In thinking that i cannot ignore my brother calling my 4yr old ds a prick?

[AfroPuffs]

Will try to be brief but I've been a combination of livid, tearful, disappointed, hurt for hours now and i cannot get to sleep!

So usual sunday dinner at parents, my brother is very early twenties and usually lovely!

My 4yr old ds is also lovely but can get over-excited, get a bit OTT and on occasion is spirited, stubborn argumentative. Usual 4yr old stuff which is usually managed by removal of toys/tablet/activity etc.

My ds and my bro have a good relationship and there is a lot of banter between them i suppose...play-fighting, tickling, calling each other funny/silly names in jest.

This happened today as normal, but when me and ds were getting into brothers car to get a ride home, my brother very suddenly took offence to being called a silly name. My ds had a little bag of sweeties that his gran had given to him and in anger my brother snatched it away and was winding ds up, who was crying about his sweeties at this point.

My ds was screaming and crying and i tried to just get him in the car/calm him down. I also told my brother then to stop because its winding him up etc. As ds went to get in the car he shoved my brother and my brother then yanked off ds' woolly hat from behind and called him a prick.

G'parents had come out to the drive by this point and my mum just got my brother inside, while he yelled about my parenting skills and called me a cunt. My mum closed the front door and so i just left with ds.

My mum texted me later to check if we got home ok and said 'i dont know why you didnt let me give you a lift home". I replied that i was trying to get my ds as far away as poss from the bully! She hasnt responded and i suppose will take my brothers side as usual.

Am i wrong to be upset about this? They seem to be ignoring the whole thing and im just so upset. How can you call 4yr old a prick?! I get that my ds can get a bit carried away...but if the banter is fine with you at 2pm, then why be offended at 7pm?!

Your brother was disgusting
But, re your last post I wonder is there an issue with ur ds behaviour, separate completely from what ur brother said. Is he out of control and does this concern your patents? Maybe not which is fine, but maybe think objectively.

Tbh I'd talk to your brother tomorrow re what happened. Maybe there's something happened you don't know. I'm not suggesting he's in any way reasonable to use language he did but if its out of character maybe there's something else going on

If your brother behaves like a four year-old rather than an adult uncle, with the teasing, name-calling, hat-pulling and sweet-taking, followed by a tantrum, he deserves that you go non-contact.

His behaviour was appalling.

I think that ds had normal 4yr old behaviour. I personally put a lot of pressure on myself and worry "am i doing enough" re discipline as im a single parent and so i feel that have to prove myself ifyswim.

Ds is lovely, kind, good manners etc but like most kids can get carried away and listening goes out the window. He had a bad phase earlier in the year re hitting, but he stopped that a good while back. When he gets frustrated or upset i give him cuddles and get him to sit down in his room until he calms down and is ready to talk. Its been effective so far.

I feel like because he used to be badly behaved he cant escape the reputation where my parents are concerned...but i refuse to smack him. I just dont think that is going to help an already spirited child.

No matter what, he didnt deserve to be shouted at and called names by a fully grown man

AfroPuffs I am sorry his has happened. It is totally unfair. Your poor ds must be so confused.

Re Its quite out of character, but maybe this is how he truly feels about us!

In your shoes I would speak to you brother and explain how hurt and angry I was. Bot words totally inappropriate.

To be honest I am also even more shocked your mum let you take the bus and train home on a cold day with four year old.

I am not really sure how your mum can make this your fault at all. I would explain to her how hurt you feel. If they have any issues with your parenting at all, not that they should, but if they did they should talk about things sensibly and normally not use swear words.

I am going to go out here on a limb (!!) and say your brother is very childish for 20 something and he is in some way jealous of your son, who is a threat to him (does your bother still live at home?). Your mum is maybe trying to manage these conflicts and taking her son's side and in the process hurting you, probably unintentionally.

I think it is time for some gentle family dialogue, ideally when you son is not around. Could you meet mum for coffee, with out son around, chat to brother by phone or whatever.

Whatever happens no more name calling, for either of them, and no more play fights. It is clear your brother can't handle it, which is sad but there you go.

Sorry the bad phase in my last post was actually early 2015...i keep forgetting we are now in Jan 2016! Ooops!

But thanks Italian, i will try and have a conversation with my mum to discuss, but i dont think i can even bring myself to speak to my brother just yet. I cant believe what he did/said!

My brother still lives at home but not sure why he would be jealous or anything. He just seemed to take all the teasing personally...and if thats how he felt he should have communicated this to my ds (or me). He is a grown up after all and sadly im not a mind reader! He was totally out of order.

Idunno, I think the whole thing is a bit grim, tbh. I'm not sure I would let a 4yo of mine play games with any adult that involved stupid name-calling. A four year old is always going to struggle with knowing where the boundaries are (however 'silly' you think names like 'fartypants' are).

BIL is a bit like this and I always get the children to stop as I think it isn't appropriate, however hysterical BIL thinks it is.

That said, of course your brother should be able to set a line and not cross it, even if a 4yo can't be trusted not to. Even playing such a game is a stupid idea.

It's often the case that if a parent thinks their child can be a bit unruly or go too far that they are not understanding the full extent of the behaviour from an outsider's view.

That doesn't excuse your brother's behaviour, obviously, but anyone that brushes off rude behaviour by suggesting it is 'typical 4yo' stuff often doesn't know what typical 4yo stuff is.

End the silly name calling games. Hopefully your bro will apologise and explain what happened (I doubt it though - I know my BIL wouldn't - his immaturity is legendary, which is why I won't let the kids play stupid name-calling or 'silly' rude games with him). His language was clearly beyond the pale, but I would also be taking a harder look at the behaviour of ds as well, and stepping in when you know that a game can easily get out of control, especially if both players have the maturity of a 4yo. It always ends in tears eventually.

OP, lose the idea that this is 'usual 4 year old stuff', because it is not. You seem to be completely convinced that your DS is behaving like all other four year olds, but most parents don't let their 4 year olds call grown-ups (or anybody else) 'fartypants' or similar silly names. When dd was in reception some kids called her 'poopyhead' (well you might laugh) and the teacher pulled them up on it because it's not ok to teach kids that calling others names is ok (even though privately you might think it's quite funny and harmless).

Forget about your rude brother, and focus on your rude child because at least with your child there is something you can do to set him right (not much you can do about correcting your brother at this point, he is a grown man).

I think your brother exploded because it was outside the house and he felt embarrassed. Doesn't excuse his behaviour though.

Id personally wouldn't talk to him again especially if you think that's his personality and he might do it again
You need to show your ds that what he did was wrong and you won't do that by just forgetting about it
If you really want to restore the relationship he must apologise to ds first!

He just seemed to take all the teasing personally.
Tbf they shouldn't tease each other with name calling but again inexcusable what he did

Can't believe some on this thread are calling out a 4 year old for calling his uncle "fartypants", calling the wee boy "rude".

Get a bloomin' grip folks, the boy is FOUR.

There's no excuse for your brother to use that sort of language especially in front of a child!! I would talk to your mum about it and when everything has calmed down a bit talk to your brother. If anyone called me the c word I would be heartbroken especially if it was my brother! I hope you manage to sort it out.

I was more shocked about him calling you a cunt. Wow! It does sound like he lost his temper. It sounds like you have a lot of issues with your family though. Your brother is spoilt, your dad sticks his head in the sand and your mum doesn't support you. Your a single mum with no real support, it must be tough.

Sorry I've not read all the replies, so this might have already been said, but my feeling is its never ok to use that type of language, including what he called you in front of a child.
I also feel that as he spent the afternoon winding up your child it's a bit unfair to expect him (your ds) to behave calmly, I think your dbro is very much in the wrong here, and your dmum should be being more helpful and supportive to you.

Your brother sounds immature and unboundaried and your mums reaction indicates that this behaviour is quite usual for him. I would go so far as to say he sounds like a bully. I think a period of distancing yourself from him would be a good move not least because he sounds like a bad role model.

I was concerned to read that your DS pushed your brother at one point. That also indicates a lack of boundaries perhaps picked up from emulating his uncle. If he is shoving adults out of anger and frustration he could well start getting physical in the playground and classroom which would not be a positive start to school life. Not to mention bickering with teachers in the childlike way he does with his adult uncle.

Your brother has not learned about age appropriate behaviour/self control and your son and you got the raw end of that. take the opportunity to explain to your son why the whole incident was not ok and learn from his uncles mistakes.

Thanks again for the replies. I have had a rough night and feeling pretty crap this morning.

I just want to make clear that i have NO IDEA re a similar thread, so can folks stop hunting.

I fully accept and have mentioned my ds' behaviour, which is most certainly a work in progress. Its not easy but he has improved loads so i think its unfair. Im just calling it out as i think its the reason why my parents did nothing, they are judging him by his previous/old behaviours.

I dont think any child should be subjected to violent and aggressive treatment. If you dont like something that they are doing, make their parent aware or as an uncle then pull them up on it. Discuss with the child. They learn from US after all dont they?!

My brother is stubborn so doubt he is going to say sorry to me.

Distancing sounds like a good idea...

It got out of hand, too much mucking about and he used language that he probably uses with his mates. But he is an idiot to get upset over a 4 year old calling him names. Looks like some behaviour boundaries need to be introduced between them tbh, otherwise you can just imagine how it will end up when DS is a teenager.

Nothing about the child's behaviour strikes me as out of the ordinary for a wound-up four-year-old, but your family sound ghastly.

Your brother needs to realise that you don't have 'banter' with a four year old the way you do with adult friends in the pub (where male/male banter goes to some fairly unpleasant places), and that if, unwisely, you've allowed that kind of name-calling to become established with a small child, you can't suddenly turn on them in anger, subject them and their mother to foul-mouthed abuse, and change the 'rules' without frightening the child.

He behaved very badly, and you weren't in the least unreasonable in leaving alone, though of course your parents, if able, shouldn't gave let you walk in the cold.

The only place where you were possibly at fault is letting your DB and DS do that name-calling so much - are you overlooking your brother's temper and immaturity because you want him as a close male figure in your DS's life?

Don't dream of apologising, or letting anyone pretend you are at fault. Even if your DB is penitent, I'd be wary of letting someone with no hold over his temper around a small child who needs to know a loved adult won't turn on him.

Your dd has behaved like a complete arse. It is NEVER OK to call a child a prick - or you a cunt! - that's vile.

Does your db often wind up your ds while they are playing? Sounds like ds got over-excite, db suddenly changed the rules and got cross -that's not on. Your ds isn't an adult like your db, and can't understand when things change like that.

Sounds like your parents are being wimps by ignoring your b's crappy behaviour.

There's nothing wrong with your little boy calling someone they adore a cheeky name like fartypants. It's natural for a little boy to be silly. But your brother behaved like a disgusting pig, so totally aggressive and turning on you. He snatches the 4 year olds sweets off him, pulls off his little hat and calls him a "prick". Then he called you a "cunt" and said your parenting skills are bad. Very nasty. Just curious but is he unemployed?
If I was in your shoes I would sever ties from them and stop contacting them. No one deserves to be spoken to like that.

My first thought was drugs. This would explain the complete mood change with your brother.

I don't see a problem with calling an uncle a silly name. My DC do it to my DB's and they take it in the manner it was intended. Im a midday and one of the kids called me a silly sausage the other day and I just laughed. I don't get the issue there. Your brother is being ridiculous. And to call you a cunt is just beyond the pale. Have more faith in your parenting skills. You sound beaten down by what you're family think but it sounds to me as if you're doing just fine. Really though, you should not have to out up with that and I think it will be damaging in the long term for you to continue contact if this dynamic continues. He is your son. Parent how you see fit.

Are you sure it's not your brother who's the four-year-old? Getting upset by a child's insult and grabbing their hat off them doesn't sound like adult behaviour.

And of course he shouldn't call a child a prick to their face. Or you a cunt.

He can fuck off to the far side of fuck IMO. And your mum, if she honestly thinks he's the one in the right.