to ask why, if it's generally accepted to be the behaviour of a twat, do parents exclude a couple of kids from class parties?

[Chippedrippedandstinking]

Inspired by Lappy's thread, we all agree it's wrong and yet it happens. With flame amnesty, will abuone admit to doing it, and if so, why?
And if it happened to you, did you call the parents on it?

I've only seen it once, the mother was taken aside and an invitation was issued.

Perhaps I've got it wrong... Perhaps people on this thread just need to trust their kids a bit more. My children are capable of making friends without my encouragement. Their friends are an eclectic mix and are based on, you know, normal stuff like shared interests or living nearby.

A lot of posters seem to be working on the assumption that their DC will make poor choices unless those choices are controlled by mummy.

And if you open your ears in the school playground you'll hear that there is no greater 'currency' than the birthday party!

You're invited cos you're my friend. I don't like you anymore you're not coming. If you let me have a sweet you can come to my party. Only girls with pink coats can come to my party (I've heard this said!). My party is better than your party.......

It is for parents to offer guidance to temper this, and to accept that sometimes their little darlings (just the same as all the others) are using party invites to wield power!

Yet another reason I am glad to not have to hang out in the playground.

Good! Well lets hope when their partner is kicking 7 bells out of them, they remember to look for the best in them, eh?

Nice Madam . Are you suggesting I make it clear to them that the world's a miserable place and if they're kind, generous and thoughtful, they will end up getting the shit kicked out of them.

I'm not at all religious, but you seem to be suggesting we change ' do unto others...' to 'presume everyone's a nasty bastard unless there is evidence to the contrary'. Catchy!

what?

are you on drugs, Locating I haven't said anything remotely like that.I think you must be hallucinating!

Exactly itsmine
evil your children must be very very very advanced. At that age my dd would have made plenty of silly decisions, like living on strawberries and bread, or borrowing a live baby to be a doll, or riding our bikes in tesco on a very wet day, or getting out the paddling pool in -5, to name but a few of the milder suggestions. I take it the only guidance they need is a well timed reminder not to invite someone so they can make an autonomous decision
betty not writing the same line on everyone's, writing a specific invitation to them and a list of what's happening, it could come across as though you're inviting them purely because they have an sn. I found when people reply/ you hand them out they'll ask about anything whether nt or sn that could be an issue, and then you work round it. Sticking a list in could also come across as 'this is what's happening if you come' as though you aren't open to make reasonable adjustments.

bettyy maybe the reason why parents don't actually explain what will happen etc is because they have no idea if one of the children has some SN? Or they know as in 'xxx has a TA with them' but have no idea what it is or what having yyy actually means (eg a child on the spectrum would struggle with transistion or actually they might not!)

Also why should it be left to the b'day child parents to go and ask and investigate (when there might be nothing to investigate)? Why aren't the parents of the child with SN actually ask the b'day child parent, propose to be present or ask for the plan to see if little Joe can actually come. I know I would rather do that than seeing my child upset when I tell them they can't go because I'm not sure what is the plan.
A bit like a parent whose child is allergic to peanuts and would tell the child NO to every single party just in case instead of having a chat with the parents to avoid peanuts.
Of course you could also argue that you should never have nuts or whatever at a child's b'day party but where do you stop??

I like what you said EvilTwins.

My DD has not been invited to some parties over the years. I have not taken offence and neither has she.

For her parties, I have always told her to choose who she wants (one year she had the most dreadfully rude boy there but I just grit my teeth because she obviously saw him as a friend - incidentally he never targeted her, just others). I did worry how this would affect those he did target who were at party but just kept an eye out and in end, apart from some odd words exchanged, nothing bad happened and party was a success. This year we had a maximum number - DD got quite stressed so in end she chose the last couple out of names in hat because she thought it was the fairest way as she liked everyone the same! She chose not to invite two people who had been extremely unpleasant to her during the year (and before you say she must have done something to antagonise them, no she did not as both were equally unpleasant to a few others). I didn't care who my DD invited as long as she was happy. It would have been hard to understand if she had invite the two unpleasant ones but hey it is what we do for our kids.

This thread I think would assume that I am being petty here? I actually gave her the choice of inviting these two, indeed to be the better person, but she chose not to and no way was I going to force her, just for everybody else to have an opinion on. I did not want her to be unhappy at her own birthday party.

Regarding SN children, I think it is unfair to exclude on basis you think they won't cope. Surely if your child wants to invite a SN classmate then it is up to them? As the parent you then speak to the parent of SN to see if there is anything they require, allergic to etc? That is just common courtesy? On the other hand, if your child does not invite their SN classmate because they don't really socialise with them, then I think that is understandable.

I agree, it is a very very difficult issue to invite whole class bar 1 child (whether that child is bully or SN or whatever) BUT I am still on the side of the children and who they choose to have at their own party. Sorry if this makes me a bad person/mother. It is just my opinion, it is neither right nor wrong x

Hear hear Locating and Lurked

Lurke i have found that the parents of the child with SN in dc2 class (well the one I know about, maybe there are others) actually never came to see me to let me know what could be an issue/how to deal with xx etc. She dropped her ds and went away, I didn't even really see her (lots of other parents around) and I didn't have a tel number to ring if something went wrong.....
The child had a number of physical and social issues.

I agree Locating - you don't have to spend much time in an infant class to hear the party being used by the highly unpleasant way that you describe- often by normally lovely children!
I brought up my children to be kind, thoughtful and look for the best- and that two wrongs don't make a right. It has worked. I don't regret the way that I did it. I would do the same again.
I wish that I had commented and moved on. I first came on to comment that it was a lovely thread and very uplifting. It was at the start. It quickly became more depressing and then swiftly descended into deeply depressing.

Funnily enough, my DCs have always wanted to ensure noone is left out, without me having to insist. Not because they like absolutely everyone, or because theyve never had issues with other kids, but because I have always asked them to think about how they would feel if the shoe were on the other foot.

I'm not saying they are perfect, they can be right PITA at times, but they are aware of how their actions can upset others and they consciously try to prevent that hurt.

Oh yes, my kids are super-advanced. Even at 4 years old they were able to answer a truly tricky question like "who would you like to invite to your birthday party?"

Mine have just asked who they wanted - with a maximum of ten. Lots get left out, they got left our of lots but it was never an issue. It only becomes an issue if they know that everyone else in the class was invited. And they always know. There are some people on this thread who seem to want them to know - they see it as 'pay back time'.

At 4 yrs old you would need a class list to invite them all. You could not rely totally on them giving every name- thereby proving there are a lot that are not important to them.

fan I'm guessing someone like that wouldn't have bothered even if you'd initiated a discussion though?

Strange that princess, as I said earlier dd has regular fall outs with one child when she doesn't as a rule, and yet the other child does with quite a few. But I've still always been able to see that in spite of track records, in that relationship dd is equally responsible. Funny how
we all see our children differently isn't it?

Also I don't think anyones said they believe all dc should go to all parties. Just that except extremely rare circumstances it's really shitty to invite all but one or two, whether that be all the class or all of one gender.
I wonder if I'd egged dd on to petty revenges or constantly reassured her she was never at fault through primary she'd have been the girl they're all relieved to get away from?

My ds had a whole class party, invited everyone including a boy who was bullying him quite badly at the time, I just kept a close eye on the bully and it was fine BUT a friend of mine made her dd invite the girls who were picking on her and they spent the whole time taking the piss out of her outfit/hair etc Its a tricky one, I think the age of the child is a factor, I couldn't exclude a 5 yo but maybe 13 yo if it was down to bullying. They need to learn the consequences of being horrible.

Yep Lurked but as a parent to discover you have a child with what I see as severe physical issues and no tel number is just SCARY.

And yes it all went well and I suppose that the parents thougt it would be all ok and they knew better than me. But I was still responsible for that child! I would have wanted to be warned.

Wow twins they can reel off the whole class except 1 or 2 they don't want? Impressive. Age 4 amongst her friends my dd was naming various animals as guests she'd also like at her party

I think people are blurring the lines between:

• Not inviting a child to be nasty and deliberately exclude them because you don't like them / their parents.

• Not inviting a child who has SN and may be more challenging or may be perceived as "weird" or "difficult".

• Not inviting a child who has made your child's life such a huge misery that they are terrified of school and the perpetrator.

In the latter instance I would not invite the child in question - not to "make a point" or to be nasty to said child, but so that my child could enjoy their birthday without being a nervous wreck. Sometimes you run into situations where there will always be upset regardless of how well you try to play it. In the latter situation, you either upset the birthday child, upset several children by excluding them so as not to seem like you're "picking on" the child causing yours distress, or you upset the child causing the problem. I would not cause my child distress on their birthday, and when it comes to upsetting 6 children or 1, the numbers would suggest you go for just one...

I would not tolerate my child excluding someone just because theyre not friends, don't really like them or think they're a bit weird.

Of course lurked I am not for one minute suggesting my DD is an angel. She has many fault but to my knowledge has never been spiteful or physically abusive to anybody. I don't think the sun shines out of her backside and I am well aware (having worked in the school she went to) that whilst she wasn't the initiator in the unpleasantness, she probably didn't help her case sometimes by arguing back! BUT the school acknowledged that DD was not the cause of anything with the unpleasant children. In fact they told me she had actually gone out of her way to try to be friends with them despite them being nasty to her so in this instance, I don't see that my DD is blame which is what you are seeming to say (apologies if I have read this wrong.)

I am well aware she has probably pissed many a child during her school years for whatever reason hence not being invited in the past. What I mean is I have never taken offence to it because it is personal choice of said child or parent. Kids can't get on all the time I know that. Like I said, if she had wanted to invite the unpleasant children it wasn't a problem with me at all. At age 11, should I have forced her??

As I said, my posts are my opinion as it is a free country! I am not saying I am right or wrong either here. I don't see why I should be shot down for my opinion when I haven't shot anybody down for theirs. Each to his own x

Fyrefly I see what you are saying but call me thick, why would a child invite somebody to the party that they don't really "hang around" with? Not inviting them does not mean they are excluding deliberately, it just means because they don't have much to do with that child at school, maybe they just don't think there is a reason to invite?? Again just my IMO. I am talking older children here, not younger ones. I daren't say anything else !

Lurked - no. They reeled off the names of their friends - you know, the children they actually played with, and we invited them.

I have never done a whole class party. Ever.