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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Well, there we have it: Jeremy Corbyn has just been announced the next Labour Leader

999 replies

InTheBox · 12/09/2015 11:46

With 59% of the vote (first round).

I've just been following the live BBC broadcast and just wanted them to get on with it.

No doubt people on both sides of the political spectrum will be overjoyed with the result.

OP posts:
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SoloD · 14/09/2015 10:45

Corbyn is an interesting choice.

The economy will probably be the main election battleground in 2020 and it would appear that Corbyn will certainly have fresh policies to offer.

He will have an uphill struggle though on one hand UK growth is among the strongest in Europe and UK wages are beginning to rise (especially for those on minimum wage which will go up by a third in the next 5 years) unless something drastic happens the Conservatives will have a strong record to point to. Corbyn will probably drop some more of his outlandish policies (like reopening coal mines) but will need to communicate his ideas well enough for people to believe in them.

I don't see how the electoral maths adds up though. Even if Labour take every SNP seat in Scotland and every green vote in England they will not overturn the Conservative majority, so they must take seats from the Conservatives, therefore they must persuade voters who voted Conservative this year to vote Labour in 2020.

But people don't like the Westminster establishment and Corbyn is certainly not that. The the Conservatives may again go into meltdown over Europe (especially given there will be a leadership election before the next election).

Inkanta · 14/09/2015 10:57

I think unfortunately that Corbyn's weaknesses are starting to become clear. He can't take criticism, he reacts tetchily, he avoids media questioning and he can't handle them diplomatically

On the contrary I think he is being quite rightly boundaried and doing things his way. He doesn't play the game and that is his strength. He will speak to the media when he is good and ready. He was prettty busy yesterday - had a cabinet to to sort out. Why should he speak to Andrew Marr yesterday? Who says so?

wasonthelist · 14/09/2015 11:00

anyone under the age of 50 wont remember the winter of discontent and how shit it was to miss school because there was no heating and the power cuts.

I think I missed a couple of days of school in 1973/4 due to strikes.

We missed 4 days in 1981 because our school heating packed in due to it being old and knackered like everything else in our school.

Neither of these had anything to do with the "winter of discontent".

Teaching relatives of mine tell me (State) schools remained in decline until 1997 onwards when some of that famous "Labour waste" actually fixed a few school roofs and bought some new books.

I am continually amazed by the revisionist (Tory) view of history in connection with the 1970s and the idea that everything done since has been a staggering improvement.

wasonthelist · 14/09/2015 11:01

I think unfortunately that Corbyn's weaknesses are starting to become clear. He can't take criticism, he reacts tetchily, he avoids media questioning and he can't handle them diplomatically

Weren't these all cast as "virtues" when Mrs Thatcher did them?

JugglingFromHereToThere · 14/09/2015 11:02

Perhaps JC and Labour will be able to pick up votes from those who were non-voters in 2015, especially if they are able to appeal to younger people?
There are a lot of people in that category who are often very much ignored. I could see that changing, even slightly, and that making a difference.
Huge differences between success and failure rest on swings of less than 5%
Less than 30% of the electorate voted Tory in 2015 (29% I think it was?) & Labour weren't really that far behind IMHO

I think DC is taking the threat from JC's appointment seriously and coming out as humanitarian friendly in today's interview in a refugee camp. He probably knows that being portrayed - rightly IMHO - as the bad guys is their greatest threat. Of course they are also utilising the politics of fear with that speech of doom and gloom the other day from the defense secretary

Inkanta · 14/09/2015 11:06

Wesontheelist - Yes I think having the confidence to be tetchy with the pesky media is a virtue. I hope Cobyn continues to do so when needs be. The media are not in charge.

Inkanta · 14/09/2015 11:07

Sorry - Wasonthelist :)

SoloD · 14/09/2015 11:11

The Fabian Society (a left wing think tank) did a study on this last month

www.fabians.org.uk/the-mountain-to-climb/

Tiredemma · 14/09/2015 11:16

"I don't see how the electoral maths adds up though. Even if Labour take every SNP seat in Scotland and every green vote in England they will not overturn the Conservative majority, so they must take seats from the Conservatives, therefore they must persuade voters who voted Conservative this year to vote Labour in 2020"

This is an interesting point. I am aware of a fair amount of people who voted for Conservatives because they wanted 'something' (they wasnt really sure what) to be done about the 'work-shy' and the 'lazy'- they wanted benefits cut etc and people to 'work for a living'.
These were voters who were heavily reliant upon Tax Credits. They feel they have been shafted. They wont vote Tory again. Im not entirely sure who they will vote for.

unlucky83 · 14/09/2015 11:22

was I think things are far from perfect now - but they are better -the whole customer service attitude has changed over the last 30+ years. Picking on BR (used to travel by train long distance a lot - some of my worst experiences). I would say 80% of the staff were awful, made delays etc much worse than they needed to be by being (seemly) as unhelpful as they could possibly be. (Did come across a couple of stars - one especially...). When I got a car I said never again ...then after 15-20 yrs I was forced to for a similar length journey - I actually prefer it to driving now!
I have always known things go wrong, I know it isn't the staff's fault - I've never been rude (or started off being - did lose my temper a couple of times Blush). But they now seem to want to keep you as well informed as possible. They seem to appreciate that they are your only source of advice/information...want to help. so 'I'm sorry I don't know at the moment, when I find out I'll let you know/make an announcement'. Or 'Sorry for the delay - if any passengers are hoping to catch the x connection from X we are expecting to just make it. We will arrive at platform 1, your train is leaving from platform 3, so you need to go up the steps and over the bridge etc ...' - compared to 'I don't know - I'd have to radio to ask...pause do you expect me to?' - the examples are real experiences...a significant change in attitude and I think privatisation helped...

tiggytape · 14/09/2015 11:31

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Message withdrawn at poster's request.

claig · 14/09/2015 11:34

Lucy Powell is very good. Glad she is in education. Glad Dianne Abbott got a role too.

BoffinMum · 14/09/2015 11:34

I am buffing up my brazier and getting out donkey jacket, it's going to be just like the good old days.

Liggit90 · 14/09/2015 11:34

Most parties are ruled by the opinon polls I hope Corbyn has real views of his own

JanetBlyton · 14/09/2015 11:36

He is certainly hiding. I was expecting him on Andrew Marr and I hoped he'd be on the Today programme this morning at 8.10. He damages himself by avoiding those opportunities.

SNP are talking today about some deal with Labour for voting in the commons now so them together might work. Hope not.

tiggytape · 14/09/2015 11:42

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Message withdrawn at poster's request.

tiggytape · 14/09/2015 11:45

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Mistigri · 14/09/2015 11:46

tireeemma I agree that the political impact of forthcoming cuts in benefits for working families is a big unknown, as is the potential for Tory disunity over Europe.

Whether this, combined with Scottish/green/disenfranchised votes, would be enough to win an election, I don't know. Probably it will depend on the economy. It's increasingly possible that UK growth will falter due to external factors (China in difficulty, weak growth in the euro zone, unhelpful exchange rate movements) combined with the effect on demand of slashing in-work benefits. It will be interesting to see whether a JC-led opposition can capitalise on this.

Alyosha · 14/09/2015 12:02

Well knock me down with a feather - you're right claig. He is proving himself to be bad tempered, thin skinned and unable to take criticism. Hence why he's basically made Tom Watson leader - he's going to do all of the media appearances!

McDonnell is an awful choice. A man how wants to "ferment [sic] the overthrow of capitalism" and who praises the IRA...

Garrick · 14/09/2015 12:04

Misti, I agree with everything you wrote this morning. On these threads I sometimes get painted as a loony commie dinosaur (something Corbyn's getting used to!) but that's an unintelligent interpretation by people with poor understanding of politics and a rigid black-and-white view. I'm a capitalist with a conscience, which I believe makes me middle of the road.

Unions need revitalising and their legal shackles removed. This is because unions are collectives, and it is only by working together in groups that normal people can have any power - the entire basis of Corbyn's premise, as it goes, and the underlying principle of democracy. Unions in the 1970s were facing the gathering forces of mega-business which are now baring their teeth. Strong responses were needed.

The historic patterns of union behaviour - locked shops in particular - had developed 100+ years previously, when there were no workers' rights and business owners worked together to deviously & violently exploit them. You only have to read Dickens or watch some of the many films about the struggles. By the 1970s, some union bosses were megalomaniac nutcases but most were intelligent, highly informed and determined. The way British coal and steel closures were executed proved them right, not stupid.

Now the historic pattern has been broken and everybody knows the world's changed. The ongoing war on 'everyone' by 'the capital' continues, however, and is speeding up very worryingly. If any poster thinks it's great that 1% of people own 48% of all there is in the world and will have more than half of it by 2020, they'd better be in the 1% and have a serious addiction to solid gold shoes with diamond heels. If anyone thinks those few care about other people's health, education or children, they haven't been paying attention.

But the 1% can't get all that stuff unless we sort it for them, so we need to use our bargaining power. This is true on a global, national and individual level. When we pull together, we are able to hold something back. There are lots of ways of doing this and unions are one way to organise combined efforts efficiently. Corbyn wants us to develop all the ways of working together to improve one another's lives.

Sorry, that turned into a ramble Blush

On Trident - Britain isn't a superpower any more. We're a second-class nation. Having nuclear weapons makes us more of a target than not having them. My opinion on this has reversed as we changed our position on the global stage. The majority of our assets now are intangibles, which can't easily be bombed. I would alter my view again if we discovered socking great oil deposits, for example. I do think we should have top-class militia, just not WMDs. And releasing the Trident money could help out our struggling forces.

Inkanta · 14/09/2015 12:11

"Well knock me down with a feather - you're right claig. He is proving himself to be bad tempered, thin skinned and unable to take criticism."

How do you know that?

One day in power.

TheNewStatesman · 14/09/2015 12:13

"Whether this, combined with Scottish/green/disenfranchised votes, would be enough to win an election, I don't know."

No. The maths has been done many, many times already.

Mistigri · 14/09/2015 12:15

Garrick well it's nice to have some company in the underoccupied space between the purge-the-red-Tories ideologues on one side, and the Tories yelling WONT SOMEONE THINK OF OUR SHAREHOLDINGS IN THE ARMS INDUSTRY HARD WORKING FAMILIES on the other.

Alyosha · 14/09/2015 12:15

He has refused all interviews. He gets annoyed at reporters asking him questions. He devoted a whole portion of his acceptance speech to have a go at the media.

He hasn't got a clue - he badly needs media training not just for his own sake, but so that Labour doesn't become even more of a laughtstock than it currently is.

LineyReborn · 14/09/2015 12:16

How can you do the maths on an election that hasn't happened yet?