To expect DP not to read my text messages

[Hiddenipad]

We've been together four years. 1 DC. I have 2 DC with my ex husband, divorced 6 years ago.

DP has always disliked the fact that ex is still in my life to the degree of being pleasant at drop offs, texting re kids, being at school stuff, birthdays etc. We don't communicate for any reason other than the DC but DP has expressed his dislike of us texting/phoning each other. DP does have a jealous streak which he knows I won't pander to and it has got better over the last few years.

About a month ago the iPad went missing. We searched high and low and couldn't find it. The iPad is connected to my account and all texts from my phone also go to the iPad via iMessage.

I've just been doing a deep clean in our bedroom and found the iPad, fully charged under DPs side of the bed hidden inside a boot box. All the text messages from the last month have been read. He's clearly hidden the iPad and been checking on all the messages going to and from my phone since it went missing. If it had just happened to be under there it would've been dead by now and when switched on the messages would have said unread.

I thought something weird was going on as last night he went to bed early and ex text me to ask how a school open evening for DD had gone. I text back and said oh not bad, think we are too far out of catchment though. That was the end of the conversation. Ten minutes later DP comes downstairs and says 'oh have you spoken to ex about the open evening?' which was weird in itself. He was obviously trying to see if I would lie? about having text him.

AIBU to think this is way out of fucking line and rip his head off when he gets home? I've never done anything to make him think I am untrustworthy. Ex has a long term partner and we have both moved on.

WWYD?

Actually, for the sake of accuracy, I don't think that's what happened. I think it got lost, they looked for it, didn't find it, and then he found it and was overcome with temptation. OP - correct me if wrong.

NOT defending him; I think his behaviour is indefensible, even without actually taking the iPad himself and hiding it.

Uh no dowager I don't think that's what happened at all. He took it and pretended to look for it. Presumably he knew it was synced with OPs phone.

Hmm - does the iPad often go missing OP? Ours never does. It's expensive, I keep an eye on it!

Bit of a coincidence if the one time it goes missing is the one time her DP finds it and then has a lightbulb moment 'Ooh, I know! I can use this to spy on my partner!!'

Far more likely he hid it for that express purpose.

I think people can get away with a lot under the guise of being insecure. They often act like victims and manage to illicit plenty of reassurance while they whinge about how shit and useless they are.If he wasn't insecure, these actions would indicate that he is abusive and controlling. But he's apparently insecure so it's perceived differently.

Either he thinks your involved with ex or he doesn't. Not many people hang around when they think something is going on. Instead he makes sly remarks about him. I hope your dc don't hear these comments.

My ex used to invade my privacy regularly including spyware on my pc and secret video recordings. Some people could feel sorry for him for feeling so insecure but they'd be mistaken. He was a controlling prick and he , like many snoopers simply do it for the thrill they get out of it.

I'm just going by the OP's post at 11:44...

Hmmm - this is starting to feel like an English comprehension exercise!

The 11:44 message.....

Ok well he now knows. He called to see if something in the post had arrived and I told him. He knew something was up and asked what was wrong. I said "before you think about lying bare in mind I wouldn't be asking you if I didn't already know". He immediately said "this is about the iPad?" I asked him what the fuck he thought he was doing and he said he was sorry, he'd found the iPad a few weeks ago and my texts were all on it and he'd just got caught up in it and knew he was being nosy. I said it was way beyond being nosy, breach of trust, weird and fucking creepy and I'd never given him reason to not trust me. He said I know I know I'm sorry. I said I'm not talking about it on the phone, we'll talk later and then hung up.

I guess it depends if a few weeks is longer or shorter than a month.....

Realistically he either found it and hid it before, during or after the big search.

If before - see my message above
If during - so he hid it whilst listening to the Op searching frantically for it
If after - so he hid it knowing that the Op had been searching frantically for it

Not sure it makes much difference really - whichever one it is he has let the Op go without it and worry about it for weeks.

As they searched high and low, it would be interesting to hear where he said he found it.

As I said - happy to be corrected if wrong, and his behaviour is still completely indefensible. To me this is a deal-breaker, regardless.

There just seems to me, to be something marginally less horrendous about stumbling across it and succumbing to temptation - as compared with plotting to steal it (FFS!) with the pure intent of snooping, and then feigning looking for it with the OP, IYSWIM.

Either way, the guy's pathetic, and it would be the end of the line for me.

But it sounds like just another pathetic excuse,

Well if he'd found it and succumbed to temptation, he would have left it back after a quick, guilty scan. But he hid it, all charged and ready to spy again. That suggests - to me, anyway - that he knew exactly what he was going to do with it.

He even sorted out a charger. He fully intended to have it on an ongoing basis.

Sorry dropped phone!

... Pathetic excuse.

In the context of someone who habitually behaves in a passive aggressive, manipulative underhand way. And when caught put he doesn't think about the OP, he just panics about himself and uses every manipulative (& I think sly) trick in the book to put it back on the op and make her responsible for himself, in a rather revolting parent-child dynamic weedling his way out of anyone asking him to behave as a responsible grown up.

In that context, a lot of posters don't believe his knee jerk excuses, or want to encourage the OP to get involved in intricate picking apart of his story. If you get into that, he gets what he wants, which is to place the OP as responsible for judging and unpicking reality, and force her into the role of having the power to give him absolution and make his reality all ok again, and yay, he gets to stay comfortably in his role as the 'pathetic special case can't be held responsible for his behaviour wounded soldier'

His behaviour. His mess. His consequences.

I can't believe how many posters would resort to game playing.

Op you did the right thing and are approaching this calmly and sensibly.

Can you get over this?
My immediate gut response is that the calculated way it was done would be a deal breaker for me. The fact you asked him not to text and he ignored you, is also very worrying.
BUT his past could be the reason why he has these issues. It does seem bad.

It think it very much depends on how your conversation goes. A second chance with counselling, might be appropriate. Whether you can ever truly trust him and move on, is debatable. I know I couldn't stay in a relationship without trust. That to me is paramount. You need to decide if it is worth the effort or not.

Good luck

He already makes me feel guilty for needing to speak with ex. He tries to get me to slag him off subtly.

DP suddenly piped and up and says "oh hidden what more embarrassing than ex having an affair". The whole table just stopped.

He sounds like a manipulative, controlling and abusive twat. You don't see it fully because your clarity is fogged up with the emotional attachment and being in 'love' with him. He started trying to control your interactions and reasonable relationship with the father of your children first, when that didn't work and you didn't allow him to control you he upped the ante by then starting to humiliate you in public. Again , designed to emotionally/mentally affect you, destablise you and manipulate you and FORCE you into seeing/doing things his way. Some of the worst abusers are very subtle in their attacks on you, and so far he's 'winning' because you see this as just as a symptom of his jealousy, something that YOU are allegedly responsible for because you won't cut all ties with your ex - nothing short of that will satisfy him. This is not a case of simple jealousy, most men who are 'wonderful in every other way' would by now have recognised that trait and be working WITH you to deal with it or already sought out professional help. If you give in or play along with his game, then he will only replace his obsession with your ex with something/someone else. Next it will probably be friends/family that you are close to.....this is how abusers break down their victims and isolate them from support networks and normalcy. It would give the game away if he took that attitude towards others in your life right now - better to shoot one bird at a time over a period of time so that you don't see the reality of who he is creeping up on you.

His world revolves around HIM and his behavior towards you is all pre-meditated. He planned this level of snooping on you KNOWING there was nothing going on. He stole the ipad, let you believe it was lost and even pretended to help you look for it despite knowing he had hidden it. Then he deliberately 'tests' you despite knowing you are NOT GUILTY of anything. This is RED FLAG behaviour! It's also called lying, stealing and deceit - DON'T minimise it and fall for his charm and emotional manipulation and 'woe is me' tactic. You share everything hence so he KNOWS (i.e has control) in all other areas - you just try opening a saving account he has no access to and see how he reacts.....

The only place/thing he does not have access to WITHOUT your permission is YOUR MIND....so he's using these tactics to get inside your head so he can control you from there. Gaslighting is a brilliant way of fucking with people's heads and he's doing that to you too. Make you doubt yourself, second guess yourself, blame yourself (because you refuse to cut all contact with ex) and thereby subconsciously forcing
yourself to take responsibility for HIS behaviour. As far as he's concerned, his jealousy and subsequent behaviour is ALL YOUR FAULT ....but he won't directly tell you that to your face.

He is NOT sorry for what he has done because he did it knowingly and PRE-PLANNED it. He's only sorry he got caught. Hence why his next tactic was to use emotional manipulation to make you minimise what he's done, to suck you back into feeling 'sorry for poor dp who is just feeling jealous'. Basically, he's making sure that the onus of responsibility is on YOU - he won't accept responsibility - because in his mind it isn't his fault - it's you and your ex's fault for making him feel that way This is why he isn't coming up with ways to deal with HIS issue....he wants YOU to 'sort it out' so that the next time he behaves like this or wants to control you all he has to do is make you believe you didn't do a good enough job the first time of sorting out issues that were YOUR fault.

he's showing you his real colours underneath the mask he wears - don't ignore that or make excuses for it.

^^
This. Exactly.

Clearly my ^^ didn't work. Annoying. But that should be

This. Exactly.

DontMindMe1

Excellent post.

op?

I do hope you're still here, Hidden. Is this all a bit of a shock to you?

Seconding Alice's this^^. Particularly the bit about the savings he can't access.

I don't think he cancelled the trip to make a chance to make it up to you, OP. I think he cancelled it to keep a closer eye on you. Just think of all the things you could get up to with him gone for a month, particularly when you're so justifiably angry with him. He's not going to give you any opportunity for any of that stuff.

Hi Everyone

Sorry to keep coming and going, I am still here.

The chat didn't go great at all. He apologised, said he realised it was wrong, nosy, he didn't know why he had done it. He feels like he is comparing himself to to ex all the time, to the life I had with ex (that when I talk about things ex and I did/places we went) it sounds exciting and that our life is boring in comparison. I only mention these things in the context of a film or point of conversation, not just randomly btw.

I asked him what he was going to do to fix it then, he said well what can I do, i'll obviously have to stop worrying, I don't see what I can do, i'll never do it again, if I do do it again then you'll have to leave me. I mentioned therapy and he said he didn't think that was necessary and that he knew he'd done something stupid and untrustworthy but he didn't need to speak to someone.

This went on for hours the crux being him saying 'well I've obviously messed everything up, you won't ever trust me again so whats the fucking point in any of it'. We've just spent the rest of the weekend mooching around and avoiding each other.

The month away was cancelled for legitimate reasons (he couldn't get a specialised piece of plant equipment he needed, I was the one phoning around for it so I know thats true).

And no no no to steroids. He is regularly drug tested on some of the contracts he does, so couldn't get away with it. Its hard to explain because i'm under a name change without giving myself away.

Not sure what to do now. But I am still here.

And he says he didn't hide the iPad, he found it under the bed a few weeks ago, when pressed he says about 2 weeks. He also said he didn't actually read all of the messages because he wasn't sure if reading them on the iPad would mark them read on my phone before I had actually read them.

Thanks for the update OP. Well done for discussing it with him, although it sounds like a difficult discussion and not the outcome you wanted, at least you gave it a chance.

I'm afraid that from what you've said, it sounds like he's not willing to take responsibility. He needs to accept that his obsession with your ex and his need to control and spy on your are both extremely unhealthy and damaging. He needs to be willing to address these things. By dismissing the idea of therapy and failing to suggest anything at all - apart from you leaving him if he does it again (!) - he is not taking it seriously.

I'm afraid it doesn't look good OP. Can you trust him not to spy on you again? To stop making nasty comments about your ex?

He sounds really inquire. He is clearly incapable of discussing his fuck up so he just says there's no point in talking about it. Not good enough.
I would make the therapy a condition of any further discussion. If he isn't able to openly talk about his ridiculous insecurities and resulting behaviour then I wouldn't even consider getting to make it work. His insecurities result in him being manipulative, controlling, underhand, untruthful.

Do you believe him though? If you looked under the bed then you know he is lying to you STILL. You also know that he charged the ipad deliberately so he could snoop, rather than just happening across it and having a quick peek. And if he genuinely did find it in a place you hadn't searched, he could have looked at some messages and then told you he found it. But he didn't, he hid it again so he could keep checking up on you.

Good point Planes, he put deliberate thought into hiding it in a box under the bed and keeping it fully charged.

It's still all about him, OP, how he feels, how remorseful he is but he couldn't stop himself, he doesn't need help, doesn't really want to 'fix' it just wants you to accept his excuses, forgive him, make allowances for his insecurity and move on. Nothing about you, how you feel, what you want.

Honestly, I think you are going to continue going round in circles on this if you are wanting him to make any positive decision, he wants you to make the decisions, do the forgiving, the 'there, there it'll be alright, we'll sort it out" (the 'we' in that being 'you'), or, for you to say it's done then he can somehow absolve himself by saying "I messed up and admitted it but she wouldn't forgive me what more could I do." He just doesn't want to take responsibility for his actions or do what is necessary to make amends.