Use of the words abusive and controlling on MN

[SrAssumpta]

Recently there seems to be a surge in the dramatically unnecessary use of words like abusive and controlling on here and I really think I've become desensitized to it so I would imagine that's how real victims of abuse or people with genuinely controlling partners would feel too if they came on talking about their relationship, does that make sense?

A woman got told the other day she sounded controlling for making a meal plan ffs, I mean seriously? These words get thrown around now it's going to either lead to everyone thinking they're in abusive relationships or in fact controlling and the people who genuinely need to understand that their relationship isn't normal won't be able to see it because suddenly everybody is abusive or controlling.

Ye gods! This thread has turned into something of a bi-annual audit.

Goddamn

I believe that in most threads any comment like that about the slap would be criticised. I imagine many pps will have criticise the OP in that thread about slapping whoever. Lweji

But it wasn't really criticised because the poster was a woman and the general consensus was that the man must have driven her to an act of violence, as the op went on to say..
"while I'm not proud of doing it, I don't think badly of myself for it''
When I tried to criticise the use of violence other posters turned on me
''clearly you know nothing about the dynamics of domestic violence. It's not just about physical abuse''.
''The weapon he uses to control his wife is verbal assault. It is not "less worse" than physical assault. Most survivors of physical abuse say the emotional-psychological injuries do more harm than physical abuse''
At this point, as so often on MN, I gave up. Some posters are intimidating and will not allow anyone to challenge their pseudo psycho babble. This is dangerous and discourages any questioning of certain views and opinions, however wrong (violence).

As a general rule, people don't post to say how wonderful their DH is and how happy their relationship is. Therefore, it stands to reason that relationships which feature controlling or abusive behaviour will appear to be more common on here than a representative sample taken from RL.

I think what's depressing is that as more and more research and training has taken place, we are beginning to see how many relationships do feature control or abuse. It's a minority but it's a sizeable one.

While I think some threads can feature some OTT reactions, I say anything that keeps sending out the message that abuse/control is wrong, is a good thing, however hyperbolic it sometimes seen. The truth is that for a lot of victims it is the stupid, small things - those which seem like a massive overreaction to complain about - that finally tip people into despair or leaving.

I think if I were Lweji, I'd be tempted to name change now out of embarrassment.

Why haven't you posted a thread about sexist comments for example? Or excusing abuse? I find that more serious

What? It's aibu, there are tons of threads that I am sure most people think aren't very serious. As pp said, what an odd thing to say.

Fantastic find lohan

I say anything that keeps sending out the message that abuse/control is wrong, is a good thing,

See this is where I disagree. I don't think its helps to have posters (a small amount of posters) throwing around the word abuse etc because someone has had one fall out.

People post all over this site about one off instances that frustrate them. But it's often (not always) met with their partner or them being labelled as abusers.

It's doesn't help anyone, imo.

I think people being OTT with claims of abuse are harmful.

When I was genuinely having problems in my relationship. I was put off posting anything about it by all the ridiculous claims of abuse I'd seen and all the ltb and your damaging your DC if you don't. I didn't want somebody to just say ltb, then start guilt tripping me over my DC. I wanted some moral support. My DH is brilliant by the way, it was a medication issue and getting him to see he needed to go back to the gp because it had made him unbalanced that I was struggling with. It made him uncharacteristicly nasty towards me but I knew, on here, people wouldn't accept it was unusual for him and just a meds problem. Some moral support, here, where I could be anonymous, would have been nice, but I didn't dare.

I also think there's got to be people in truely domestically violent relationships, who won't post here because they read some of the more ridiculous "he's abusive" "ltb" posts, and think they won't get a realistic response. Or they post, not knowing it really is domestic violence, but when people tell them that, they can use the more ridiculous "abuse" posts on other threads to tell themselves its just silly people being over dramatic.

Dislike that thread is horrendously shocking. A woman would never be told it was her fault for being physically attacked, so how can it then not be a woman's fault if she physically attacks others?

I do have to wonder just how many man out there are in terribly abusive relationships, yet don't speak out because of attitudes like that? When I worked at the council (4-5yrs ago) the figures on the posters at work said 1in 4 women and 1in6 men would experience domestic violence at some point in their life. You've got to wonder how many more of those 5in6 would be in an "abused but would never confess that it had ever happened to them" category.

The "experts" do not confine themselves to male/female relationships either. They know all about your parents, in laws, siblings and friends-and so many of those people are "controlling" and "narcissistic". I'm sure some of them are and that some posters are having a terrible time but the same advice can be trotted out for everyone on the basis of little information.
What is concerning is when someone expresses an alternative view or another way forward and is turned on severely.

I agree Spartan and WhyOWhy re it not being helpful and potentially being harmful.

Good point about ILs being labelled toxic/narcs and people being advised to go NC.

My mum did not like my nan when I was young. But she would never have stopped me seeing her or telling my dad to limit his visits. Over the years they developed a deep respect and affection for eachother.

There was a MIL thread recently where the OP described 4/5 incidents where she and her MIL had disagreed in nearly 20 years.. The same old "controlling/toxic" crap was being spouted.

But surely 4 or 5 disagreements over the course of a 20year relationship is normal.

LazyLohan

dying laughing. if people will cry domestic violence against their own children for something like that, what chance does a DH have?

Yes, the amount of 'go NC' advice being tossed out on MN is alarming. I always find it quite disturbing to see posters telling others to cut off (usually close) family members entirely.

Not only NC but the way to do it. Give no explanation-block all communication, send letters and parcels back unopened, refuse mediation -because these people will never change. I am only too aware that for some people from abusive backgrounds NC is the answer but the experts on MN do not know the people involved-either the OP or the family. How do they know whether change and improvement is possible.

Well I can speak as someone who has been on the receiving end of all this helpful, concerned advice that is being mocked up thread. My ex , completely out of the blue , (and I later discovered , word for word on the advice of the relationship board on here ) booted me out , called women's aid, called the police , contacted the nursery (in case I tried to kidnap my own child for fuck sake) changed the locks , barred me from family home , went 'NC' with the kids grandparents , refused to talk other than on email. My children now don't know why their daddy isn't picking them up from school every day , putting them to bed every night, there for them to crawl in to add with every morning , making their dinner , playing with them , watching films with them.

The obvious response that I'll get to this will be that there must've been a reason etc and that someone wouldn't go out and do all of these things just because a few anonymous names on a screen told her to.

Well bull.shit. There were reasons but fixable reasons and the words and advice handed out on here caused my life to turn to shit almost overnight.

Yes , things weren't perfect , I don't imagine many relationships are , but there was still enough there, namely the futures of our beautiful kids to and make things work. Yet seen as the advice on here ranged from "kids will be better off without him" (no they won't) to "he will never change" (says who?) taking in all of the 'self preservation' actions above along the way, and my wife decided to be taken in by such advice such as "don't go to therapy together , he will use it to manipulate and control you" "make your heart cold" "detach detach detach" , I find myself eating the mother of all dog shit sandwiches.

People who know us are shocked by how she could have her head turned in such a manner and credited her with more intelligence than that. Others say that given her actions during and since the split , that I'm better off without her. It's easy for others to say. They aren't the ones separated from their children and life partner.

What I'm getting at in a long drawn out way is that previous posters have claimed the dangers of banding about these terms in such a casual fashion. Well I can testify to the dangers , as I've ended up on the receiving end of it in the most horrible fashion.

I'm sure it's horrible for you Jazeera - but why in hell would you ex have need to contact WA and the Police about you if all was so fine?

Well exactly. I still can't believe it. And I think the justification given was "in case" I kicked off (I didn't) it was all part of the protect yourself and survive manual so often dished out on here , at the drop of a hat , as pointed out by previous posters. I'm not belittling giving out such advice when there is a genuine risk. There absolutely was no need in this case and it is fucking sickening.

All right, I can't comment on your case because I don't know it. But your ex must have posted enough (whether true or not) for people to fear that she was in danger, hence the advice given.

She chose to take that advice, so either she was looking for a way out and MN helped her to work out how to do it, or she was genuinely afraid that things were going to escalate.

We can't know which it is. We know that, as well as the numerous women who are in danger, there are also some who are manipulative and lying about how bad their situation is - but those latter ones are very much in the minority.

Now, we can't possibly know whether or not the poster is lying/exaggerating how bad things are, for whatever reason (attention seeking, looking for ways to leave her relationship without being the "bad guy", or whatever - we can only ever give advice on information presented.

So, awful as it is for you, I'm sorry to say that your ex chose to do all those things to you, no one on here made her do it.

Sadly Thumb ,y ou are totally correct. I actually regret posting all of that now. I just thought that I'd give an example of how, in some cases , people rightly or wrongly DO take on the more extreme , knee jerk advice mentioned up thread, and are sadly, in my case, swayed from exploring other options as the pack has long since convinced the person concerned that drastic , life changing action , is the only possible course left available. Which is bollocks.

I need to add, before I'm hung, drawn and quartered, that I'm sure that in many cases, such action is required. I know my case though. And am still , almost a year on, flabbergasted in a state of disbelief.

Sadly Thumb ,y ou are totally correct. I actually regret posting all of that now. I just thought that I'd give an example of how, in some cases , people rightly or wrongly DO take on the more extreme , knee jerk advice mentioned up thread, and are sadly, in my case, swayed from exploring other options as the pack has long since convinced the person concerned that drastic , life changing action , is the only possible course left available. Which is bollocks.

I need to add, before I'm hung, drawn and quartered, that I'm sure that in many cases, such action is required. I know my case though. And am still , almost a year on, flabbergasted in a state of disbelief.

If you want to, you can ask MNHQ to withdraw your posts - just click on the Report button of your own post and ask them. Or you can leave them if you prefer, it's entirely up to you, I just thought I'd let you know it was possible to have them withdrawn.

Yet another kick in the teeth for women who are being abused and controlled. Thanks OP.

The alternative to being taken seriously and having a spade called a spade is continuing to live in fear, being dominated, lives turned to shit by abusive and controlling partners.

Weird to see people here who believe their partners are controllable, silly women who cannot see reality, whose heads are so easy to turn that advice from complete strangers on a forum resulted in heading for the divorce courts.

There also seems to be a Mumsnet obsession with the word control, controlled or controlling...
Complete autonomy and independence within the confines of a relationship is an impossible goal, I also feel some have ridiculous boundaries whereby they feel it's ok to deliberately test the relationship, they then wonder why suspicion and mistrust arise..
I think relationships have different stages that come and go, stormy, calm and choppy, it's up to the couple to negotiate these times...

Math we are clearly talking about the situations where women or men are clearly NOT being abused. Rtft.

Nor are we talking about people seeking advice on the relationships board