe because the climate doesn't support the type of mosquito that carries it.

The fear of sitting apart on a longhaul flght is minimal to the fear of an as yet not fully understood virus. Change and suck up the extra cost as it's worth the peace of mind

YANBU to avoid it if you will be TTC imminently - I wouldn't risk it personally.

How about Niagara Falls? I always thought that would be a great place to Honeymoon.

A friend of mine to S America for honeymoon, and had to take some pretty gross malaria tablets. She then had to put off TTC for 3months - which is a dot of time in the scheme of things- but felt like ages to her then.

I'd swap too.

You'll get seats together if it's not til April, or people will swap when they know it's your honeymoon.
It isn't likely to hit Europe as it's too cold for the mosquitoes in most places.
They probably are telling women in Brazil not to TTC for 2 years because they are at constant risk there, don't know if you can get it multiple times, and maybe they will have managed to control the outbreak/find a vaccine/find a treatment etc by then.

The virus is spread by sexual intercourse too so it can spread beyond South America but I'm not sure how far, it's already in Texas due to being transmitted by sex... So it's not just transmitted by mozzy bites.

The Aedes mosquitoes can only survive in hot climates - I think there are parts of Europe they can/ do live (Medeira and some parts of southern France, southern and southern Italy). It would be entirely possible for a British couple to avoid any areas that will ever be susceptible - the only way you would catch it in northern Europe would be the very rare sexually transmitted route!

If you intend to ttc immediately after your honeymoon and can get a destination swap for a minimal fee you are probably being very cautious but still not illogical - quite sensible. Go somewhere cold :o It might be a bit dark and gloomy at Easter, but you could wait til May and go to Iceland :o

The zika virus has been around for a long time and in some outbreaks has affected 75% of the population without having such an effect on unborn children. Something different is happening this time.

The experts do not know why the rates have increased. Microcephaly occurs in 25,000 babies a year in the US but the 4,000 or so cases that are causing concern are clustered. This rise was not predictable, the virus has not been found in many cases that have been analysed but has been found in some. Without understanding the causes it likely contributory factors, it is impossible to predict how zika might affect babies in the future.

Your honeymoon is about you and your partner spending time together, away from the distractions of everyday life. Given the chance to change destination, I think I would.

You might not get bitten by a mosquito but you will spend your time worrying about it. The holiday may have absolutely no impact on any future unborn baby but on top of all the usual concerns soon to be parents have, it will cause you another layer of concern.

I think you should cancel. What about Central Europe - somewhere like Vienna - it gets warm and you can do spas etc. Or Canada?

Two cases in Ireland now www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-35480562

Canary Islands are meant to be safe at the moment.

Go there. Relax.
You will regret it if you don't go on honeymoon and as you said if you don't go now by the summer you might not be able to go anywhere as it will have Zika

I would if ttc

"They're also telling people in Brazil to put off pregnancy for another two years: why, if it's not an issue after two or so weeks?!"

I imagine it's because they're at risk of being bitten and contracting Zika at any point over the year due to the climate, so even if you're infected with Zika once and get it out if your system, there's a chance of being bitten again? Plus I think they don't really understand yet how the sexually transmitted component of the virus works (or fully the link with microcephaly). I think they're hoping they'll have more answers and the situation under control after a few years.

At the moment, most of Europe will be fine - as others have said, one of the benefits of living in a crappy climate is that it's too cold for the Aedes Mosquito to live and breed. All of the cases in Europe so far have been found in people who have travelled to Zika infected countries, so unless you're having sex with them, you're fine.

I'd definitely want to avoid those countries if I was trying to conceive (I'm pregnant, so we've crossed off pretty much all of the Caribbean and Americas as a holiday destination this year!).

NYTimes article is good.