AIBU to be depressed that women atre STILL appeasing men for a quiet life?

[Hakluyt]

When I was a young woman a million years it was considered quite normal for women to put their wishes, even in quite trivial things, second to their husbands' and then third once children arrived. Men were often expected to get the best chair, the best bits of food- the household tended to revolve around their needs.

And it sometimes seems to me that not much has changed. The number of threads on here where people talk about doing things "for a quiet life", giving in because "it's not worth the hassle- I can't be doing with the sighing and huffing". Even women putting up with crap and then getting secret revenge instead of talking about things like grown ups!

I just find it so depressing that little seems to have changed. Why are we still doing this?

I think that this happens less in my generation than it did in previous ones, but it does still happen. I've known women my own age (late 20s) stay with partners they don't like very much just to avoid being on their own. On the one hand I find that unfathomable, but on the other hand I can see that society seems to behave as if the main aim of women is to get married and have children. People feel sorry for women who are single in their late thirties, but not so much for single men. Single women must be lonely, but single men are lucky to still be able to lead a bachelor life. In long-term, unmarried relationships it is assumed that the man won't marry the woman, and that she must really be wanting to get married. My MIL feels sorry for DP because she thinks won't let him go out as much as he used to, despite being told this is not the case.

It drives me up the wall!

Someone can try selling selfishness (of any sort, female or not) to me. Right now, I don't get it.

I agree with Viviennemary, certainly my wife tends to rule the roost. I just want a quiet life, so I go along with things like gardening, which I perceive as a never-ending battle with nature.

I really can't say about food - I'm twice the size of my wife, so naturally I eat more. My wife certainly gets 50% (plus) of treats.

For some reason, my wife has decided we need a small patio in the middle of the back lawn, so I guess I will go buy some paving stones, and muscle them about.

Anything for a quiet life, right?

So many interesting posts so far- but the one that leaped out at me was this

"Now many many years later and having done the growing up of two women just to bring myself to a "normal " state. Things are good."

Such a resonant, powerful sentence.

Whose job takes priority, CanadianJohn? Do you have children? Who does the bulk of the childcare? If your child is ill and needs to be picked up immediately from school/childcare, who cancels meetings or takes unpaid leave? Is there a 'default parent'? If you need to work late, who sorts out chilminder pickups/after school care/whatever?

How are general domestic chores/shopping/cleaning/laundry divided? Who is the default cook? Do you have equal time to spend out of the house on hobbies/socialising?

Food and patios are beside the point, tbh.

undeuxtwacinq- but did you read the loads of posters on your thread who said things about taking "secret revenge" because their partners did things like leaving their dirty washing for them to pick up? They were being treated with contempt, and instead of talking about it like adults they carried on picking up the dirty socks but took some sort of secret, private revenge. What sort of a life is that?

Then the classic "oh it's all a bit of fun- you sound like a dried up humourless old stick" came out.............That's what people do when looking at what's really going on is too scary.

Ask yourselves. How often in the history of the world has a wife said to a husband "Have I got any clean pants?"

Hak- thanks for understanding me.

Ask yourselves. How often in the history of the world has a wife said to a husband "Have I got any clean pants?"

all we can ask is how often in our lifetime has it been said, as it will never be even in our lives

My mother has found an anchor- she became a born again christian. So rather than taking the opportunity to grow up herself she has traded one dependancy for another.

Miggsie, I asked DH if he'd ever asked his mum why they'd had such traditional parental gender roles when he was growing up. He said that she replied exactly what you said: 'we never discussed it' and 'it just happened'. NB She had her own very successful career, by the way, but had to be a hostess and entertainer for FIL's work colleagues as well as being the main parent carer, running the house and having her own job. FIL did the handyman type jobs outside and he dutifully does the washing up, but that's it.

My dad was definitely more hands on - my mum was a teacher so if one of us was ill it was easier for him to work at home than her. So I remember being looked after him whine I was ill quite often. He also cooks, after a fashion, and I remember him wiping my bum even! sorry tmi

I meant never even in our lifetimes even if men did 100% of the washing now.

YANBU and I am guilty as charged and to be quite frank it's slowly killing the person I used to be!

0x530 are you saying that truly equal domestic partnerships are inconceivable?
Surely it's possible that things could change, or perhaps living with a partner wont always be the norm as more and more women realise that they actually have less work to do if they don't live with a man

surely it is underpinned by wage inequality and the disrupting effect of having children on a womans earning potential.
If those things could be dealt with then women have no need to be economically tied to men.

I have fallen into the same pattern as my mother for sure. dropped out of uni and married DH, was pregnant at 21, all of a sudden I went from being an autonomous individual to a housewife. We bought a house in the country, I was isolated, I couldn't work a washing machine let alone keep a cycle of clean sock and underpants going for precious DH.....We have been married for 15 years now, two more DCs later and I've forgotten how many times I've been asked for clean pants.

.....and you are right OP, I just fell into it, it's what you do isn't it. I'm finding that the older I get the less tolerance I have for it

I'm finding that the older I get the less tolerance I have for it
me too, and I make sure my daughter knows the score so that she can avoid the pitfalls....

Funnily enough I started a thread maybe a two and a half years ago about laundry and how I don't wash DH's clothes (I was mostly a SAHM at the time) and I got a hell of a lot of responses saying he'd leave me and I was a bad mother (?). Only a few responded that they also don't wash their DH's clothes. Even women who worked fulltime washed everyone's clothes, while the DH did no laundry at all.
It's interesting how many women seem to think that of course a woman should wash a man's clothes but then would never expect a man to wash a woman's clothes. What does that say about the female/male relationship and the power dynamic between them?

It said a lot about my mother too when I moved in with DH, we had no children, he was studying and I was working fulltime (he had a lot more free time than me) and she said I was "very hard on him" because I didn't wash his clothes. This is the same woman who had to work fulltime, do practically everything for three children and wash her overgrown teenager's DH's socks for years and years on end, working herself into the ground while said DH did absolutely nothing. For her, I think it was jealousy and a realisation that she could have and should have told the lazy fucker to wash his own pants but she didn't and was made a mug of by someone who said he loved her. She still washes his pants now, but she also hates him.

When I was at uni, I met a woman who turned down a fully funded scholarship (which are rare as hens teeth) because her partner was refused a scholarship. He gave her an ultimatum, him or the PhD, so she chose him and I know what I would have chosen. Such a waste of intellectual talent all because her thick husband didn't get a scholarship and he was threatened by his wife.

My DH washes his own clothes. He had his own laundry bin when we moved in together, mine was really tiny and it made sense to keep separate laundry bins therefore separate loads of washing.

I mainly so the DC laundry with mine but he'll put a load on for me if I ask him to, or the towels and sheets if they need doing and he's at home while I'm not.

I think in some cases men feel so strongly about doing what they view as womens work that they duck and wriggle out of it wherever possible, as has been said if you live with someone it's impossible to deal with this without also making life very uncomfortable for yourself

Personally it depresses and disappoints me how many women are still accepting their 2nd class position as penniless stay at home mum who quite often seem to need to 'ask' their chap for money (I have been told this more than once...). Women think they are doing the best thing for their children. Really? We regularly go to children's parties and the same women turn up everytime without their husband. In their relationship it seems stuff like putting children to bed, cooking and cleaning, kids parties are regarded as 'women's work'. The chaps prefer to visit B&Q etc on a sunday afternoon, wouldnt we all... When I was growing up I honestly thought it would be different but reality is shocking... Women have to get off their arses and stop clinging to the idea of prince charming and get out there and build their own financial security. Please note I am not against SAHM's but if you are a SAHM have a joint bank account, have a hobby etc. dont be a martyr.

I cannot stand passive aggressive behaviour. When there is a dispute, is it beneficial in any way to remain quiet and then get some "secret" revenge? No it isn't. You talk about stuff honestly and frankly like adults.

On the subject at hand there's nothing really to say about it, it goes both directions. Many men put up with crap from their wives for an easy life, or because they don't want her to start using sex as a weapon against them to get her own way. And you are correct, it also works the other way with wives putting up with crap because they don't want the stress of it. It happens and I don't see it going away any time soon.

My bil and several of dh's friends refer to him as being 'under the thumb'. This being because he'll ask me about my plans before agreeing to nights out, weekends away etc and in their company defer to me about decisions and be seen to be (shock horror) jointly responsible for care of dcs and cooking/hosting. In reality he probably does do more than me as he also works full time and I'm currently on mat leave but otherwise work 4 days out of 5, but we have a very happy partnership and share housework etc (I possibly do more atm but he cooks far more than I do). However it seems to other men that this is hugely unequal for him and therefore I must be some kind of controlling harridan keeping him under my rule. Sad really - we do thinks for each other because we love each other. There is no hierarchy of decision making, but luckily we tend to agree on most things anyway (or enjoy a light hearted disagreement until we do!).