DB/SIL- AIBU? need some perspective

[jacks11]

I have something of a fraught relationship with my DB, don't really know SIL all that well but we don't get on particularly well. There is a lot of back story to my relationship with DB, but a lot of it is related to his behaviour towards me (and my parents) in his mid-teens and early twenties (alcohol and drug related, but also a lot of deceit and aggression). I find SIL very odd- no motivation to do anything with her life but always moaning that she isn't happy where they live/with her job etc. Whenever she's been to visit me or my parents, she has been quite stand-offish and has to be coaxed into being pleasant.

It was my dad's 65th birthday today and we had organised a bit of a birthday do for family and close friends, at my parent's house. My gran (dad's DM) was being brought by one of my aunts, it's a bit of a drive and she is quite frail so the plan was always that she'd only be staying for a few hours and then she go home. She doesn't like staying away from home or she could have stayed the night. Dad has had a serious illness recently and so he hasn't seen as much of his mum as would normally be the case.

The plan was for me to pick up my brother, SIL and 2 nephews to take them to my parents for the party and drive them back down on Monday (I have to drive that way on Monday for a conference, so it's only a bit out of they way). They don't have a car, and apparently can't get the train for various reasons. I agreed to this as a favour to my parents. It's a 2 and a bit hour journey each way. I arranged to pick brother and nephews up at 11am this morning. SIL was being picked up from work about 11:30.

Just before I was due to arrive, my brother phoned me to say they had left the car seats at his PIL so I had to divert to their house (1/2 across town from my brothers). When I got to my brother's house, they still weren't ready. 15 minutes later my brother announced he needed to go to the supermarket (4 streets away) as they needed nappies for my youngest nephew and needed to get something for Dad's birthday as they hadn't managed to get round to doing this yet. Agreed to this, but was a bit cross tbh. Then went to pick up SIL, who then said "oh, can I take in [youngest nephew] to see my work colleagues?". I said that I'd prefer it if they did it another time as we were running late. She sort of huffed and said she needed to take him in to change his nappy but would be back quickly. Queue 20 minutes later, still not back. Brother went in to see what was wrong- she was busy showing him off to her colleagues after all. I was quite cross, and it was probably obvious- we were now running over an hour late. Half way through the journey, oldest nephew and SIL decide they are hungry and need to stop to get something- neither of them had thought to bring something to eat for the journey apparently. So now we were running really late.

Eventually arrive, late for food and have also managed to miss most of gran's visit, which I had been looking forward to. She was disappointed too- and also sad that she hadn't seen much of my nephews, as she doesn't see them often. Brother proceeds to stuff himself on the food, leaving little for me as I had been trying to get things sorted. I pointed this out and he just shrugged and said "oops". SIL sat with "a face like fizz" and moped. She also spent much of the afternoon sniping about various things (e.g. she thinks all children who go to private school are brats- my DD goes to one). They also started talking about the unfairness of my late grandmother's will- she left a significant amount of money to me and money in trust for DD'e education but didn't leave anything to them for various reasons. Then started talking about putting "dibs" in on various things belonging to my parents now. Not in dad's hearing, but mum did have to point out that it was my brother's own fault that things turned out this way and it wasn't appropriate to discuss it at this time.

I was really annoyed about this conversation and being messed around- I said so to my brother who thought I was over-reacting. He thought the stuff about mum and dad's stuff was a joke (if it was, I didn't think it was funny). We had a bit of a fight after everyone else had gone and I said they could make their own way home on Monday, as I wasn't putting myself out for 2 rude, ungrateful people. I'd take them to the nearest train station, but they could sort themselves out from there. Brother says they can't afford the train tickets, I said they should have thought of that before being so rude (not that they even offered to contribute to my petrol cost, BTW). Dad thinks I should take them as I agreed, and is upset that I have said I won't.

So AIBU? I am just so cross that they have been so crass and rude, then don't even have the grace to apologise and act like I'm the one in the wrong, while they are the injured party. The thing is, when it comes to my brother I sometimes can't see the wood for the trees and can over-react, so would appreciate some perspective. AIBU?

Sorry for the rant.

YesIDid

I had nothing to do with the fall out between DGM and my brother- I think it was a pretty black and white situation. He did something pretty bad and didn't apologise. I don't see what other side there is.

I admit I tend to over-react to things he does, and don't trust him. I recognise that starting an argument was unhelpful and not necessary.

SIL works, as does my brother. He has turned his life around in many ways, which he deserves credit for. He does still do things that are irresponsible and expects others to help him out (hence him owing money to both me and our parents due to debts they ran up). Even my DF gets exasperated with this, DM just seems weary of it. DF just of shrugs his shoulders and says "it's just the way they are". I'm not good at that, I get irritated with their lack of coping skills. Maybe I should be more understanding, because clearly they are trying to do better, but I spent many years "being understanding" of my brothers problems and needs and wants. Now, I'd rather not have to deal with them.

The fact that he's off drugs doesn't undo what was done, things which affected me badly at the time, nor does it change how I feel about what he did. I don't see it as punishing him, but neither am I overly eager to do him favours.

Yanbu

I can't believe she was talking about 'dibs' on her ILs things at her Fils party and in earshot of MIL. I'd be so livid that I'd have to invent a whole new word for it like furiangalid or something.

I'd take them back on Monday if it's what your dad wants but I'd make it extremely clear to them that I'm doing so as a favour to him, not them.

I wonder if the reason he mucked you about yesterday is that he feels hard done by regards the inheritance, and acts passive-aggressively towards you.

Does he do this to your DM and the other family members who inherited, or only you?

I don't see why only you, should give up some of your inheritance for your DN's, as another poster has said. Maybe when the time comes your DM will entrust some to your DN's, but that's up to her.

I bet if you add up all the money that has been "lent" to him, value of goods stolen to fund his addictions and other costs such as paying for fines etc., it would come to a tidy sum, not to mention the unquantifiable heartbreak his actions caused.

There does come a time with piss-takers when enough is enough.

I agree that if you do take them home to say that you are doing it as your DF asked, are going at x hours and will not wait for them or take them on errands on the way.

OP, does the SIL know the truth about why DB was not in the will? I wonder if he has played the poor me card, that it's all so unfiar and he has no idea why you are the favoured child etc?

Or the pair of them could just be obnoxious entitled selfish disorganised unreliable twits,of course!

OP didn't ask for comment about her grandmother's will. Very rude of posters to do so.

She asked if she was BU in not driving this awful man and his wife home. And she isn't.

Why on earth are people scrabbling about suggesting ways in which the grandmother could have structured her will? The OP's brother stole some of her prize possessions and refused to pay her back or apologise for it! She didn't want him to benefit from her will, and therefore took steps to cut him out. Presumably, she also intended for those whom she did cater for, to keep their money and not pass it on to him through the back door. She seems to have felt that he'd had quite enough of her money already.

I would take them home for your parent's sake but would not let them mess me about again. If you still have any money from the legacy I would put some in trust for his kids (dependent on how much it was).

People are unusually keen to excuse your DB's behaviour, usually MN isn't so forgiving.

No, they're more keen to take a pop at people like the OP, rather than the family members who're behaving badly.

Phantom

I don't know for sure as I've never asked. I assume she does, as she knows about my brother's problems.

I don't think I've expressed it well, but I think where I'm coming from re my relationship with my brother is that if a partner had done the things he did, nobody would bat an eyelid if I never spoke to him again. I doubt I'd be expected to brush it under the carpet now that he has kicked his drug habit. Somehow, the fact that he's my brother, means I'm just supposed to forget about it all and wipe the slate clean. I don't want to do that, I'm happier with little contact and keeping my distance. We really only having contact when it's to do with our parents or when I'm asked to help out when asked by our parents. I don't view this as punishing him.

With regards my DB and my nephews, I'm sure DGM could have done all the things others have suggested, if she had wanted to. She chose not to, which was her prerogative. I don't feel bad about my brother getting nothing, i don't think it particularly unfair, but I can see that others feel differently about it. Perhaps the issue of DN's is maybe slightly different, but I don't really know what, if anything, I would want to do about it.

Also, people are assuming that OPs inheritance included what would have gone to her brother. Which isnt necessarily the case.

Grandmother distributed her estate to the people and organisations she wanted. There is no such thing as anyone having a righful share, so there is no such thing as someone else receiving that rightful share. There is no portion that was his and his sister got it. There was only the whole thing, divided out to people and organisations GM saw fit to honor with a gift. He knowingly removed himself from that grouping. GM may have found an extra charity, or another person completely to bestow the portion that otherwise would have gone to grandson. Or everyone named in the will might have had a larger bit. But there is no reason to assume OP got double because she got DBs portion. Even if GM did give OP twice what she would have, it was not DBs 'portion', it was GMs property to dispose of to whom she wished.

MN really makes me laugh sometimes.

By all means do your mum & dad a favour and take them home if they cba to be ready on time.

But you don't owe your brother or his family a single thing.

No, they're more keen to take a pop at people like the OP, rather than the family members who're behaving badly. I'm sure if DB was here or the SIL, they would be getting shit. I prefer to look at MN as the embodiment of the principle, 'you can only change your behaviour'. The collective voice of MN is often shirty to the OP, because they are the one asking. If DB was here, I'm sure he would be told to suck it up and stop being a petulant child. But he's not here, the OP is.

My theory is that people are responsible for their own behaviour and if DB was here, I would be telling him to make amends, make a proper recovery and stop PA bitching about the will.

However, I also think that having one child who is 'perfect' and has a good job, lovely children, no addictions and a great life... and one who has addictions, less than awesome life, history of stealing and lying. I would want to have some serious chats about their respective childhoods. Thee things tend not to come form nowhere.

OP, if you don't want to give lifts and favours with good grace, don't. But playing out this scenario where you do favours for your feckless DB and he disappoints you and you let him know, is so unhealthy.

These things tend not to come from nowhere. I should have proofread!

I think she did the favour for her parents, not the brother, specifically. They wanted him at the birthday celebration and he wouldn't come otherwise.

I think the OP sounds as if she has got a healthy attitude towards this situation. She's not close to her brother, due in part to the way he's behaved in the past, only some of which we've been told about, and she's duly distanced herself. It's not her place to do anything more to try to "fix" him, although it sounds as though he has made some efforts to improve his life more recently.

It's going to be a nasty few hours in the car OP.

I wouldn't do it personally. Especially if he's likely to try and mess you about again, or carry on the argument.

The will is nothing to do with you. Your Grandmother left her estate as she wanted to leave it.

You have no responsibility to your brother and his family.

If they use the children and a lack of money as a reason for being unable to catch the train, that's up to them.

And if someone, probably your parents, decides to give into that emotional blackmail and pay for the train fare, well that's also up to them.

I wouldn't want to spend a two hour journey in a car with people I'd argued with, especially if they are likely to prat about being late or needing to stop every five minutes just to score points.

I wonder if the brother is passive-aggressively trying to claw back some of he sees as "his" inheritance by expecting his parents and sister to run round after him - hence not paying back loans/expecting his train fare paid/contributing nothing towards the OP's petrol money.

MrsTerry
I'm not sure what the difference was in our childhood. I think we had a goo childhood with loving parents who have always done their best. We have both had the same opportunities in terms of education and encouragement. My brother started going off the rails at about 15. My father had been quite ill, but that effected both of us. I don't think I was always the "golden child" and it's not something he's ever accused me of. Maybe he'd see it differently.

I know it's often the case that someone who develops an addiction has had a rough start in life, but it's not true of everyone. Sometimes people make bad choices and the law of unintended consequences comes into play. I genuinely think that is the case here, but I am sure some will believe I'm deluding myself or too blinkered to see the truth.

I'm not sure what the difference was in our childhood. I wonder if he knows.

I worked in a rehab and the majority of people there were there for a reason; mostly abuse. I'm not saying your DB was abused but possibly your DF's illness affected him badly. Possibly his coping with drugs could have been dealt with better. Who knows? It's not about deluding yourself. Sometimes the whole family has denial, not just the addict.

MrsTerry
posted too soon! I was happy to give the lift as a favour to my parents. I was not happy to be messed about. I lost my temper with them, it would have been better if I hadn't. Not the same as not doing things with good grace.

Mrs TP - And sometimes children who have a happy childhood turn out to be selfish and inconsiderate adults who only think of themselves - for whatever unknown reason. Going so far as to steal from your grandmother is an incredibly low step to fall to, and then to have absolutely no repentance years later is peculiarly self-absorbed. It must be very difficult for the other family members to have to cope with that.

True, but I think maybe this is a script. Everyone's behaviour is on rails. You do a favour for your DParents but help your DB. He resents it because you get points once again and prove you are 'golden'. You resent once again having to be the responsible one. He acts out because he's resentful. You get angry because it's not actually your fault. He reacts and on and on.

None of this has to be the actual truth for it to happen and hurt. Someone has to step outside the roles and you are here asking, not him.

I'm going to ask, not because I think you're a horrible person. Is even part of you happy or fulfilled by being a little 'better' than him? I was a golden child and much as it pained me to be responsible, part of me felt that every time I stepped up and DB didn't, I was getting a tiny pat on the back. Very very unhealthy. Things are better now I know that and act accordingly.

My situation is very different but I had to start saying things like, "DB is happy how he is and can make his own way" to my DParents.

Mmm was thinking similar to mrs terry, that DB hasn't really dealt with his addiction fully, neither have your DPS; they may feel responible/guilty at some level and are facilitating him not really facing up which in my admittedly limited understanding, would probably involve DB accepting he hurt many people and taking responsibility? As that hasn't happened no-one quite trusts him. Maybe if it did happen he himself would gain more than anyone, but I daresay it won't, as it it must be such a brave, difficult thing for any addict to do. Not sure I could manage it either....

And sometimes children who have a happy childhood turn out to be selfish and inconsiderate adults who only think of themselves - for whatever unknown reason. Not in my experience. Not with healthy, happy boundaries, good relationships and no trauma. Not unless there is a medical reason. Some young people are massively more challenging, some react to trauma differently but the vast majority of young people I see in my work have issues.

That doesn't mean it's their families' fault or even that the family knows (sexual abuse is often hidden) but it's there.

And BTW it doesn't excuse terrible behaviour. I just find it more helpful to focus on solutions, rather than blame.