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Original poster

Awkward wedding family situation

245 replies

Pepper12 · 23/11/2015 22:16

Hello all sorry this may be long!
Backstory I have 2 brothers. Brother 1 is getting married in March. Been together a few years no dcs. Brother 2 married for years has 4 kids from 7 to 2 months.

Brother 1 has asked brother 2 eldest child to be flower girl as she was so excited about wedding. All fine and dandy-dress shoes etc bought last week. Invitations have now arrived and wording as follows ' we respectfully inform that with the exception niece and fiances niece no children will be permitted at the wedding'. Brother 2 wife has gone mad how dare her 3 other kids (who to be fair are 3,2 and a baby) be excluded hence the eldest is now banned from being flower girl. Brother 1 and fiancée have stood firm and explained that niece is old enough and others are too young. Fiancées niece being flower girl is an only child. Cue me getting phone calls from sil and two brothers all wanting an opinion ! Is it awful that I think your circus your monkeys? Grrrrr

OP posts:
LeaLeander · 24/11/2015 22:51

Thank you. I did say quite high up in the thread that the invitation/flower-girl overture was handled badly on the part of the bride and groom. No argument there.

But making the flower girl's participation conditional on the attendance of three very tiny little kids is selfish and attention-mongering. And I refute the notion that with four months notice it is impossible to find child care for the duration of one day. If one is truly interested in so doing.

Also, from the Oxford English Dictionary:
Definition of scoot in English:
verb
[no object] informal
Go or leave somewhere quickly: I’d better scoot
Grin

Gladysandtheflathamsandwich · 24/11/2015 22:54

If one is truly interested in so doing.

Too much.

You nearly had me, but that was just a step too far. Nice try though.

expatinscotland · 24/11/2015 22:58

'As to babysitters, well, yes, I would consider it Parenting 101 to have a couple of reliable sitters on tap for when the parents wish to go out without (all of) the children. Everyone I know of, does, and surely attending one's own brother's wedding is worth the cost of a sitter?'

What a nice world to live in then. How pleasant that must be. In Planet Reality, plenty of people don't have 'a couple of reliable sitters on top'. I don't know many who do, in fact.

Headofthehive55 · 24/11/2015 23:20

lea tablecloths are quite normal here in England. I wouldn't think a tablecloth and cutlery are a mark of an elegant dining experience, it's just perfectly normal.

reni2 · 24/11/2015 23:20

I do have reliable sitters on tap. I did not, however, have a wet nurse when breastfeeding so leaving baby would not have been an option.

goshhhhhh · 24/11/2015 23:27

So just asked dh what he thought - his words were -"it's one thing having a child free wedding & it's another using a child" - that's the crux of it - it's a bit off.

LeaLeander · 24/11/2015 23:28

Of course, I meant as opposed to an informal backyard or pub meal.

But are 2-year-olds and 3-year-olds able to sit up at the nicely-appointed table, feed themselves independently with said cutlery, and avoid soiling the tablecloth or making any other sort of mess? That was my point. Presumably kids 7 and older can do all of the above and also take themselves to lavatory without parental help, refrain from squealing at key moments, etc. - so they are in a different category of potential wedding participant than is a diapered toddler. Whether or not they have blood ties to the bride or groom; there is more to being a desirable guest than that.

Gladysandtheflathamsandwich · 24/11/2015 23:29

Well quite head

They are basic minimum requirement for dinner surely?!

Gladysandtheflathamsandwich · 24/11/2015 23:30

Lavatory - Non U. You're trying too hard now.

goshhhhhh · 24/11/2015 23:31

Btw - I had a child free wedding (as my family is so enormous - but of course invited my sibling's children & invited my recently bereaved cousin's children, & babes in arms (breastfeeding babies). Was v clear on invites & friend turned up with her older children & of course we accommodated. It is possible to be gracious and a bride.

BYOSnowman · 24/11/2015 23:31

My kids were capable of sitting at a table and not making a mess from the age of two. And the beauty of a wedding meal is that it goes on for ages and people are up and down all the time so the kids can go and chat to other family members or go outside and have a run around.

JassyRadlett · 25/11/2015 00:15

But are 2-year-olds and 3-year-olds able to sit up at the nicely-appointed table, feed themselves independently with said cutlery, and avoid soiling the tablecloth or making any other sort of mess?

Yes, and more so than many adult wedding guests by the time the meal rolls around in my experience!

The drinks while the endless photography happens between ceremony and meal tend to have that effect...

ThumbWitchesAbroad · 25/11/2015 02:08

"But are 2-year-olds and 3-year-olds able to sit up at the nicely-appointed table, feed themselves independently with said cutlery, and avoid soiling the tablecloth or making any other sort of mess?"

My husband still has trouble with this and he's 39! Grin

Baconyum · 25/11/2015 03:43

Lealander iirc from a post up thread doesn't have children.

I know MN is an 'open forum' but why would someone who clearly hates children (especially those in 'diapers') be on here?

And the scoot comment was a piss take! Look 'piss take' up.

Many toddlers behave much better than adults at weddings (as I'VE mentioned I was in the wedding business and witnessed many).

And yes this particular b&g are only interested in their 'perfect day' not in the comfort of or welcoming their GUESTS!

As for it being in a church, I'd be very interested in the ministers take on this! As pp have said church weddings are open to everyone, I'd be tempted to round up the local nursery and take them!

I think the b&g have created a nasty atmosphere for themselves. Appallingly ill thought out way to begin a MARRIAGE! You don't just marry a person their family comes with! And I say that as someone who didn't get on very well with my ex pil but I made the effort as they were my husbands parents. My sil is lovely (still friendly) and her kids were a toddler and babe in arms at our wedding. We had 18 under 10 at ours and as I said they were better behaved and more fun than the adults! In fact they jollied a few adults out of their bad behaviour!

ofallthenerve · 25/11/2015 07:20

In Lea's defence, weddings are quite different in the US IME. They tend to start later and not go on as long. So an 'on tap' babysitter wouldn't be looking after 3 kids for about 14 hours as they would at a wedding in the UK.

Baconyum · 25/11/2015 07:24

Then she should refrain from commenting on a subject she knows nothing about!

ofallthenerve · 25/11/2015 07:32

Well quoteBacon.

IME they do have a different tone - men wear tuxedos not morning suits, women wear cocktail dresses not sun dresses for example. They also seem to. Centre round the evening not afternoon. Stop me if I'm wrong! Just my experience.

ofallthenerve · 25/11/2015 07:36

quite Bacon*, not quote! She probably wouldn't have known there was a difference, in her defence. Not that I liked her comments but just tbf.

ThumbWitchesAbroad · 25/11/2015 09:05

No reason why Leander shouldn't be on here - plenty of people with no children, don't want children, have no prospects of having children are on here, and that's fine.

What's not fine is the disparaging remarks about children and the people who do have them, especially when coming from a point of ignorance/non-understanding of the issues.

I have no knowledge of American style weddings so can't comment on those, for example. ANd therefore won't.

expatinscotland · 25/11/2015 09:18

'In Lea's defence, weddings are quite different in the US IME. They tend to start later and not go on as long.'

I'm from the US and they don't have the two-tiered system of a meal for some guests early in the afternoon and an 'evening do'. If you are invited, you are invited to the whole thing.

YY, they generally start later and you go straight to the reception - meal+dance. Some can be really late - 7pm even.

Although for people who are very religious it can be different. I've been to plenty that were 'cake and punch' weddings. You go to church, usually early afternoon, and watch the couple get married. The reception follows, in the church hall, and consists of finger foods, coffee, non-alcoholic bevvies. Then the couple cut the cake and you eat a slice. And that's it. Home time.

I have a lot of American friends who are mothers and don't have babysitters 'on tap'.

It's a vast nation with hundreds of millions of people.

Jux · 25/11/2015 09:32

TBH, I would not let my 7yo go to the loo by herself in a public place, like a hotel, where there will be a lot of people in public areas who hve nothing to do with us, even if it were my best friend's wedding and I was missing the best speech to take her. Much easier to let her go by herself if it's a village hall or similar, and the only people there are wedding guests.

I still don't get child-free weddings, but partial child-free weddings just seem to inspire family disharmony. I do think you have to think of the comfort of your guests, and guests have to try to see the host's pov. Both sides carry duties and responsibilities to each other, and you have to give and take.

Somehow, weddings have become "All About the Bride and Bugger the Rest", these days. It's become more of a Show and less of a solemn ceremony.

HaydeeofMonteCristo · 25/11/2015 10:14

Why is everyone having a go at Leander for speaking English nicely? I know you might not agree with her, but I don't get that bit.

I wish I hadn't come back on here tbh, because I keep thinking about how unfair this outcome is on the 7 year old.

And I have no clue why Dad is going himself if the whole thing is such a big deal that his DD can't go. If she can't go, why can he?

TooSassy · 25/11/2015 11:11

The dad is probably going because he he caught between a rock and a hard place! It's his brother so he will be going for him and his parents.

But he's also probably in complete agreement at the total fuckwittery of the couple around this point. Uninviting most of the kids from the brothers family??? I'm actually stunned at the amount of people who think this is ok. If this was my family I absolutely would not have let it get to this point under ANY circumstances.

This is CLOSE family. Cousins of potential future children. Memories, photos, future gatherings...
The bride has truely fucked that up.

The DD will live. I think the SIL is completely right.

Wow. Just wow. I'm so glad I have my family. There's not many of us but it's times like this I realise I take their common sense for granted

ofallthenerve · 25/11/2015 11:29

I do find it a bit odd that some people think it's no biggie for the SIL with DCs to have to stay at home with her children (unless she can leave the baby with a babysitter which isn't possible if she's bfing), but preventing a 7yo from being a flower girl is somehow earth shatteringly cruel. I fail to follow that logic tbh. If it's no big deal then it's no big deal fine, but don't bang on about how dreadful it will be for the 7yo to lose out when it's not a big deal anyway.

reni2 · 25/11/2015 11:30

Mum misses it because she's bf a baby who's not invited
2yo misses it because they're not invited
3yo misses it because they're not invited
7yo misses it because it would be unfair
Dad goes because he wants as much peace as possible

Other guests will ask why brother 2 is alone and nieces and nephews are missing, especially since the bride's niece is there. It'll be smashing, they will look such a generous and warm-hearted couple.