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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

See all MNHQ comments on this thread

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Original poster

to not send my girls on this school trip because of my beliefs

942 replies

JustGiveMeTwoMinutes · 13/11/2015 16:39

The trip is to a mosque and the girls (year 3 and 4) have to cover their heads with a scarf, the boys don't have to.

Just to be clear about where I am coming from, this is about a specific practice which I believe is discriminatory and therefore disagree with. I would not choose myself to enter a building that I could only enter if I wore particular clothes but where that requirement was limited to one gender or one group defined by arbitrary characteristics. I would be happy to cover my head as a sign of respect/tradition if everyone entering the building was required to do so.

They can make their own decision on this when they are adults.

Am I being ridiculous and petty or is it reasonable to stand up for my view that just because a custom is part of a religion that does not excuse it being discriminatory?

OP posts:

OfaFrenchmind2 · 13/11/2015 17:06

I think we may be asking far too much of our girls in the name of "respect" and "other people's culture". Why, because in the past we were expected to cave to very demands? Fuck that!

IrisVillarca · 13/11/2015 17:07

What do they want to do?
They can visit and observe the practices without believing in it. It would be a good discussion point in school and at home.

WorraLiberty · 13/11/2015 17:07

YANBU. These school visits are nothing more than indoctrination sessions. No way would I let my children go. I hope that you hold firm.

Haha! How many have you been on?

The school visits are actually just a small part of educating children about the religions of other people in the community.

It has nothing to do with indoctrination.

cailindana · 13/11/2015 17:08

I am Catholic cailindana , didn't realise I was despised

So the fact that you are considered unworthy to lead mass is just down to...what?

villainousbroodmare · 13/11/2015 17:08

YABU.
They will learn nothing by not going except to be unwilling to make the slightest compromise to acknowledge the beliefs and customs of others.
They should see these things for themselves - that's the purpose of an educational trip.

Comingfoccacia · 13/11/2015 17:09

Don't men have to take their hats off in church? Whereas ladies are OK to keep them on....Only older girls/women need to over their head when entering a mosque. Both sexes have to remove their shoes. I do think YABU as you deprive them of the opportunity to learn about and understand about Islam instead of relying on media scaremongering and stereotyping. I know for certain that they will made really welcome.

SirChenjin · 13/11/2015 17:09

except to be unwilling to make the slightest compromise to acknowledge the beliefs and customs of others

How ironic.

zzzzz · 13/11/2015 17:09

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

SirChenjin · 13/11/2015 17:10

Men don't 'have' to do anything in church. If they wish to keep their hats on they can.

StanSmithsChin · 13/11/2015 17:10

Would people feel the same if the school trip was to a synagogue?

Jewish men are required to wear a kippah when praying however the women are not. Very similar to the worshiping/praying rules at a mosque.

VulcanWoman · 13/11/2015 17:10

I think it's worth the compromise for what they will gain from the experience, they'll most likely remember the experience for the rest of their lives, they'll need all these experiences to make their minds up in the future.
My Son learns a lot about different religions in his Philosophy class, he's not religious but enjoys and finds it interesting, it widens his horizons and his views on the world and it's people.

Jaxsbum · 13/11/2015 17:10

yabu
but envy you as that is all you have to worry about,,,,,a school trip

OurBlanche · 13/11/2015 17:11

Wow! So many issues.

As has been said, pre-pubescent girls aren't required to cover their hair.

Even if they were they would do so to show respect for the people in the mosque, not the religion itself.

If you are going to teach your girls how to recognise misogyny and understand why it is so vile then they will have to see it, experience it. And hair covering is a painless way of doing so. Easy to see and explain too.

YABU. Especially for this I would not choose myself to enter a building that I could only enter if I wore particular clothes but where that requirement was limited to one gender or one group defined by arbitrary characteristics.

Because you would, every working day of your life, just like everyone else does. For example: men must wear suits and ties in many jobs. Women do not!

ThroughThickAndThin01 · 13/11/2015 17:11

Tricky, and on reflection i think Yanbu ,

thebestfurchinchilla · 13/11/2015 17:12

cailindana I think your choice of word is too strong. I wouldn't have a problem with female priests and neither would a lot of Catholics. Maybe it will change in future as it has done in The church Of England. But to say women are despised is wrong.

evilcherub · 13/11/2015 17:12

YANBU. Your kids are hardly going to suffer if they miss one school trip. When they are older they can choose to decide to learn about other religions but let it be their choice, not thrust upon them.

cleaty · 13/11/2015 17:13

I have visited Christian churches where there was a dress code, but it applied to both sexes. Men were not allowed to wear shorts, just as women were not.

Girls and women having to cover their heads when boys and men don't is a misogynistic practice.

SirChenjin · 13/11/2015 17:13

The organisations which insist on suits and ties are the organisations which have a strict dress code across the piece - women will not be barred from entering the building or taking part in the business if they wear a skirt.

DolphinsPlayground · 13/11/2015 17:13

When dc went both the boys and the girls had to cover their heads.

romeomorningwhisky · 13/11/2015 17:14

That's like saying you wouldn't allow them to go on a fishing trip & wear waders which are part & parcel.
In my opinion.
Would it not be good to teach them respect for other traditions & to participate?
It's only a few hours.
It's no different from when we were kids & went to a Victorian museum & got dressed up in ridiculous Victorian style clothes for the duration.
YABU

Gileswithachainsaw · 13/11/2015 17:14

Yanbu.

if they don't have to all wear a scarf then none of them should have to. not even all Muslim. women wear a scarf.

I would not agree to my dd to attend anywhere where perfectly adequate clothing or exposure of arms or hair are too offensive or provocative to enter a building.
that goes fir any where.

MrsTerryPratchett · 13/11/2015 17:14

Because you would, every working day of your life, just like everyone else does. For example: men must wear suits and ties in many jobs. Women do not! And all the bare-chested men around every time there's a hint of sun.

IPityThePontipines · 13/11/2015 17:15

Our Blanche - very good point indeed.

cailindana · 13/11/2015 17:15

That's like saying you wouldn't allow them to go on a fishing trip & wear waders which are part & parcel.
In my opinion.

Eh? Waders are important equipment for fishing because without them you get very wet. What happens to a girl if she doesn't cover her head?

Gileswithachainsaw · 13/11/2015 17:15

how the hell cab you compare wafers to a head scarf?

ones a functional. item.to protect your clothes from the water ad add a degree of warmth.

the other is to stop men from.oggling hair

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