To think this woman is at best misguided and at worst disgusting?

[Totality22]

Will try to be brief.

I was introduced to a friend of a friend who is ebf her DS (about 10 weeks) and it came up in conversation that she drinks a bottle of wine in one evening once / twice a week. She was unashamed but made it clear she didn't neck it back (drinks it over the course 4-5 hours)

Once I picked my jaw up off the floor the conversation had moved on but I am still thinking about it days later.

I like a drink, can happily open a bottle and finish it the same evening [over the course of a good few hours, like the lady in question]. I had a glass of champers when 8 months pregnant so I am certainly not adverse to the notion of drinking / pregnancy / BF'ing.

AIBU to find this woman shocking though?

To not drip feed woman is a medical professional not trained in UK and currently a SAHP here, her husband is a Dr, she is not English [culturally I assume this may be relevant as maybe the info is different to here?], and she did this with her first baby who is now 5 and perfectly fine.

TBH the thing that depresses me so often is that when a woman is pg or has a child all of a sudden there is little to no focus on her and it's all about the baby. And yes babies are vulnerable but so are women who have had children sometimes, and certainly they should not be overlooked entirely as they so often are.

If a woman who is BF is drinking excessively, there is a large risk to her. But all too often all the focus is on the behaviour of the woman and how she might be harming her child, even if she almost certainly isn't, and very frequently women who are really struggling don't get a sideways glance from HCPs or similar.

It's this sort of erasure of a woman as a person in her own right once she is a mother (or pregnant) - it is just all wrong.

And that does seem strong I know but reading this thread and posts it just makes me feel that way.

I'm a bit shocked that so many people think it's OK to drink a bottle of wine and be in charge of a baby. I didn't drink when DS was tiny, personal choice. Certainly didn't drink while Co sleeping. I'd be far too worried of not being able to look after him properly after drinking that much. The amount that gets into milk is miniscule. I didn't realise how little, so have learnt something from this thread. But a bottle of wine is about 10 units isn't it? Isn't that a lot?

It's a lot for anyone to drink, but its nothing to do with bfing and its entirely up to her what she chooses to drink.

bottle of wine over about 5 hours, not in one go.

I hadn't considered (and frankly don't care) what those who disagree with the op drink!

You're calling people 'defensive' - what is it you think they're defending?

I think a bottle of wine in an evening is a lot when you're in charge of a baby, but not because of the very, very small amounts of alcohol that end up in the milk. I certainly wouldn't call someone 'disgusting' for drinking that much when BFing.

I'm BFing at the moment and drink one or two small/medium glasses of wine a week. I have fed the baby while holding a glass of wine in the other hand, though, which the OP clearly finds shocking...

People on this thread appear to have difficult telling the difference between a glass of wine and a whole bottle of wine.

Hows that then?

I don't think that a whole bottle of wine consumed in one evening can be classed as 'moderate' drinking.

No it probably can't be classed as moderate drinking. Especially not on a very regular basis. But that doesn't necessarily mean the difference between a glass and a bottle poses a much greater risk to the baby. The risk is to the mother's long term health.

YANBU. Drinking whilst breastfeeding is wrong as is drinking whilst pregnant

no its not its very different! the baby is consuming in a very different way, what a stupid comment.

If alcohol in breastmilk was so horrendously dangerous that ebf mothers should not drink at all, ever, or should avoid bf/express possibly contaminated milk, than the human race would not have survived during the centuries when drinking beer and wine from chilhood until deathwas the norm. Even fairly recently in the present era when many of our own mothers/grandmothers drank normal, moderate amounts during and after pregnancy. Indeed, my mother was advised to do so as late as 1980. Ditto pregnant women.

This woman may be crossing a line. But that line is not as clearly and firmly placed at "0" as many have come to think in the last few decades. It couldnt be, logically.

I don't think a bottle of wine is that shockingly much is it? It's a large amount but not totally off the wall.

I suppose it depends how often you drink a bottle of wine, Bertie. If you only do it occasionally I doubt it's a problem. If you do it regularly over a long period of time then it may well be that you are storing up alcohol related health problems for the future.

Oh yes, absolutely. I agree totally. I just didn't think it was such a shocking amount occasionally.

(I realise the OP wasn't talking about occasionally)

PterodactylTeaParty

I replied because I feel op has a point and some of the replies were a bit angry and verging on nasty. Regardless of opinion we should be able to discuss without insulting folk (too much!). I agree one or two wines is fine. However, given the research into gross motor development I just wouldn't chance any more without expressing.

I think a bottle of wine once or twice a week is a fair amount. I wouldn't say it's binge drinking nor overly excessive but I might internally raise an eyebrow.

I like a drink but in this country, I think we have a very relaxed attitude to alcohol and are a bit blinkered to what it can do. Look how aggressive the smoking threads get on there. Yet, alcohol - like nicotine - is also a harmful substance.

Having looked up the Little et al paper on alcohol and gross motor development, it appears there was only a difference in gross motor development when the mother drank daily. Any less than that and there was no difference in gross motor development between mothers that drank and those that didn't. I'm not sure if there are any more recent papers than that.

Which might lead to the interesting situation where drinking one bottle over the course of an evening a couple of times a week might be better than a glass every night. As counter intuitive as that sounds.

I drank wine with both but half that amount and it was more once they were 3 months plus.

A bottle of wine does sound a lot. Half that amount would be ok.

Surely her reflexes and judgement were impaired? I would not want a babysitter drinking that while looking after my child!!

"600 empty calories in a bottle of wine "

oh fucking wonderful. Should've known it wouldn't be long before someone added the magical threat of fatness to the judging party.

grumbelina actually made me laugh.

Also whoever mentioned the spare pair of judge pants, I will borrow that phrase thank you.

Did a bottle of red myself yesterday, along with a pizza and six tunnock's teacakes. I don't even like chocolate but that whole caboodle made me feel a world better.

I've been pregnant or breastfeeding since 2010, and have drunk in moderation while breastfeeding without any concerns. Thinking hard, I've probably in that time drunk the equivalent of a bottle of wine over a long evening with a meal while on holiday a few times. I don't think of myself as disgusting for that. On the whole I drink far less than the recommended limit, while drinking exactly the amount I want.

I think the fact that the alcohol/breast milk thing is so misunderstood is absolutely a reason why some women don't breastfeed or stop very early, and that's a real shame.