My son's ex teachers are sulking with me

[caitlinohara]

I'll try to be brief.

Recently moved ds2 (Y2) to another school because he was deeply unhappy in the class he was in. It was a class of 30 and there were numerous ongoing behaviour problems and he was coming out of school angry and frustrated and often tearful. I raised a few concerns over the last term with the teachers but they were pretty dismissive, although one of the TA's was lovely and really seemed to try to look out for him at playtimes. Eventually decided to move him to a new school and was as open and diplomatic as I could be in the circumstances.

My older son is still at the old school because he is very happy there and will leave in July anyway.

Ds2's old class was a job share and I know both teachers pretty well, since one of them has a son in ds1's class, and the other has a daughter who plays with ds3 at nursery. Since ds2 left, both teachers have barely acknowledged me, although I see one or the other every day when I'm picking up ds1. I texted Teacher 2 the other day to invite her daughter round to play with ds3 and got a curt refusal. Neither has even said hello to ds2 or asked him how he was getting on at his new school. Took Teacher 1's son out the other weekend with mine and she got her dh to drop him off and pick him up and hasn't said thank you when I have seen her since.

I'm not sure what I expected, but I'm struggling to see their attitude as anything but petty and rude. I was really careful not to criticise them as teachers to the head because I wanted to try to stay on good terms with them for everyone's sake but it looks like they have taken offence anyway. I have been very involved in said school over the years. Regularly help out on school trips, run stalls at school fairs, etc etc. It's not me, is it? They are being dickheads, aren't they?

Well I'm very glad that it has worked out. I guess you just need to respect their wishes to maintain some distance.

Doesn't look like I have much choice! Ah well.

I'm surprised by the responses on this thread. It's a great shame that you can't say 'sorry but this isn't right for my child' without you and your child being socially cut off - especially when you have been so nice about it.

Teachers get too big for their boots sometimes.

Teachers get too big for their boots sometimes

Yes, as do we all from time to time, but that's not what this is about. They're just human beings who are hurt and choosing to socialise with other people.

Not acknowledging the 6 year old is unprofessional but the decision to no longer allow their children to socialise with the OP's children is probably wise

I know this was said a while ago, but this is frankly bizarre and an infringement of the children's rights, IMHO

I don't really understand how it is an infringement of children's rights - isn't it up to the parent to decide who mixes with their child (certainly at this age) outside of school? In any case, it is possible that the teachers have been discouraged from doing this by senior management or possibly their union.

But the OP hasn't criticised the teachers. She has simply moved her son to an environment that suits him better. If she had an issue with teaching at the school she wouldn't have left her first child there.

The teacher was fine about it from the start, OP, in our situation. Other parents took time to get used to it though (also a village school where several teachers have children in the school).

It's possible that they just feel awkward about it and that might ease over time?

Is this the first time you've been in this situation in your little community? I'm actually surprised. We live somewhere now where everyone is interlinked and you have to be so careful what you say to whom. It is very easy to offend someone or give someone bad press without intention, even via second hand rumours.

If she had an issue with teaching at the school she wouldn't have left her first child there

But DC1 is in year 6 and not being taught by the teachers who have a strop on.

If there are any signs of potential "difficulties" with a parent, I would immediately cease all social contact to avoid potentially making the professional relationship more awkward or clouding the situation unnecessarily.

I have, for example, blocked ex-colleagues on Facebook if I start teaching their children, particularly if there are any "issues". I can't imagine anything worse than being in a meeting with a headteacher, and a parent/friend quoting back my Facebook status, or something I said on a Saturday at the end of a play date.

I think the teacher ARE acting professionally. They are not acting as your friend. These things are not the same.

Your child is your priority. Your child is no one else's top priority. The teacher has 29 other kids to deal with. I am that anyone thinks the teacher is bring unprofessional or whatever by "ignoring" the child (and to the poster who was aggrieved because her DC left a school and the teacher didn't give them a card - I mean, seriously??) Teaching is a job. Teachers deal with the kids in front of them. If you remove your child from their class, why would you expect them to continue any kind of relationship?

Distancing themselves from the situation is the professional thing to do.

I don't think the teachers are doing anything wrong. You don't have a child in their class any more, so why would they spend time chatting to you when they have parents of children in their class to deal with? Really, as a teacher you spend your days relating to so many people that you aren't looking for extra people to talk to. Teachers chat to parents when they have a child in their class, and then when the child leaves, they move on. Regarding the text, maybe it wasn't curt - maybe she was just busy. Maybe her husband left off/ picked up because that was what they agreed to do. I think you are worried about this and looking for signs to make it something to so with you, but I can't see anything in your OP that suggests that.

Now that you've explained how you wanted the teacher to handle the unpleasantness that was going on in the class, I think YAB a wee bit U. Mostly because I think you expect a little bit too much.

That kind of socialisation and support is for a parent or other family/friend to deliver rather than a teacher. A teacher is there to keep order and discipline, teach academic knowledge and learning skills. If you child wasn't being bullied then they did their job.

It's a big class, it could just be too much to expect that everyone gets one really well in that size of class- that's part of the reason why people are so keen on smaller class sizes. The kind of intervention you wanted could easily backfire too- both in terms of general classroom management and how your child learns to deal with others.

I do agree that people should be allowed to do whatever is best for their child (as long as it doesn't harm others) without suffering backlash. But that might not be what is going on here.

Its conceivable that when you asked for them to support your child and provide strategies for improving the atmosphere in the class, it was perceived as you "asking for special treatment" due to your social connection. And therefore stepping over the line. Then when that didn't happen, it could look like you punished them for not "doing a favour" (complaint about trip, moving your child).

It was nice of the teaching assistant to look out for your child, and this was probably more in line with a TA's role. But, just as with adults, not every group of people will get on and if the class hasn't gelled, then I don't think there is a magic wand that can be waved to make everything ok (just as there isn't a magic wand to wave to make it ok with the teachers).

lostinmiddlemarch
"I'm surprised by the responses on this thread. It's a great shame that you can't say 'sorry but this isn't right for my child' without you and your child being socially cut off - especially when you have been so nice about it."

But they are not the OP's friends, they have never been the OP's friends, from what I can see she is still able to use their children to socialise etc. it is just that the teachers are not giving her what she wants entirely on her terms.

I very much doubt it is a case of the distance being unprofessional now, more likely that the friendliness was purely professional before.

You have done what you feel is best for your child however, the teachers don't have to agree or continue the relationship on your terms. You have been clear that you didn't regard them as friends so why the angst? My daughter was at a playdate last week. DH collected her and said thanks. I didn't then call or text child's parent to thank them again.

Perhaps the teachers regarded you in a similar manner and now they don't have a professional relationship with you they are happy to let the personal one slide too?

Such is village life.
Removing a child mid year is a big thing to do. Good that its worked well for you but bound to have repercussions

it is just that the teachers are not giving her what she wants entirely on her terms.

I don't think it is on her terms any more than it should be on their terms; the point is that there is no good reason for suddenly stopping contact that is friendly, pleasant, reasonable and actually not related to her having a child in their class. Saying 'hello' to a woman and child that you know is just being decent. It would be different if she had been rude but she was clearly very respectful, reasonable and didn't give them a reason to view her differently, other than saying that what they were offering wasn't right for their child. I have taught a great deal one-to-one and wouldn't dream of thinking I was the right fit for every child. The idea of refusing to speak to the child and attempting to more or less delete them from my life is egotistical and petty.

As for schools advising teachers to cut parents off if there's any hint of them having a complaint with the school - WTF?? A comment suggesting there's a need for something to change can be constructive and non-threatening. It doesn't have to be feared or responded to so defensively. How does this even work without bloodshed in a village community?

Madness.

lostinmiddlemarch

From the OP

"Since ds2 left, both teachers have barely acknowledged me, although I see one or the other every day when I'm picking up ds1."

The teacher still has 30(ish) children to look after and parents to hand them off to, when in the playground will she get time to do this?

"I texted Teacher 2 the other day to invite her daughter round to play with ds3 and got a curt refusal."

The Op reading something in to a text that wasn't there?

"Neither has even said hello to ds2 or asked him how he was getting on at his new school."

When are they supposed to do this? In the playground whilst sorting out other children, When getting on with their lives outside of school?

"Took Teacher 1's son out the other weekend with mine and she got her dh to drop him off and pick him up and hasn't said thank you when I have seen her since."

The teacher may have been busy with marking, resting or ill, is there a reason why the teacher has to come round instead of her DH? And why would she thank the OP if her DH has already done so?

Sorry missed this

"As for schools advising teachers to cut parents off if there's any hint of them having a complaint with the school - WTF?? A comment suggesting there's a need for something to change can be constructive and non-threatening. It doesn't have to be feared or responded to so defensively. How does this even work without bloodshed in a village community?"

Some schools advise, as part of their online social media policy, not to have any onlne contact with parents of children at all.

The teachers may just simply be busy - it is mid term - and tired, especially if they have a large, demanding class. They are probably preoccupied with other things.

The teacher still has 30(ish) children to look after and parents to hand them off to, when in the playground will she get time to do this?

Are you seriously suggesting the woman is too busy to smile when their eyes meet?

Some schools advise, as part of their online social media policy, not to have any onlne contact with parents of children at all.

That's different. And clearly not the case here.

lostinmiddlemarch

"Are you seriously suggesting the woman is too busy to smile when their eyes meet?"

I'm "seriously suggesting" that the the OP is reading too much in to too little and being just a bit bit precious about the whole thing.

The teachers should be professional enough to acknowledge you but just a quick query. Are you sure you know what your son will have said about his switching schools? Are you sure all your conversations regarding the school were not said in his hearing? I have previously had weeks of a child talking about how the school is not very good at this and that, another school is better and then after they left their sibling explaining they left because this school is no good because of bullying and the headteacher is rubbish. (All of which are fine as they are children making sense of change but extremely wearing when you are slogging your way through term and really doing your best) The parent might not have said to me what the reasons were but I certainly has been told them all and I tried to have patience with the child when I saw them but they did have a habit of interrupting my marking to tell me why their new school was better. ( and as a postscript they discovered this wasn't necessarily true and returned to the school later!)

Sorry to harp on, but just to clarify: I'm not talking about not being acknowledged when either teacher is engaged with parents or the kids in their class. I'm talking about not being acknowledged when I have a) been standing a few feet away from Teacher 1 when she is waiting to pick up her son who is in my son's class on her days off, and b) passing Teacher 2 in the playground when she has been collecting her child at the school on her days off, I'm not imagining things, I wish I were! And of course I realise that clearly the relationship has changed now, I just rather hoped that normal civility could be maintained!

shouldhavedoneitsooner You may be right there. Gossip is about the only thing that does travel fast around here and no I don't know for sure exactly what has been said although I was clear with ds1 and ds2 that there was to be no "my school is better" etc etc. My conscience is clear, because I have said and continue to say that the school has been fantastic for ds1, as were the teachers in question.