To want to find out if my kids are safe (and how to do this anyway?)

[wheresthecat]

Bit of a long one but don't want to drip feed.
Up the road a little way the house was sold a few years ago and a woman moved in - has never spoken to any of us in the street, very much keeps herself to herself - this is very unusual in our street as everyone knows everyone, but it's her right.
About six months ago, her son moved in (mid twenties) spending his time between here and another house they have in the city. The only time we see them is in the middle of the night when they come back from Sainsburys - they're never out in the daytime, and the son will sometimes stand staring out of the window, and then shut the blind quickly if he sees anyone looking.

To get to the point, last night we were awoken by a huge commotion, four police vans and paramedics outside the house, the man shouting and screaming, swearing as they tried to get him into the ambulance. He was extremely violent and it took a long time for the police to fully restrain him and get him in the ambulance - we presume he was being sectioned.
One of the neighbours asked if there was anything he could do, but was told this man was extremely violent and dangerous, and to stay inside.

So, this morning, this leaves me wondering about the kids - they are just beginning to go for little walks by themselves (to the corner shop, round the corner to their friends' houses etc. Are they safe with this man around? And how would I find out - would the police be likely to give a definitive answer.
Obviously this man is ill, and I wouldn't ask his mother as I wouldn't want to (very awkward, invading privacy etc) but I would feel so much happier knowing.

You do realise one in four people suffers from a mental illness don't you? And that for many people it's successfully controlled and treated.

In fact, the chances of your child being harmed by this man are much, much lower than the chances of your children having the same condition as this man and having a snotty curtain twitcher grasp their pearls at them. He's probably more of a danger to himself than anybody else.

There are people with mental illnesses all around us. Teach your children not to talk to strangers, to tell you where they are going and how long they will be.

I mean, what do you want to happen? To go back to the days when he'd be locked up in a strait jacket for the rest of his life?

Statistically you are not at risk.

It's just that simple.

I work in MH services - I spent a while on the acute wards where we had the 136 suite to which police would bring people directly into hospital as a place of safety (from public places only - they can't bring someone in from a private place like their home without permission from a judge).

A lot of people were very very unhappy about being sectioned and brought into hospital. They tended to be particularly unhappy when the police were involved, even though the results of being sectioned were the same they often felt more persecuted by the police presence.

Some of them kicked off pretty bloody impressively.

I honestly can't remember a case of anyone who was violent towards their neighbours small children though.

I do remember someone who broke their neighbours window once but as I recall it was in revenge for the neighbour keying their car and being a 'mouthy bitch' pretty unrelated to their mental health - just that kind of neighbourly relationship

Hope that reassures you OP.

Another astonishing mumsnet thread :-/

It's perfectly reasonable to be concerned about a neighbour the police have described as extremely violent. Of course the likelihood is that this man is of zero risk to you or your kids - he sounds reclusive - but in the absence of any information, this is difficult for you to assess! And there certainly have been a number of high profile cases where people with untreated or inadequately treated mental illness have gone on to harm members of the public.

You'd have had a field day with my mum. She was frequently carted off by several members of the emergency services when I was a kid, she was often in a strait jacket too for good measure. Like many people with severe mental health problems the only person she was really a risk to was herself, nosey neighbours made sure our lives were hell though.

Extremely violent at that time, Mistigirl. They haven't put an APB out on him permanently or gone up and down the street warning everyone to stay in their house like, forever, until he moves.

It's not a 'mumsnet' thing. It's a common sense thing.

You think your children are at risk from a man who keeps himself very private, never leaves the house except to go to sainsbury at night and shuts his blinds to keep strangers out? Really? Do your children make a habit of being in sainsbury alone at night and going uninvited into strangers' homes? No? Then i think they'll be fine. It seems to me that this man is actively avoiding contact with others. You need to worry more about the strangers who invite your DC into their homes.

"there have been a number of high profile cases....mental illness have gone on to harm members of the public"

Less than a dozen in the last 20 years. And since a quarter of people will suffer from mental distress statistically youre more likely to get attacked by an escaped big cat

Hth

Such cases are quite rare mistigri which probably why when it does happen they become high profile

www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-17182626

Or killed by an ambulance or police car

Hell, Laurier, do 't bring big cats into it. There'll be even more hysteria and foafy bollocks spewed onto the thread.

I understand where you're coming from op. Whilst everyone says you have no reason to be concerned for your childrens safety likewise you have no reason not to be concerned. Maybe the police can point you in the right direction of finding out any relevant public information.

I agree that he might have been "extremely violent" at the point he was being sectioned-due to a combination of severe mental health issues and fear when being restrained by the police.
However it is extremely unlikely that he poses a threat generally.

You don't have a reason not to be concerned every time you step out the door, so that doesn't have a great deal of relevance to a neighbourhood where everyone judges the quiet people who keep themselves to themselves.

The man in question has never been seen outside his house behaving aggressively, just when being removed from it.

I hate this. The man seems to suffer from a mental illness and you immediately jump to 'WHAT ABOUT THE CHILDREN?!?'. You have zero idea what has happened or what is wrong with the man. Stop looking for a boogeyman around every corner.

Well this man has been the perfect neighbour in a sense, he keeps to himself and is rarely seen. Obviously he has mental health issues but as a threat to your children I'd say almost definitely not. For one reason, having witnessed him in a bad state you are now aware of his situation. That means you can explain to your children that this neighbour may be ill and therefore warn them to not interact with him if they see him (and it sounds like he has no desire to interact with your kids or anyone else on your street for that matter.) You can't protect your children from everything, it's worth remembering that some of the most dangerous people are smiling, friendly and neighbourly!

If your children are at risk form him then they are not old enough to pop to the shops. Becausse there can earl kinds of people with various criminal tendencies, or dangerous drivers or other dangers around at anytime. You don't know what hidden horrors your other neighbours could be hiding.

Im sure the person who is in the most danger is infact this young man. If you found it frightening to watch imagine what a day in this poor chaps head is like.
By all means tell your children to cross the Street or not to bother him or his mum but dont build him up to be the bogeyman

From what you've posted it sounds like this man actively avoids contact with others most of the time. How is then he a risk to your children or anyone else?

You sound uniformed and judgy OP. You have decided that this man was sectioned and has MH issues. From that you have extrapolated that he is a risk to you in some way.

He really isn't.

Your street sounds awful BTW. I would hate my neighbours knowing all of my business and gossiping about me behind their net curtains.

Ok...firstly, you don't know that this man was being sectioned or that he has mental health problems. Unless I've misunderstood, that's a conclusion the neighbours have come to.

Given all the scaremongering and sensationalism in the media around mental illness, it seems a bit unfair to blame the op for asking this question. She's hardly alone in associating mental illness with being somehow dangerous.

OP, I think you have to work on the premise that if the man posed a risk to others, he wouldn't be in the community at that time. There will be many people with a mental illness in any neighbourhood, it just so happens that you have (you think) seen this man acutely ill. Mental illness is very common.

Separate out the mental illness from your fear that there may be someone dangerous in your neighbourhood. That is a remote possibility every time we leave the house. We take a calculated risk but we can never know for certain.

Wowzers, there's some harsh and weird responses on this thread!
So everyone would seriously have no worries whatsoever in police cars and ambulances screeching up to restrain strangers and bundle them off on their street? Normal occurrence where you don't bat an eyelid and go about your business?
Yup. Ok.
Dunno where you all live, but glad it's not here if it warrants just turning a blind eye and ignoring!

I would be worried about the person being carried off, and about their mum. A difficult situation for them to be in. But then I know that people with mental health problems are statistically more likely to be harmed than to harm others so perhaps it's easier for me to focus my attention on them.

Your children are significantly more at risk from road traffic accidents than random attacks by people with mental health problems.

Tess I think most people, with even the basic idea about mental illness, would realise that jumping to the 'kids at risk' conclusion is a massive jump. Frankly, that kind of attitude does a massive disservice to every campaign and every person trying to make people realise that mental health issues should not be a stigma.

If OP is concerned about him approaching her dc's and saying/ doing something to upset or harm them she needs to be aware that someone else with MH issues (as she's diagnosed based on this snapshot) could just wander onto her street or into the shop or park she lets her dc's go to. In exactly the same way a paedophile, drunk driver, person with conviction for GBH could. Why does this man pose any more of a risk?

My mum was one of those scary people getting bundled into ambulances and police cars. She is a great person but had a breakdown (mh related) so no I wouldnt be watching and judging if it happened to a neighbour.