To think there are a lot of misconceptions about terminating a pregnancy

[fiveacres]

Obviously, about abortion, which is a contentious issue for some.

I am approaching the third due date of the pregnancy I terminated in the autumn of 2011 at 9 weeks.

I was a very pious sort once, who believed that abortions were morally wrong. i admit that freely. I still do feel that the best option is not to be in that position in the first place.

However, although I do sometimes think about it, I don't regret it. I've been pregnant twice since so it hasn't affected my fertility.

I paid privately. I did not have any counselling - I was undecided when I went for the initial appointment but I have to say it was very much 'assumed' that I wanted to terminate. The record of the abortion is not in my medical file.

You don't have to give a reason, although they did press me to have the implant, which I refused. They did do a scan, which was a bit upsetting.

It did not hurt. I was warned I would bleed a lot but I didn't. My periods came back in 6 weeks.

You are in a room with a LOT of other women after the procedure, which is upsetting.

Other than that, I felt good after having it done, relieved, happy, mainly relieved.

I do have the odd flash of guilt. I wouldn't do it again.

But, I was reading another thread and it crossed my mind a lot of people do not really seem to know what having a termination is like. My experience may be typical or it may not be, I don't know, but it would be interesting to see what the experiences of others are to try to dispel or to address some of the myths that surround this difficult but sometimes necessary issue.

But no one is saying that they have to be guilty wrecks.

But they do say just that. Look here:

Five, I don't think anyone assumes that will always be the case but if you're advising someone you have to point out the possibility that some people do feel like that.

Winter - the second poster is clearly talking about the foetus being 'torn apart'. I'm not sure that's the best thing to be posting on a thread where people are sharing their abortion stories and some have expressed how hard they found it and how upset they still are

I was once discussing the ethics of abortion with a friend, i was kind of sitting on the fence between pro-choice and pro-life as i was not completely anti abortion however their were certain aspects such as the cut of point being 24 weeks that swayed me towards being pro life. This was until she said ' no woman want's an abortion like she wants an ice cream or a Porsche. She want's an abortion like an animal caught in a trap wants to gnaw off it's own leg' and in that moment i was able to put myself into another woman's shoes and i have never looked back on my stance as being pro-choice.

Actually no, they use the same slogan with a picture of a woman, which was what was supposed to upload, not sure what happened there, terribly sorry (I'll try and have it deleted)

If you go to an abortion clinic, even in this country, you're liable to see that sort of propaganda.

Personally speaking, I'd never, ever advise anyone to have an abortion or not to have an abortion. When I was dithering about mine - and I did - I eventually suddenly reached the decision not to continue the pregnancy (in the middle of the Co Op, of all places!)

I only told one friend who said a good three months later she thought it was for the best in my case, but she didn't say so at the time and I'm pleased she didn't. I think a lot of guilt and shame and upset comes from pressure - either to terminate or to keep the baby.

Whatever the decision is, it MUST be reached entirely independently. I have a daughter now and if she is ever in that position I will force myself to keep my mouth well and truly shut

Of course, she will never be in that position as she is only one and loves her mummy and will never, ever grow to have sex

Why abortion specifically post 24 weeks rather than early induction?

Induction is far riskier for the woman involved and is a different procedure to abortion. It would involve labour and all things associated with it, including the potential for an emergency section, forceps delivery, episiotomy, more advanced pain relief, and so on. And if she doesn't want to do it, if she doesn't want a section or a cut to her perineum, will she be tied down and forced? Why should she be put through a delivery she doesn't want and be made party to delivering an unwanted child when that is against her wishes? It brings us back to the simple fact that pregnancy is not a punishment for having sex.

There would be additional monitoring involved in an induction so more staff required and the procedure would need to take place in a hospital with labour/delivery facilities and a SCBU. The recovery time from an actual delivery is longer and is more likely to have an impact on future pregnancies (e.g., caesarean delivery), and the procedure itself takes longer - an induction can take days, especially if the body is not ready for labour and then there's no telling how long labour will last. Legally, all women who have delivered cannot work for the first two weeks following birth (four weeks for factory workers) and any woman who delivers a baby after 24wks is entitled to maternity leave (and pay, if she qualifies for paid leave). A straightforward, uncomplicated abortion can be done within the space of a day and recovery can be at home with either no need for time off work or very little time off, no one needs to know if the woman doesn't want anyone to know.

Extra SCBU beds and staff would be needed, plus extra staff and resources for any secondary departments involved such as audiology, physiotherapy, etc. The workload for children's services would increase too as more foster carers (and ready in short supply) would be needed for when the child is ready to leave hospital, if that ever happens. Let's not forget that while some premature infants thrive and go on to live perfectly normal lives, the outlook at 24wks is not fantastic. It's a long struggle during which some will sadly pass away and others may be left with life long health issues.

Abortion is by far a better option than forced induction.

I think there are quite a few women on here (me included) saying that they had an abortion and didn't regret it. I can't say it was a happy occasion but I do remember the immense relief of no longer being pregnant.

Me not regretting it doesn't negate the experience of someone who had an abortion and found it traumatic and/or upsetting.

Exactly. We need to encompass all outcomes, not fight it out about which are acceptable feelings on the matter. And we need to stop telling women how they will feel, thats also their own business.

I agree completely Winter and I think that's what fiveacres was aiming for when she started the thread - apologies five if I've misinterpreted.

Nope, spot on I'd say

Tonberry, we are talking about later term abortions here though. I have asked about this previously and people have said that abortion is 'safer' but haven't been able to support that argument. We don't even need to specifically say post 24 weeks. A lot happens between 24 and 40 weeks and people are saying 'to term' so even if we asked specifically why women support abortion post 30/35 weeks for healthy foetuses (acknowledging that this is going to be very rare) when the woman is still going to have to give birth in some way. It seems very strange. I can see where they're trying to come from in the 'woman should have a right to bodily autonomy' being absolute but it does go beyond bodily autonomy at that point because there are alternatives that would allow her to 'withdraw herself from the pregnancy' while still giving a foetus that has a good chance of survival a chance to live as well.

You also talk about resources. Given that people frequently point out that these situations would be 'vanishingly rare' /would never happen - I doubt the NHS is going to be flooded with unwanted preterm infants.

I am not completely sure what I think of abortions post 24 weeks.

Those scenarios are really, really sad and I imagine someone wanting an abortion that late on must be desperate.

But extreme cases make bad laws or whatever the saying is. For most women, terminating a pregnancy before 12 weeks is straightforward, safe, and has no lasting impact on physical or mental health.

Except that quite often when anyone comes on and posts an experience/opinion that differs from five's she jumps on their posts and comes out with gems such as 'contraception is the same as abortion'

That's so rude, and not even true.

I haven't stated contraception is that same as abortion at all I pointed out to one lady who said she would not have an abortion because it was a potential loss, not only of that life but of the lives that life would go on to have, that contraception performed a similar purpose - to prevent new lives being born.

I haven't jumped on anybody's posts, either: I've been perfectly polite!

"I imagine someone wanting an abortion that late on must be desperate."

Well yes, I imagine so. However it is different to support someone's right to bodily autonomy at all stages and to support someone's right to terminate a life at all stages - even if that life no longer actually needs her to survive.

Good for you op. That it didn't hurt.

Are terminations over 24 weeks only allowed if there is a risk to the mother's life/there is a medical issue with the baby?

I didn't say you haven't been polite. I may actually be mixing up some of your posts from the other thread and attributing them to here so apologies for that. Still don't agree with your contraception point though.

I think so, but I'm not completely clear on the law in this area. That's my understanding, but obviously I could be wrong.

Winter, yes a lot of people actually DO say that and no I'm not overstating. Nice of you to try to dismiss my experience when all I'm arguing for is more of a balanced presentation of how people are affected.

Yes writer. Some people have said that they support the right to termination to full term for any reason though.

Can I ask that this thread not be derailed into a debate on late term abortions? Please?

Why? Genuine question.

People have different views on it. I'm not comfortable with them myself, but I respect the views of others and see 'where they are coming from' if you like.

We can't not discuss difficult issues because they are difficult. It's a serious issue that needs thrashing out.

Yellow I've read your post and just wanted to say I hear what you're saying and I'm sorry things were so difficult for you afterwards. It's such a personal thing. Did you receive any counselling or support?

I really have issue with your recommendation that "it didn't hurt". Well, fuck me, good for you you've taken a lifetime of hurt away from your baby. If the procedure didn't hurt her/him.Right?