To keep shouting, they are refugees! !!

[ginmakesitallok]

And not migrants!!!!

The people who are dying on Europe's shores are not migrants! They are not coming to Europe for jobs, for benefits, because they think it will be an easy life. They are escaping war, ISIS, starvation, rape, death. They just want to live and give their children an opportunity to live.

Stop calling them migrants, as if they just fancy living somewhere else. Brits rearing abroad are migrants. Other eu residents coming here are migrants. The dead baby on a beach in Greece was a refugee.

I live in London, the biggest city in Europe with the highest levels of intergration, I see many many positive through immigration. Hospitals work, shops are open, building work gets done etc etc.

In fact studies like this one: www.ucl.ac.uk/news/news-articles/1114/051114-economic-impact-EU-immigration

Show positive impacts of immigration and that in the main immigrants contribute more to the economy than they take out by the billions of pounds.

However Turkish, your anecdotal story will obviously pander to your xenephobic predjudices and your opinion will not be swayed, but then I really hope people like you are in the minority in the UK.

Has anyone also put forward the idea that yes we should be taking some responsibilty because as a nation we have contrbuted towards the turmoil in the area? Across the last 100 years we can discuss: The Balfour Proclomation, the division of countries after WW1, installing the Shah in Iran in the 1950s, backing Saddam initially, arming Iraq, War in Iraq, shady dealings with dictators all over the region. It all adds up, and in the end a lot of it has benefited those in the UK at the expense of the normal populations in the middle east.

We need to do something right by them this time.

so thats still ten homes/flats rooms that towns dont have and if they did then our own people should be in them

And God forbid that your council tax might go up a smidgeon to cover the costs of temporary housing, huh, Louise? Who cares how many toddlers die so long as that doesn't happen.

Sorry, sorry, sorry. That of course should have been addressed to somewheresomehow.

That business about Britain as the laughing stock of the rest of the world due to the number of immigrants it allegedly takes is such a giveaway thick Mail reader's phrase. And, of course, it's a complete and utter myth.

so thats still ten homes/flats rooms that towns dont have and if they did then our own people should be in them

ten homes

279 000 empty homes

So, somewhere remove head from arse sand and try empathy.

Yes im clearly lacking intelligence not being able to separate immigration from a humanitarian crisis.
Of course I know the difference. Im just saying that I, and many other people are tired of soft touch BRitain. And it is soft touch and I speak from experience. Experience in the job I do and where I live. Which incidently has turned into a shit hole.
If our government can help those who are genuinely in need of asylum then dear god, of course we should. As long as we filter out those who are coming to better themselves.
All these mumsnetters up in arms about the supposedly callousness if the Uk im guessing you also dont mind all the general immigration either.
Yes there are many hard working migrants here who embrace our way of life but there are plenty who do not. I see this first hand.
If I wanted to better myself and emigrate id have to do it properly, get a job and learn the language. Appreciate any cultural differences. That often doesnt happen here and I do see this first hand. All those 'I live in london, blah blah'. I work in this environment.
And louisebrooksthis woman isnt a neighbour as such but someone who accesses services I use and an interpreter is needed. After years of living in the Uk. Is this an acceptable use of resources do you think?
So yes, I can separate the two issues, but its very difficult to.

Jeeves - hey, no problem.

Dawn - brilliant, just brilliant.

turkish Britain is not a soft touch. You are talking nonsense. We take fewer immigrants than almost anywhere else in Europe. Your experience is not relevant because experience does not make empirical evidence.

for empirical evidence apologies.

How can Britain conceivably be a soft touch when it is taking fewer Syrian refugees than most of the rest of Europe?

And Britain does very nicely indeed out of those who come here to better themselves. Tell me, Turkishly, do you refuse medical treatment from the many members of the NHS who originally came here as immigrants?

so thats still ten homes/flats rooms that towns dont have and if they did then our own people should be in them
Oh, and by the way, these refugees are my own people because despite the fact that I was born and bred in London I count myself and the refugees as members of the human race, so what exactly do you mean by our own people?

Ha ha jeeves.i don't actually read the daily mail.
Im.going on what I see. Not what I read or from some bloody statistics that ive read like most on here!
My job involves working first hand with many immigrants and I can see intolerance! Not from the Uk who bend over backwards to support every religion or cultural difference, but from the migrants themselves.
And my dear friend working for the Nhs who gets the piss taken out of her and the free service every day.
Does any other country allow people to spout hate on street corners?(someone is bound to give me an example. We don't suport other cultures, we positively EMBRACE them! Even if it offends everyone else. Whats the middle ground here?
So I can categorically say immigration is baad here and I can see it with my eyes!

Longtime lurker ive got a million anecdotal tales I could tell you.

So I can categorically say immigration is baad here and I can see it with my eyes!
No, that's still your own somewhat prejudiced opinion.

Does any other country allow people to spout hate on street corners?

Oh, the irony.

I didn't say you read the Mail, turkishly. I simply said that people who claim that Britain is the laughing stock of the world are using the phraseology of thick Mail readers. If the cap fits ...

You may want to do all those things you've listed in order to emigrate turkishly but if you were to move to an EU country it isn't a necessity. If I wanted to move to Spain, for example, I don't need a a job to go. If I wanted to move to Austria, I would need an EHIC card and also the option to send my DC to English mainstream schools (why bother learning the language?)

It's not that we are a soft touch, its similar to the other countries as part of the EU. I don't mind immigration and know plenty of people who have emigrated over the years.

At the moment though, integration isn't the short term issue. As pointed out many times, its these peoples need for immediate shelter and safety.

Op yanbu

Oh the irony. Quite hilarious jeeves.
Im.not spouting any hate. Very confused there my love.
I wholeheartedly agree that aid must be given and asylum granted to as many people(syrians) as we can support so long as that is what it is.
Im a bit cynical I know, only because I can see the Uk going to the dogs with too many economic migrants. Not those bringing something positive to Britain, of course not. But we need to filter out the ones who are coming to take the piss. And you CAN do that freely here! I can move around Europe but if I was unskillled, didn't speak the language etc id struggle . I would certainly get a poorer health care system without paying.

You can come here with nowt!
Now im off to.see what newspapers clever people read. I know its not the daily mail of course. Thanks for pointing that out.

Ive been on mumsnet many yrs, under another name.
Its great to see how nothings changed and you are not allowed a opinion unless its backed up with hard evidence.
My years on this earth and my experiences first hand count for nowt.

Of course you're allowed an opinion, that was exactly the point I was making. You were trying, albeit unsuccessfully, to posit your opinions as fact. If you're going to do that then yes, evidence is required.

Oops oops sorry dawn. Didnt realise needed hard evidence.
You lot carry on arguing the toss.

Let us take a real case - the family of the two little boys who died. They were sfae and sound in Turkey. They had left Syria. They were not at risk in Turkey from Isis, beheadings or anything like that.

They chose to put 2 children on a tiny dinghy to make an illegal crossing because they wanted more money - in the EU. How can that be anything other than an economic migrant?

They chose to put 2 children on a tiny dinghy to make an illegal crossing because they wanted more money - in the EU. How can that be anything other than an economic migrant?
And you know this how? Perhaps they were scared that the war would tip over into Turkey, perhaps they were worried Turkey would not continue to help refugees? They were not economic migrants. Had everything been fine in Syria they would not have left. They would have jobs, homes and a dignity you seek to deny them.

Can someone link to the London March that has been mentioned upthread? I've tried googling but couldn't see anything relevant.