to ask why, if it's generally accepted to be the behaviour of a twat, do parents exclude a couple of kids from class parties?

[Chippedrippedandstinking]

Inspired by Lappy's thread, we all agree it's wrong and yet it happens. With flame amnesty, will abuone admit to doing it, and if so, why?
And if it happened to you, did you call the parents on it?

I've only seen it once, the mother was taken aside and an invitation was issued.

Really people should be trying to impress on their children that we sometimes need to make allowances, not trying to encourage them not to. You'd think someone who faces similar problems would be understanding, but maybe it just comes down to attitude. I don't actually think of myself as being all publicly spirited and doing the right thing, sn or nt, it's the same as when I needed to put sunblock on dds pale friend but not her etc. Its just what you do. I think sometimes what someone accepts from their own child they can sometimes be less tolerant of in others though. Like they've taken out a special license, whether that's an sn, or being boisterous or over sensitive or loud etc. And let's face it some people have really odd ideas.

You would imagine that children came into the world knowing how to get on with others, how to be very fair to all, how to be a good friend to all, how to stand firm and not just follow the strongest.

They have to learn it. They are very egocentric to start with. They have to learn that the universe doesn't revolve around them. It comes easier to some than others. Some have good role models in the home, they are taught to take turns, they can't always have their own way, they have to respect other's personal space, to empathise with others etc etc . They learn how to deal with those who grab their toys, won't give a turn to anyone else etc.
Like anything- they learn by their mistakes. They get things wrong.
They haven't achieved it all by 4 years old.

It is much easier for the child who has the kind and loving family, parents who listen to them, help them bear disappointments, and sets boundaries.
It is much more difficult if the child comes from a chaotic or dysfunctional family, or where the parents want to be a friend rather than parent, or where they have delayed development, or where they are on the AS spectrum..

I know many adults who haven't achieved it! And yet it appears to be expected that the under 11yr old should have got it. MN can be very bullying.

While I can quite follow that you wouldn't want a child that yours has problems with at his party, and there is no need to have them, I think that if at all possible you can try and find a solution that is kinder. A smaller party is the east way.
( if they are only little and can't remember names you just have to ask the teacher or TA- they will know who they are most friendly with.)

There appear to be people on here who were bullied and have a huge anger inside them that they have never dealt with. Instead of dealing with it they are channelling into anger against the child that is bullying their child. They don't give 'two hoots' about the other child- they want that child to know that they 'are a horrible child and that is what happens to horrible children' .
Meanwhile bullying is complex and some intelligent children can bully without getting noticed- they still get invited to the parties. Forcing one child, by effort of your will, to hit another child is worse than the one doing the hitting- especially if they get away with it. Or it is IMO.

Easiest not East.

How many of us actually do role play of what to do if someone tries to get you to do things you don't want to do?
I would expect , like me, it is more usual after the event to say 'If Jamie jumped off a cliff would you? '( in tones of 'no you jolly well wouldn't) - whereas it would be better to give strategies before the event

I'll confess I was very tempted once. I was organising a joint party for DD and one of her friends. The girl in question was a nightmare, both our daughters disliked her and didn't want her there. DD's friend's mum was particularly worried as her daughter had been physically attacked by this child. Anyway, we quickly decided leaving out one child would a shitty thing to do so invited her, secretly hoping she would decline. Anyway, she came. Her mum stayed and it was fine. We later heard she'd been diagnosed with ADHD and last we heard was being assessed for ASD.

A couple of years later this girl had a party and invited DD. She said she didn't want to go and neither did most of her friends. For this reason I was slow to respond and the mum had to chase me up. I was sad when she told me that hardly anyone could make it :-( I decided DD was going and asked her how she would feel if no one came to her party?? I managed to rally a few other parents and the girl had a nice party.

So yes excluding children is a shitty thing to do and I think as parents we should be responsible for ensuring it does not happen!

This thread just goes round and round. I think perhaps we could all accept that different people organise parties differently and no one is shitty or nasty for doing it the way it suits them.

One cautionary take to add to the pot. When my DTDs started reception, a fair few parties were organised via class lists. The school sent out class lists to parents when the DC started school and many used those lists for party invites. Two children, for reasons unknown to most, were swapped. Therefore, two children were not invited to lots of parties, particularly at first, as oarebts chose to believe the class list rather than their child.

My DTDs are 9 now. They have known since before they started school that you don't get invited to everything, and that it's ok.

parents chose to believe...

I think that the whole class party is to blame. I don't know when it started but the the thoughts of having more than 20 parties a year is horrible- if you have 20 parties at a £5 present that is £100! 6 parties is ample.

I don't mehitabel. Unless it's after the event or where I have good reason to suspect it's likely to occur in that situation/ with that person. Eg now what do you do if Jamie suggests you play wwf wrestling on the playground again tomorrow? Or if Kate or anyone else suggests you're all horrid to Molly again what do you think would be a good idea, instead of pointing out that at least molly doesn't look like a poo and have toilet breath. We used to have those types a lot.

I have had them afterwards- they are learning by experience. I don't understand why people think they should all be emotionally mature and resilient by 11yrs. You can't actually get them to learn by your experience, they need to make their own mistakes.
Having siblings helps. You need to learn to fall out and make up without adults being around. No one manages to be sweetness and light all the time. We all have arguments.

Totally agree with you Mehitabel

itsmine giving a child free rein over one small area of their lives is a really good way of building those skills.

If my children make mistakes in their social interactions - and of course they have, and will continue to do so, then it's a learning opportunity. Understanding that they will not be invited to everything is crucial. I want then to grow up with self esteem and social confidence. Being invited to everything does not lead to that.

As identical twins, they've spent their whole lives so far proving that they're individuals, but so far, have never been invited anywhere as individuals. I would imagine they've been left off invitation lists because other mums assume that they come as a pair. It's going to be something which is a everlasting learning curve. As a parent I can support, be there when they need me and help but I am not going to interfere.

Maybe so, but I don't think that every parent can take that responsibility on.

I'm so glad whole class parties were not a 'thing' when my dc were small.
When ds1 was in reception, there was a little shit child who made his life a misery. Fortunately we moved away from the area and ds made lots of lovely friends.
Would I have made ds invite this child to his party? Would I fuck
No, even his own mother and teacher agreed that he'd been vile. Why would I have wanted this absolute horrible child to share my son's special day.
And no sigh the other little git had no sn.

"you don't go to every party" is very different to "every other boy is going except you".

I'm glad whole class parties were still being done in primary school. Sometimes he got to go to one party a year and it was a whole class one.

Punk, again, how would you know? My kid was diagnosed at 14.

HMS - I feel for your DS but I (and other parents) can't be responsible for him in the same way that I have to manage my own kids and their "why can't it just be me this time?" concerns. I can't expect other parents to be responsible for that.

There are plenty of 5 year olds who are raised spoilt, rude, self centred, parents may find these traits amusing, children who push and shove their way to the centre disreguarding all others. I know of two children who are the centre of their parents attention all the time, but cant cope being one of 30.. parents dont understand this as an issue. They dont have to take turns or lose etc, have whatever they want when they want it, this doesnt transfer very well in a class situation. Yes they learn, but its a hard lesson, and generally children are very perceptive and will deploy avoidance tactics and said child will not have made any real friendships... hopefully they all grow and mature, do I want my children being practice material? No. Do I want them to seek out kind children? Yes.

Evil If you bothered to read my post, even the child's mother agreed with me
Very, very glad that we moved away, I care not one shiny shit what became of him.
Why oh why don't people accept that some children are just horrible. 4-5 year olds are old enough to know that some behaviour is unacceptable.
And as I said, in this case, the child's mother agreed, as did his teacher that the child had been a horrible bully.
Why would invite him to my child's party?

punk - think you're muddling me with itsmine

HTH

Evil, apologies.