To wonder why so many Scottish people a thrilled when England do badly at sport?

[Jollyphonics]

I'm not bothered about the rugby at all personally, but this is irritating me. I have several Scottish friends, and their Facebook newsfeeds are full of gloating about England being knocked out of the world cup. It's a recurring theme with all sporting contests - mant Scottish people will support some random team from a country they've never heard of, if they're playing against England. I don't see the same with Wales and Ireland. Why is this? Is there that much resentment?

Pressed too soon ..

Which are a lot bigger than they are for Coventry City football club, with whom they share the ground.

Have to laugh at the assertions that grassroot English rugby clubs are full of upper class toffs - have any of you ever been to one?

That's not the assertion. The assertion is that (English) rugby union clubs are middle-class institutions.

30k crowds but not sell out as the tickets were given away. There certainly wasn't 30k crowd there yesterday!

Why do the SE English dislike the French? !066 and all the various wars since then - The 100yrs war, Napoleon etc - might have something to do with it. Add a sprinkling of monarchs from Europe. That's my guess. It's sounds similar to the Scots vs English thing but with less focus on dates before the mid-20th century.

I noticed lots of promotional material featuring cod heroic photos of England team members on display in Scottish branches of national chains ( but none featuring the Scottish team ), that kind of thing, coupled with the endless banging on about England in the media ( I bet far more People in Scotland can name the England Captain than the reverse), is asking for gloating when they lose.

Actually I thought that cut both ways. Before the rugby even started I was a FB post from a friend of a friend talking about "as long as we beat the sweaty socks". Charming...

Just watching John Whittindale The Secy. of State for Culture, Media and Sort at Tory Party Conference. He said he was disappointed that England were out of the Rugby World Cup but was pleased that 'our' team won the Women's World Cup. That's it in a nutshell for me.
These references piss people off. Don't get me started on Prince Charles 'who is the future King of England'.

oops I've misquoted him He didn't say ' but was pleased that 'our' team won the Women's World Cup'

Interesting from BBC site today

www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/rugby-union/34440468

• The RFU's target to introduce rugby union into 750 state secondary schools by the time of the World Cup in Japan in 2019 is laudable. But rugby union is a fiendishly complicated sport and many state secondary schools do not have the staff, the time or the resources to teach their kids how to play the game properly.

A less eye-catching, but arguably more important, plank of the RFU's legacy plan was the drive to recruit and train 2015 new 'level 2' coaches, which hit its target in July. The linking of schools to local clubs means kids from schools with limited resources can benefit from more specialised coaching and those same coaches can be sent into schools to make their rugby cultures more robust.*

This is off-topic but rugby strikes me as a terribly dangerous sport. I don't want my boys' heads being pummelled and sat on and their noses broken, and their ears made all funny. I honestly believe if rugby was invented today it wouldn't be played in schools - it's just so violent and horrible. I find it hard to watch to be honest.

I'd far rather my kids played football so well done RFU, but stay away from my precious kids!

I love it. It's actually partly to get this reaction that other countries won't support England.

Prior to tournament: we will win , we're brilliant, we invented all sports, everyone else is an also ran! They are all shit and will never equal us! Bow before the mighty men of England who will shortly conquer you all!

Knocked out in tournament: we've been cheated by some dastardly foreigns, French referee, we'll now support eh...you. What? Why do you think it's funny were out? We're the most magnanimous people ever! Why are you too inward looking and pathetic to accept our allegiance? Oh, it's terrible, why can't all other supporters be as sporting as we are? Why, among the nations of the world, must we be treated with such undeserved cruelty?

It's funny on its own merits, but the predictability actually makes it funnier.

Also, while NI might be what you call a home nation, Ireland isn't. And we don't really appreciate it.

Out of interest, how much does a professional rugby player earn compared to their footballing equivalent?

I fear England winning the World Cup for the same reasons I fear the death of the Queen.

The media would go into a meltdown, it would be news headlines for weeks on end and we're basically never hear the bloody end of it.

Out of interest, how much does a professional rugby player earn compared to their footballing equivalent?

A lot lot lot lot lot less

They are all shit and will never equal us! Bow before the mighty men of England who will shortly conquer you all!

Nothing like a bit of stereotyping and exaggeration is there

I fear England winning the World Cup for the same reasons I fear the death of the Queen.

They have won it, in 2003 and the women this year

I agree that it's a dangerous sport. I would rather my son played football but at the moment he has chosen rugby, alas.

East mids Mummy- visited many rugby clubs in England to obtain your expert viewpoint?

Football is also a physical sport with its own dangers, dd2 broke her arm playing and was operated on, whereas dd1 played rugby and broke her thumb without a need for an operation.

There was a footballer recently who broke his leg whilst playing. Rugby has injuries but so do other sports.

As a French person we especially dislike the English rugby team because historically they have always beaten us by 'cheating'. Ie playing boring yet chillingly efficient rugby and winding our (ill disciplined) players up until they lost it and mentally collapsed.
Any interview with Brian Moore fondly talking about his victories against France will do it.

There's also the v tedious 2003 WC win and Clive Woodward's 'an ugly win is still a win' approach which to French rugby afficionados (who still fondly remember 'le French Flair') is totally anti rugby.

Ironically we are now coached by a idiot guy who worships the Woodward approach and has consequently destroyed our game. Most French fans are counting the days till we are out of the World Cup and his (fantastic) successor takes over.

I've lived in England for a long time and love it here. Rugby is the exception.

Rugby players earn a lot less than footballers because rugby is a lot less popular and doesn't attract the sponsorship and big money TV deals that football does.

I agree that football's also physical, it's just there seems to be a lot more potential for head injuries in rugby.

East mids Mummy- visited many rugby clubs in England to obtain your expert viewpoint?

I have never claimed an expert viewpoint but it is informed by visiting 30 or more English rugby clubs (and a similar number of football clubs for comparison) with my boys.

At my sons last rugby match, 2 players were injured - one immobilised and ambulances to hospital with a possible neck injury. This is 13 yr olds and he hasn't been playing long. He played years of football and no player was ever taken to hospital by ambulance. I have no doubt that rugby has more potential for serious head, neck and spinal injuries - but the stats would be interesting.

From a BMJ article

"Comparison of the incidence of soccer and rugby injuries clearly indicates that rugby union is associated with a higher rate of injury than soccer. Specifically, the incidence of match injuries was more than twice as high in rugby players compared with soccer players. The greater degree of severity of rugby injuries was shown by the higher incidence of fractures and dislocations in the RG compared with the SG, and was further exemplified by the fact that three rugby players but no soccer players had to stop their participation in sport because of injury.

Both soccer and rugby injuries most frequently affected the lower extremity, consistent with the reports of other authors.10,11,23,25 Injuries of the shoulder, upper extremity, and head were more frequently incurred by rugby than by soccer players.

An increase in the incidence of injury with age has been shown previously for soccer5,16–18 as well as for rugby.26,28 In the present study, only the age groups of 16 and 17 year old players included a sufficient number of players for analysis. The previously described trend was found for soccer but not for rugby players. However, this result should be interpreted with caution due to the relatively small sample sizes. The analysis was mainly conducted to show that the results of the present study were not biased by the significantly younger age of the SG compared with the RG."

Rugby Union in England is still dominated by private schools
www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/rugby-union/34222183

As a Welsh person living in England I have found the media coverage teeth grindingly awful. I agree that the seeding / pools were a mess but the automatic assumption in the press that England would get through was ridiculous.

It would have been better for rugby as a whole if England had got through (perhaps by not having a pool of death) but they didn't play well enough.

I did support Australia against England because that way Wales would go through.

My DC play rugby at an English club and everyone I've met there is lovely whatever their allegiance. They were discussing what England did wrong and how the youth players in the club can learn from that rather than claiming "we was robbed".