To not want 13 year old to trek in Northern India/Pakistan border with dad?

[pathogenius]

Ex-H is moving off to travel in Northern India for 6 months. We split when our DC, now 13, was 6 months old though he's remained in and out of DC's life. Ex is struggling with major guilt about leaving DC's life for long periods of time to live in other countries. But now he would like to go off to India to live for a minimum of 6 months and he would like our DC to join him this summer for 7 weeks in and around the India/Pakistan border (trekking/living out in the open, under the stars). I am having great difficulty feeling all right with this. Ex does not know India or this area at all. He is not living a mainstream life whilst out there. He plans on roughing it, backpacking, trekking, camping, crashing here and there. It's a very unstructured life for a 13 year old. That's my opinion. Dad can do this. That's fine. But I think our DC is still too young to go away for that length of time to such a far off place. The idea is to live a life without technology, so our contact would be practically nil!

Thoughts? Experiences? Insight? Thank you!

[MovingOnUpMovingOnOut]

lol at New Forest. Probably akin to suggesting Rambo has a ride on a miniature railway

But I don't disagree!

[SunnyBaudelaire]

actually OP your ex sounds really really naive and childish, is he really responsible enough to take care of his child?

[MyCatIsAGit]

[LayMeDown]

No chance, in fact him even suggesting it would make me question whether I trust him even to take my child to New Forest!

My concerns would be these
The Area obviously - dangerous, unpredictable and remote. Aside from the risk from terrorists what if something happens to one or both of them a fall, an infection, sickness? How would your 13 year old cope in that sort of siutation. How would they get help?

The length of time - 7 weeks is the entire summer holidays. Will you not get to see your child at all? What if they hate it? Trekking, under the stars camping, roughing it are not for everyone. Even for the most hardened of campers can get a bit trying after a few weeks. Will your child have to suck it up and be miserable and bored?

The responsible adult - I would only consider letting my child go away for this length of time for this sort of holiday (even somewhere less dangerous) with another adult that I trusted implicitly. That pretty much narrows it down to about 3 other people in the world. I have to be honest you ex does not appear to be one of these people.

The lack of contact - It would be a very unpleasenet 7 weeks for me if my child was away and I could nto get any reassurance that they were OK. I would need contact at least every couple of days. Are you just meant to wait and see if they arrive back after the 7 weeks. If something happens to either of them you would have no idea until they didnt come home. Which would probabaly be too late to help.

Totally out of the question. It would never happen.

[sparechange]

Good grief NO
My parents moved us to that area for a couple of years when we were children (my dad had a tenuous job there, and my mother is from there), so I know it pretty well.
25 year later, we sometimes talk about going back to see how it has changed. Despite speaking the language pretty well (not fluent any more but more than enough to get by) AND having connections there AND having extended family nearby, none of us will give it any proper consideration beyond 'wouldn't it be nice to see it now'.

To go out there on a whim and a prayer is madness... I'm not sure your ex would even be able to get a visa?

[ragged]

Bloody hell, it's been a semi-war zone for 45 yrs. Who would be so mad? this is a joke, right?

Nepal India border would be a lot better, if he must.

[NickiFury]

Not a chance.

[stubbornstains]

I was going to say "Why not a nice few weeks' camel trekking in Rajasthan/ visiting the northern hill stations etc", but then it really started sinking in as to how much of a tool your ex must be. As PPs have pointed out, the India- Pakistan border has technically been a war zone, and off limits to foreigners, for years. So your ex must have discovered this when he very first started reading up on and planning this trip. He must be some kind of thrill seeking idiot with no sense of responsibility for his child, so my worry would be that, once he got DS to India, that he would ignore your plans and suggestions, and just take him there anyway .

[Momagain1]

There are places they can live remote and off grid right and avoid daily technology here in the UK. And hike down to the nearest village to call you every Sunday.

Suggest that is preferable to the same in a potential war zone.

[sparechange]

Also, logistically, how on earth will this work?
Ex is in the wilderness being held hostage and fairly uncontactable.
DS flies unaccompanied into Lahore or Islamabad, with 7 weeks worth of clothes, and then what. Ex comes and meets him at the airport and takes him back to go trekking? DS is supposed to get there himself?

Then DS needs to get himself back to the airport to get his return flight.
If ex is doing this with no money, contingency, planning, there is no way it would even be possible for the two of them to meet up for the 7 weeks...
But I am going to put money on this falling flat when your ex realises he won't be able to get a visa for himself, let alone DS.

[popalot]

Ex sounds selfish imo. He swans off and leaves you to bring up his dc whilst finding himself in other countries. Now, he will only spend quality time with his child if he joins him in his hippy dream of camping in an area that is notoriously dangerous.

Don't be guilt tripped into this one, it's all about your ex. Your dc will have a shit time with someone that selfish.

[Muddymits]

He knows you will say no, but this time it's not his fault because you asked?

Or he has just revealed himself unsafe for anything other than centre parks for the next few years.

[ArcheryAnnie]

My DS is your DS's age. Mine has Indian heritage, has family in the region, and although he doesn't speak any of the relevant languages, knows how to behave in a culturally appropriate manner.

I still would not let him go on a trip like your ex is proposing. Seeing family in that general area, yes, as long as it wasn't experiencing or expecting unrest. Visiting cultural highlights in well-travelled areas, yes. Stumbling around the border with Pakistan, deliberately roughing it and cut off from technology - not in a billion, billion years.

Just the thought of it gives me the heebie-jeebies.

[UncleT]

No, no and no. And I love crazy travel. It's against advice and in any case, even in less tense political times, is completely unsuitable for an uninitiated 13-year-old. Don't even think about allowing it.

[SunnyBaudelaire]

oh is that area on the FO 'don't go there' list?
How v irresponsible of him to be even considering it!

[Cryjustalittle]

Hi. I currently live in India and took my kids (5 and 8) to the India / Pakistan border a few weeks ago. It was fine. There is more risk if you were based on the Pakistan side of the border. Generally, they couldn't get within 5 km of any border anyway and that land is cordoned off, with heavy security. Where are they planning on going? PM if you want any advice, esp as my husbands job here means he has special insight into what is going on safety wise.

If they were in Gujurat, or Punjab for example there would be no significant issue. I know a western girl who runs glamping in Ladakh which is firmly on our list for next summer if we are still here.

[BigRedBall]

No way! Isn't that the disputed area of Kashmir? No way would I let my child go there. And to sleep under the stars? Does he know how hot India Pakistan is during the summer? It gets upto 40°C during the day and 30 at night. There is no protection. He is in cloud cuckoo land if he thinks he can trek in that area of the world. It's not something even the natives would consider. Silly man.

[UncleT]

Yes Cry. Fine while you're lucky, which to be fair is probably most of the time. High risk of militant activity in general though.

[Cryjustalittle]

..that said, I wouldn't be doing anything without a plan, including and especially where I would expect to be staying in the evening (whether that was roughing it or not). I think that the randomness of his plan would probably be enough for me to say no when I think about it.

Is your ex an experienced traveller? Is he experienced in this type of situation? I met a couple in Laos many years ago, who did this in the Thai jungle with a toddler (strapped to their backs) for 3 months. Their plan had been to wander for a few months and go where their noses took them - complete with tents and living off the land. They were extremely experienced and confident in what they were doing. I wouldn't have done it, but they were fine despite encounters with drug runners and wild tigers....

[BudsBeginingSpringinSight]

if it was anywhere else safe ish - i would say yes but not the pakistan border no way!

[FauxFox]

What does your DC think about it? Have you told them? Do they know dad well enough to be comfy with such a trip?

[pathogenius]

Thank you all for your input! Wow I am so grateful. I was sort of expecting to hear more 'calm down, he'll be fine' messages. I am worried. I am worried because I know my ex well, of course I do. And he is in a bad place, life wise. He has not worked in the past 18 months. He's a military guy who served in Afghanistan. He has PTSD. It is so obvious, it's screaming but he doesn't hear. His way of dealing with it is to shut up shop, tell our son that his life in the UK has failed, his relationships are not working, work hasn't worked out, etc. They spent two weeks together recently (in Europe) and it was a wonderful but 'heavy' time. Lots of tears. Lots of regret from dad about noe being in son's life more. Lots of sadness about failing at certain things in life. DC is incredibly stressed about dad. He feels as if he has to fix dad's life, make it better. He also worries about him going off to India and coming home 6 months from now with the same problems or not coming home at all. DC is a very calm, nice kid. But the other night I looked at his bedroom door and it was cracked and the wood punched in. He admitted he did this. He doesn't understand why he did it. It shocked the heck out of me. DC has become distant, morose. He says he wants to go to India and then he doesn't want to go to India. He is 13 and I don't expect him to know exactly what he wants. What I know is I feel incredibly uncomfortable with this. I feel so pushed and I am being given no option to discuss my concerns. If I voice a concern, dad will go from being nice to being angry and hurt. He takes it so personally. To suggest another region in the world is impossible because dad leaves in a couple of days to India. He only told us two weeks ago that he was packing up his life and going to India for 6 months. And now, before he leaves, he wants to buy a ticket for our son NOW for 7 weeks in India. So little discussion has occurred. I have so little info. I feel really pushed into saying yes.

[Hulababy]

I would say no, without a shadow of doubt and with no regrets.

The father doesn't seem like he is in a good place right now - the update about the two weeks away recently show this, and your son's reaction since. Also sounds like dad is putting pressure on your son making him feel he has to go - that's not on.

I wouldn't agree to my 13y going off anywhere for 7 weeks with no contact (or with contact tbh) let alone somewhere so dangerously unstable.

I am not even sure you'd get insurance and the practicalities seem fraught with risk and uncertainty.

At the end of the day it is dad's decision to up and go. He made a choice to do this and have no/limited contact with his son.

[base9]

You need to take the decision out of your son's hands. Tell Dad it will not be happening. Tell ds it will not be happening. Be tough and stick to your decision. It is yours to make.