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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

In tears

487 replies

G1veMeStrength · 02/12/2015 22:40

Fucking parliament. You utter bastards. You're going to kill people and it won't stop anything.

OP posts:
WorzelsCornyBrows · 02/12/2015 23:16

We have carried out over 1600 sorties against Isis in Iraq, which has achieved the grand sum of fuck all. The US, Russia and France are already fighting Isis in Syria and it is achieving fuck all.

Even if we do manage to wipe out Isis, which we won't, what then? Do we then go to war with Russia over Assad?

If we should have learned one thing about intervention in the Middle East it should be that we should absolutely know what we want the end game to be, before we decide how to do it.

These air strikes will only serve to make things worse imo.

Witchend · 02/12/2015 23:16

It was war anyway.
ISIS had basically already declared war on us. They don't say leave us alone and we'll leave you alone. They will come anyway because they hate us because we are not with them.

As far as they are concerned there are two positions: with them and all they stand for, anyone else is against them. There is no neutral.

If we hadn't gone in it could well be a case of:

"First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Socialist.

Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Trade Unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me."

I am also certain that if there was a viable way of sending the Secret Service in and sorting it then they would have done that. If nothing else it would be much cheaper for them.

seasidesally · 02/12/2015 23:16

come on op thats not a solution really is it "get a group of intelligent people together" thats not a solution

UterusUterusGhali · 02/12/2015 23:16

Jesus wept, Gone.
That's obscene.

sharoncarol43 · 02/12/2015 23:16

I'd also like to know where the money will come from. Social care budget again?!

actually, it is first and foremost what a government is FOR, defending it's citizens and nothing else.

viioletsarentblue · 02/12/2015 23:17

A bit harsh sharon, but I agree with you. The decision has bee made.

Original poster
G1veMeStrength · 02/12/2015 23:17

Yes Sharon, I have. See Dresden for example. Heartbreaking.

OP posts:
GiddyOnZackHunt · 02/12/2015 23:17

Gone what are you talking about? Hmm

rageagainsttheBIL · 02/12/2015 23:18

What makes the Syrian people so innocent anyway; they are the parents and teachers of the terrorists.

Jesus wept. It's shite like this that scares me almost as much as terrorism does sometimes...

fanjoforthemammaries7850 · 02/12/2015 23:18

It isn't defending its citizens though. Quite the opposite.

meditrina · 02/12/2015 23:18

Syria is already being bombed. The "collateral damage" is happening irrespective of our participation.

I agree with the previous poster who said this is as much about standing with our allies.

And being a full participant means we get a better voice in the diplomacy and planning that will also be going on. Any initiatives we want to see to get the right thing happening next, will carry more weight than if we were not involved. But that means having a set of options and plans. And I'm not sure we have them.

Corbyn though diplomacy without the application of force could bring about a solution. Now, he's not going to see the a version without the application of force. But equally I can't see any reason why his ideas could not also be used when backed by force. So his next challenge, I think, is to accept what is happening and articulate the diplomatic path he recommends and push for his options to be adopted.

fanjoforthemammaries7850 · 02/12/2015 23:18

Op I am in full agreement with you.

Some not too bright people on this thread

BeyondThirty · 02/12/2015 23:18

There is at least one mner who has family in syria.

And yes, as someone whose family line is part from the axis side, i would cry for bombed german civilians in ww2 Hmm

kinkytoes · 02/12/2015 23:19

Isis or daesh or whoever will continue to grow and target the UK regardless of whether we decide to bomb or not. We can't simply let them ride roughshod over the middle east and then the rest of the world without at least trying to do something to stop them. Innocent people will die whatever happens, and terrorism will always exist in some form or other. But we do have to try and stop it, even if it means making very difficult decisions.

MissFitt68 · 02/12/2015 23:19

Op's solution.... Get a group of women together to sort it

Lol, only on mumsnet!

wasonthelist · 02/12/2015 23:19

Witchend - Do you really think airstrikes are going to stop ISIS "coming for" you?

sharoncarol43 · 02/12/2015 23:19

And no, I don't believe my family is safe from terrorism, we are at a higher than average risk as it happens,

so live with it, like we all do.

GROW UP!

We are not living in an age of happy ever afters in fairy land.

Shockers · 02/12/2015 23:20

Get off the OP's case. If she's feeling frustrated and powerless, it's because she really is. It's out of the hands of the hoi palloi now.

The world needs more folk who care. They provide balance and hope for our future as a humanity.

fanjoforthemammaries7850 · 02/12/2015 23:20

Syria is already being bombed. The "collateral damage" is happening irrespective of our participation.

Oh well, fuck 'em then

Hmm
chilledwarmth · 02/12/2015 23:20

I don't see the comparisons with Nazi Germany. The Germans were going to invade you and then once you'd all been conquered they were going to get on boats, have a little sail and come and invade us. ISIS don't seem to be doing that, they just seem to be hanging around the territory of Iraq and Syria that they have. When they attack it's a suicide bombing type of attack rather than an actual invasion, and that suggests it's more of a revenge thing rather than an attempt to physically conquer us. If they are killing us as revenge for the people we kill, and we kill them in revenge for the people they kill, that's not a good loop to get into, and sometimes being the "wimp" who wants to break the cycle, not pull the trigger, and not take revenge, is the best choice.

GiddyOnZackHunt · 02/12/2015 23:21

Sharon but this makes no difference to our safety apparently. We were on a severe risk anyway. So how does it change our status?
Intelligence has prevented at least 7 attacks according to reports. How much intelligence does one Tornado flight equal?

fanjoforthemammaries7850 · 02/12/2015 23:21

Sharon who do you think you are to shout at the op to grow up?

BeyondThirty · 02/12/2015 23:21

Shouting at someone to grow up isnt a particularly grown up thing to do...

shivermytimbers · 02/12/2015 23:22

I think we are now much more at risk of attack than before and haves paved the way for yet more, endless rounds of conflict which do nothing to solve any of the problems they supposedly tackle. I'm amazed that people have such short memories following the disastrous pigs ear we made of Iraq. Sad times and some really sad attitudes on this thread

passmethewineplease · 02/12/2015 23:22

Seriously gone? Your post is utter shit.

What about the poor fucking children? They have no idea there country is probably going to get bombed in a few hours...

Those MPs that cheered for war make me sick tbh.

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