To think either I'm a shit parent or young children suck the joy out of everything?

[Podsandpeas1]

Long sorry ...
Just had another trip out with the DC end in tears

DC are 5 and 3 . I took them out for breakfast to their favourite place this morning . No problems until we went to the toilets after.

Just general messing about , touching things and not listening whilst I'm trying to help each of them get sorted / hands washed etc.

Then we went to the park and this is where it got frustrating .

I was pushing both dds on the swings - there wasn't much enjoyment from any of us as they just kept whining to go higher / push me / not like that / do it this way / you missed me. Every bloody second .

Needless to say I got frustrated and told them one more go each and tried to show them how to swing themselves .

Oldest dd went in a huff , refused to try and said she wanted to go home and that she wished daddy was here (DH is away with work) . This is typical of her - huffs when she doesn't get what she wants , when she wants it and then turning mean.

I told her to stop spoiling stuff and she had hurt my feelings .

Both dds eventually managed to get themselves in to a game and played nicely together for all of five minutes !

I then had to police the taking of turns on the slide .

I also had to push them on the roundabout - I wasn't allowed to sit on it though - I had to stand and push them

We eventually have another go on the swings before we go home - more push me push me! . I gave them clear warnings when there was 5 minutes , 1 minute left etc.

Time to go and dd2 refuses to get off the swing . Tries to negotiate extra time and is clinging on. I tell her I'm going to pick her up and literally have to drag her off the swing

Obviously , now we are in tantrum mode and she sits on the floor refusing to move unless I carry her to the car - which is just a few metres away ! . I can't carry her as I have back problems so I say, ok I'm off to the car and turn my back on her .

She screams "I hate you" and cries and screams back to the car - giving the whole park some entertainment.

FFS ANOTHER attempt at trying to do something nice with them turns to shit .

I feel like all I'm doing is telling them NOT to do stuff - I was hoping the park would be a place for them to just run around and let off steam .

Would you have stood and pushed them over and over on the swings ? Was I being mean for not doing as they want the whole time ?

Surely in a small playground , they don't need me to helicopter them by now ?

This kind of thing happens all the time . I hate swings because of this very reason

There are a lot of things I could say but I am sending you a virtual hug instead. We all have days like this. Sometimes I have weeks like this! You are doing a great job. Positive parenting and blah blah blah, which you already do, will only work to a certain extent. The only cure for this problem is time. Young children are egotistical psychopaths and anyone who disagrees doesn't spend enough time with their own kids!

Hearing the word no especially ALL the time is not a particularly effective way of parenting. I don't like being told NO, why should children be any different? I do believe in boundaries though.

There are other ways of doing things, it doesn't need to be negative all the time. How about "Let's go now and we'll be home in time for some extra bedtime stories or dressing up together and you choose the costumes" or 'how about you tell ME a story on the way home and we'll draw it" or some such.

Funny how many parents think their children should do exactly what they're told ,when they're told and they forget what it's like being a child themselves.

Oh God OP I feel your pain.

Ds always just went off and played, dd (5) doesn't. She wants me to push her, watch her, catch her just give her attention all the time. She is the same at home. It's exhausting.

This stage is so boring, for some of us - eg me. ( teenagerdom is even more shit though, as both more expensive and you cannot physically remove them).

I discovered painfully what worked was

The countdown eg five more ( whatevers)
The if you do that once more we are going home, with follow through
The assertiveness technique. Repeating calmly several times like a mantra

We are going home now.

I can see you are upset.

I'm hearing but I'm not heeding.

Well, I will always love you, but I don't like your behaviour.

You just repeat, ad nauseam, until you move to the next phase.

They will wear themselves out . Good exercise for their lungs. . Don't worry. And they will learn that in the nicest way possible you are the force to be reckoned with.

My DM did this v successfully. It was a rare child she couldn't quell with an eyebrow.

And I completely agree, distraction.

We need to go hone to make x / see y. And I want to see if that ladybird we saw last time is there. Do you think it will be?

Agree ppeatfruit, that's exactly what I meant, you can set boundaries in a positive/fun way.

Wrt the Daddy talk to push your buttons op, I had a bit of this with my child (as he's df doesn't live with us) and I found it helped for me to stay completely emotionally neutral on the surface. I had a while of it, I made sure I always mentioned df in a positive light when he wasn't doing it so he knew it wasn't an avoided subject he could whack me with, if we were drawing for eg I would draw daddy and ds with a balloon, daddy and ds at the park etc. If you are very matter of fact in your response to manipulation and sulking missing Daddy, at the exact time you happening to be asserting yourself it looses it's power like any other form of tantrum or attempt at arguing with you that you don't entertain.
Do you think she got the impression the whole treat breakfast and park may have been a distraction for them so hams it up more?

Haven't RTFT so apologies if I'm repeating others but reading your post all I got was negatives and "No"s. From what I remember of that age that's almost guaranteed to result in bad behaviour. If you can possibly muster up the energy to do it a more positive approach often works...count down the last few swings, see who's the last to stop swinging, who can be first back to the car etc. we used to have a "who can be the quietest the longest" competition in the car . I totally know how draining it can be but sometimes biting your tongue and using distraction can be worth the effort.

I went out with a group of friends a few months ago and a friend of a friend asked what it's like having two children. I told her they suck the joy out of every single thing we do and someone always ends up in tears, not always the children. I then took a big gulp of wine and smiled maniacally. In hindsight I feel a bit sorry for her, I don't think she knew what to say

Young children are hideous at times, swings always create problems for us, so I don't take them to the play area in the park. They only ever want to go on the swings, they never want to get off and the place is full of other people's DC with exactly the same attitude to the swings. We go for walks in the wooded part of the woods instead and pretend we can see bears, gruffalos etc. it's so much easier!

I tell myself that when they're older the things I'll remember most are the good times, the sweet things they do, the hilarious things they come out with, not the time we'd all gone for a winter walk after I'd been stuck in bed for 3 months with an injury, only for the whole thing to be abandoned (with me silently sobbing) after 20 mins due to DD's mega-tantrum.

You've had a bad day, you're not a shit mum.

Small children are why alcohol was invented. Fact.

Sweetie - if you were a crap parent you wouldn't be beating yourself up over this. It is Hard Work. I love my 3 more than anything but my God, it's tough sometimes. Playgrounds and soft play are the work of the devil.

Chin chin

I feel a weight has lifted now they are 6 and 9, it really was just very hard work before now. My eldest has ASD so it might get better more quickly for you.

Simply have to divide and conquer, keep things short and sweet and allow lots of home time. Basically lower your expectations to rock bottom and things might seem better, good luck!

And bribe them, something immediate if they leave nicely, go out, get in the car, get out of the car etc etc

I used to go away from them, grit my teeth, count to 10, go back and smile and say something positive! It is very easy to get into a downward spiral.

I know how you feel. I really do.

Playing in the garden with 2 yr old ds yesterday. For a solid 30 minutes he repeated the following 'Mummy...erm, more. Mummy... erm, more' until I filled up the watering can; he emptied the watering can onto his shoes and the grass in 0.5 seconds, then 'Mummy...erm, more. erm, more' until I'd filled up the watering can and the water tipping began again. He's lucky he's cute or my patience would have run out a lot sooner! I'm not even sure what the 'erm' bit means! It was a beautiful autumn day, and I was glad to be outside with him, but seriously, I couldn't even pull up a single weed in the time it took for him to tip the water. So frustrating, but I know how short childhood is and i'm trying to enjoy the bits I can in between work and divorce and stress...

Oh, yes..bribery! It's the way to go!

YANBU its not just how wearing it is, its the fact that you feel utterly humiliated infront of the other parents whose kids seem to be behaving impicably whilst your kids fight and scream. Sometimes I think its easier not to take them anywhere nice as your hopes for a lovely day will undoubtedly be dashed. Happens to us all

Same here. I live in a fabulous city with endless cultural opportunities for kids. But what's the bloody point, he'd be as likely to kick off and make me look and feel like shit so it's vastly easier to stay at home or face the local park.

My FB feed is full of happy kids faces at beaches and attractions all over the place. Good for them, but I know how those days invariably end. I'm only willing to attempt it with Dp with me to share the load.

I can relate although I have an almost 3yo and a 4month old. But recently every time we go out anywhere, it's either the 3yo having a mega tantrum, or the 4month old becoming inconsolably over tired and screaming the place down or even both at the same time. More often than not I do wonder why we bother going out anywhere lately. It always seems like such a good idea until we actually get there.

I just try to remember that it does tend to get easier as they get older, and hopefully this time next year when DC2 is a little older and hopefully more flexible (I remember things becoming much easier after the 12month point with DC1) and hopefully DC1 will have started to be a bit more reasonable when it comes to tantrums, then trips out will become more enjoyable again.

I HATE THE PARK but if i really have to go,i pick the furthest one out.The bus out,something to eat and the bus home usually renders the time spent in the park bearable.

But they can really be funsuckers at the best of times.Mine are 4 ,6 and 7 and it is getting better.Very slowly and very surely.

What a depressing thread

What do you enjoy doing with them? Is it going for walks? Crafts? Baking? Snuggling up to watch a film? Whatever it is, do more of it. Build your relationship with them first, everything else is secondary.

This. Look up "yes parenting".

Its not depressing its been honest.I hate the park but i will bring them to musuems,on the train,on the luas.I find if you do what you enjoy they enjoy it as well

I remember this age

Benign neglect is the way forward, I'd take them somehere safe (like a park, quiet corner in the zoo, big field) and read a newspaper whilst they pottered about/argued/explored.

The KEY was to meet up with other like minded mums with kids of a similar age, so we'd have a coffee/chat keeping a sideways eye on the kids.

Try giving them a bit less attention? And avoid fucking swings until they don't need you to push them.

Also, it gets easier every year!!!

I call this 'forced fun'.

You have this lovely, picturesque vision in your head before children come along of how delightful your life is going to be with them. Picnics in the woods, chasing them around play parks whilst playing pirates, doing super fun day trips where you make lots of memories. But it's all a load of crap. Because the reality of it goes like this:

Parent: Where are your shoes?

Child: I don't know. Can I have pancakes for breakfast?

Parent: What do you mean you don't know? Where did you put them?

Child: Not sure. I want pancakes.

Parent: I don't have time to make pancakes. We're going to Legoland and need to leave. Go find your shoes.

Child: But muuuuuuuum! I really wanted pancakes! You said we could make pancakes this weekend!

Parent: I don't have time this morning! Legoland. Shoes. Go!

Child: Will there be pancakes at Legoland?

Parent: I don't know.

Child: I don't wanna go if there's no pancakes.

Parent: Legoland will be lots of fun. Of course you want to go. They have lots of rides there.

Child: I don't want rides. I WANT PANCAKES!!!

Parent: AND I WANT YOU TO FIND YOUR SHOES!

Child starts crying.

Parent wants to start crying.

Child: You promised. You're a liar. I want a new mummy!

Parent: Well we'll search for one on eBay later. Can we please just get out the door and leave?

Child: But I don't know where my shoes are!

Parent: Where did you last see them?

Child: I don't know! I had them at ballet class.

Parent: That was on Tuesday. It's Saturday. Where did you put them after ballet?

Child: I DON'T KNOW!

This pattern will follow you for the rest of the day. You will repeat numerous phrases such as:

"Get down from there!"

"No you can't have another balloon - I told you to hold on to it tight and you didn't. So tough."

"You're too small for that ride."

"No you can't have another ice cream."

"No I can't make them come out and sing that song again."

"No, I can't make the queue go down any faster."

"No, we can't just walk to the front of the queue."

"No, we can't live in Legoland."

"No, they don't have any flippin pancakes!"

And you will stress yourself out beyond comprehension trying to make the day fun, when really all that's happening is everyone's miserable, tired, frustrated and whining. You get to the point where all you want to do is go home, despite the fact you've had to flog your spleen to buy the bloody park tickets. But you can't just leave. Oh no. Because your child has firmly attached themselves to a Lego windmill in mini land and is loudly screaming, "I want to stay HERE!"

And it's on the way home, after you've spent 20 minutes wrestling the little cherub into the car, whilst they've pitched a fit with extra leg flailing usually found only in a River Dance jig, that you realise staying home and making pancakes would have been so much fucking simpler.

You're not alone, OP. Children can bring a tremendous amount of joy to your life. But the other 98% of the time is, unfortunately, usually shadowed by a whole heap of utter cack that makes your eye twitch and your hand reach for that bottle of anesthetic chilling in the fridge...

The good news is - you all laugh about it later

Spot on, Vino!