About my neighbour

[slightlyconfused85]

My neighbour is a very kind lady, age 60 plus who lives alone next door to us. She loves our 2.8 yo dd, buys her little gifts for her bday etc and loves to come over for a cup of tea and chat with her. She also is very kind to babysit for us now and again if we want to go out.
Her nephew is visiting her from abroad in a few weeks he is in his early 40s. She has said a few times that he loves photography and he will love to take photos of dd. She often says to dd 'are you going to do photographs with my nephew?' I didn't say anything for a while but we are not keen on this - I don't feel it's appropriate for a stranger to take and have photos of my dd - I don't know what he will be doing with them. Last time she said it i very gently said 'Dh and I prefer only for us and family to take photos of dd so we would prefer if your nephew didn't although he's of course welcome to visit with you and we'd love to meet him'. She's now upset, hasn't spoken to us and when Dh saw her she told him that she's upset i insinuated her nephew is a paedophile. Have I been unreasonable?

You haven't met the nephew, right? And neither has your DD? So it's pretty farking weird to keep on and on at you to agree to it before you've even met him and seen if you're comfortable with him!

It's being aware of what's inappropriate, and being able to admit if something makes you feel uncomfortable and step in, that has transformed the experience of abused children from just a few decades ago – so that now they are listened to, and steps are taken to protect them, and convictions are made.

To some extent. But not enough, not yet.

And OP, trust your gut.

not read thread but your not being UR AT ALL.

Some random bloke taking pics of your dd no way!!!

YABU and offensive i don't blame your neighbour for being upset

It might sound like 'she just wants nice photos to give to me' but there has been no mention of them being for us.

No I haven't met him- never heard of his existence until 6 weeks ago even though I've known her 2 years.

She never asks me directly but on more than 10 occasions she says hi to dd then says 'you're so lovely/pretty/beautiful you will let me nephew take photos of you or do photos wont you?' To which she says yes because she's 2 and says yes to everything.

I didn't feel that I suggested an ulterior motive; just that I prefer photos of my young child to be taken by family or close friends - this way I know where photos will be and yes I lm afraid I don't want pictures of her even potentially plastered all over the web. Unfortunately her adult nephew who I haven't met isn't family or close friend- he is a stranger to me. If this insinuates paedophilia or anything else I haven't said then this is her interpretation, I did not say it or mean it.

op i wouldnt give a toss what mn think on this - she is your dd and your job is to protect her, people are very very naive indeed, we see this time and time and time again.

You have un wittingly hurt an old ladies feelings, you didnt mean too, your just ding your job.

you may also put someone nose out of joint over taking a photo.

BUT what your doing is protecting your DD and that takes precede over the other two.

There are no other ways round it.

She should not have put you on the spot about it in the first place.

Op reports on how many men are actually attracted to children have been held back because they dont think we can take it as a society.

demonising you because you dont want a stranger to take pics of her, maddness, why on earth would he want too?

Oooh a turn of events.

First she's a lovely lady who pops in for a cuppa and babysits, now we hardly know her, she's babysat precisely twice and we have to change her lightbulbs.

Your kid, your choice OP, I believe is the much quoted MN maxim. You might want to look up some statistics about how many friends and family compared to total strangers abusing children if you're so keen to let Uncle Jim take photos of Precious.

Have you sorted another free babysitter? You're going to be needing one I imagine.

And of course you think her nephew is a paedophile. Don't be disingenuous enough to say you don't.

Like others, I imagine old lady has heard nephew can take photos with his snazzy phone and she thought how nice it would be to have one or two of your child. For her, for you, who knows?

Pretty nasty post drank. I was just saying that our relationship is friendly and neighbourly - I do like her, she does come for tea and babysit and my Dh does a few things for her too. This doesn't make her my family.

Yes my daughter is 'precious' to me- is that unusual?

I pay her for her babysitting like other baby sitters I have used.

No, I don't think her nephew is a paedophile - you can say I do all you like but I don't and I didn't say it.

As everyone knows, your own family members are (I think last time there was a thread it was between 80 and 90%) more likely to abuse your children than some random bloke.

Do you let them take her picture?

I can understand why people think the way they do, the UK has become a society full of "everyone is inherently evil and not to be trusted and and and" but when the actual real statistics (not the gobbledegook spouted by some posters on here about coverups because we can't take it as a society ) show without a shadow of a doubt that 9 times out of 10 that man (or woman) is the one you hand your daughter over to every day of the week for a cuddle it just beggar's belief.

There are loads of threads on here where MNers tell their own painful, awful stories of being abused. And very few of them were abused by randoms that they didn't know. And even fewer of them discovered that the bloke they didn't know had pictures of them stashed away....

Honestly, I'm not getting at you.. a Spanish group stopped me and dd at Stansted airport once and asked to take a pic of dd sat on a suitcase near a red postbox and I let them, then did a head palm moment and thought "aaaaah, paedophile ring, what have I done?".

I imagine they just liked the juxtaposition of small blonde very English looking kid next to iconic object.

Drank you seem to have made some quite strange assumptions about slightly and her neighbour.

As PPs have pointed out, the woman is in her 60s, not her 90s!

You seem to think that the only reason anyone might not want a stranger running some sort of photo session with their DCs would be some kind of folk-demon hysteria.

How about the possibility that people simply don't want potentially awful pictures taken, don't want to commit themselves and DC to a potentially stressful session with someone who may or may not be skilled at photographing small children (and taking decent portraits of other people's happy, relaxed DCs is in fact a skill - it's not easily done).

The neighbour's comments sound as if her expectations are high. Why would anyone keep mentioning the pictures so much, if they were just referring to a couple of possible snaps on a phone?

And why on earth should anyone be obliged to agree to such a request?
Why on earth do you imagine that they have some sort of inalienable right to go around photographing everyone? Perhaps OP you could put you in touch with them and they could pop around to yours for a photo session?

Yanbu at all. Your neighbour should know better than to ask you. Its not a normal request. There's no way in a million years I would agree to a stranger taking photos of my child just because he's a photographer. Why is he making such a big deal asking in advance. You haven't said you thought he was a paedophile but you could be forgiven for having suspicions that he could be. There are plenty of things he could be photographing so why is he so keen to have a little girl as his subject. He could be perfectly innocent and above board but why take the chance. Paedophiles don't go round with a big board advertising what they are, but they do hide behind seemingly innocent facades, it's naive and stupid of people to deny it.

Coming a bit late to the discussion here, but as I'm closer in age to your neighbour than to you perhaps I can see where she's coming from. As PPs have said, the current accepted feelings about photographs of children are relatively new; I have grandchildren and family members who are involved in education so am fairly au fait with current norms and try to observe them whether I completely understand them or not. To someone who's not aware of the safeguarding issues in this situation (and the widespread acceptance of them by today's parents) is rather odd, and if you add the personal dimension of the photographer in question being a member of her family it's unsurprising that she thinks you're equating a man with a camera with a paedophile.

I don't think you're being unreasonable, BTW. You could probably salvage the friendship if you take time to explain that it's just one of the views that have changed greatly over the years (when my children were babies the advice was to sleep them on their fronts, people thought nothing of smoking in cars/planes/cinemas, etc etc). I hope it all works out.

I am in the old fart category & would find it that you are so precious about your child's image. At one level it would just make me think "You have standards I will never understand and therefore I better keep my distance since I probably will fail you in some way and I could do without the grief."

YANBU OP at all.

I would simply try explaining to her that with the internet these days it's far too easy for people to "get hacked" or have their property stolen, or have bad friends etc etc. I would also tell her your rules for friends and family (no internet uploads...) and that it's easier for you to control that because you can find those people and know who has what photos.

I would ask her why she wanted him to take photos. Is it because she would like a photo of her and your child? Or is it more likely because she hasn't seen him in so long she's trying to draw him in for a visit by mentioning a photo opportunity?

I don't think YABU at all. Your child, your rules.

I would definitely use the "I'm sorry you feel that way but I don't. The world is a changed place and it's too easy for my daughters photo to end up in China."

Then I would show her this: soheresus.com/2015/06/12/down-syndrome-genoma-copyright-infringement/

Or tell her about the one where the mother found her childs images from her blog used in an Craiglist add for selling a child. I can't find the link but you have a point.

It's quite reasonable to say you don't want people photographing your child full stop. I wonder if the neighbour has already taken some cute photos on her phone and that's why she was so defensive.

I can see your point but I can imagine hers as well.

It doesn't sound like she has much family here. She is excited about her nephew visiting. She dotes on your kid, and why wouldn't she, I'm sure she's adorable, 2 year olds are cute as a button and great fun. She knows her nephew is a keen photographer and she probably thought it would be a nice way to pass some time with her nephew and you and fun for your daughter and resulting in some good pics (regardless of whether her nephew is interested in photographing children at all - most keen photographers I know take photos of anything but children, except their own or if they are paid) and now, however you meant it, she feels that you suspect her nephew, with whom your only connection is her, of being a paedophile. that's not a nice feeling.

I hope you manage to mend bridges.

Remain polite and unyielding. It is your choice, and it's a request that is open to interpretation. Your family rules about photos & the Internet are X. That's it, nothing personal, but no, we don't do that as times have changed somewhat.

I'd give her 'an out' to smooth her feathers and reassure her you're not accusing her nephew of being a paedo.

But then the friendship will naturally fade I think...

As someone else has mentioned, the prearranged nature of it makes me feel uneasy about it. And why isn't anybody asking why a 40-year-old bloke would want pics of a child he'd never met?