to wish I could vote ukip loud and proud

[Mumof4worried]

I've nc for this, as I generally have to in life.

I'm voting ukip, I live in Peterborough where we have had massive immigration. The affects have been huge. Enlargement of EU distroyed dh building business overnight. The schools are close to bursting and have to do a school run to two different schools, had a 5 hour wait in a and e. Teenage son struggles to get part time farm work like I did when I was a teenager. House prices are out of control, god knows how any of mine will ever leave home.

I'm not saying all of these are 100% to do with uncontrolled immigration, but it has Made the problems so much worse.

I'm not racist, most of my friends are 2nd gen Asians or homophobic, my brother and his husband visit a lot.

I just want an oz type points immigration system. I don't care that lots are highly skilled, that is often very bad as it leads to a brain drain in other countries and my children will have to compete with the worlds most ambitious and motivated people.

I just want to be able to express these thoughts but I'm shamed into hiding them by the media.

The biggest potential threat that I see to the values that I hold dear comes from the growing influence of the far right.

Also agree.

The biggest potential threat that I see to the values that I hold dear comes from the growing influence of the far right.

This (and politics is becoming professional weirdos talking to other professional weirdos)

From the 1987 Conservative Manifesto: Immigration for settlement is now at its lowest level since control of Commonwealth immigration first began in 1962. Firm but fair immigration controls are essential for harmonious and improving community relations.

We will tighten the existing law to ensure that the control over settlement becomes even more effective.

We now require visas for visitors from the Indian sub-continent, Nigeria and Ghana, both to protect genuine travellers and to guard against bogus visitors seeking to settle here illegally. We are tackling the problem of those who fraudulently pose as refugees and who seek to exploit Britain's long tradition of giving refuse to the victims of persecution.

We want to see members of the ethnic minorities assuming positions of leadership alongside their fellow citizens and accepting their full share of responsibility. Racial discrimination is an injustice and can have no place in a tolerant and civilised society. We are particularly concerned about racial attacks. They require effective and sympathetic attention from the police and we have ensured that increasingly they receive it.

Progress towards better community relations must be on a basis of equality. Reverse discrimination is itself an injustice and if it were to be introduced it would undermine the achievement and example of those who had risen on their merits.

Immigrant communities have already shown that it is possible to play an active and influential role in the mainstream of British life without losing one's distinctive cultural traditions. We also want to see all ethnic minorities participating fully in British culture. They will suffer permanent disadvantage if they remain in linguistic and cultural ghettos.

I rather think it's been discussed for a while.

The biggest potential threat that I see to the values that I hold dear comes from the growing influence of the far right.
I too, agree with this.

Meanwhile tourists from India who planned a 10 day holiday have been denied access and been held in Yarls Wood for a month because one of them had a copy of her qualifications on her. Her husband died in Yarls Wood.

This is what anti migrant hysteria does, this is what "more controls" mean - is this really what you want? People being imprisoned for being foreign?
You don't even need to vote UKIP for that shit as the current administration is already doing a good job at being as inhumane as possible
www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/yarls-wood-hunger-strike-at-immigration-removal-centre-for-release-of-widow-10196889.html

The biggest political threat is the left thinking they know best - 'we're right you're wrong, we're clever you're stupid' - that was their attitude over immigration, ( & probably still is ) that's the problem. Calling anyone who dares to have concerns over immigration 'racist' & it's happened all through this thread. Anyone supporting UKIP are ignorant idiots who shouldn't be allowed the vote - I think the charming phrase 'fuckwits' was even used.
With an arrogant attitude like that ( & it is pure arrogance ) you can't be surprised when right wing parties rise up & bite you on the arse.

Like, as the tories are taking away my husband's support, my children's support, decreasing disability benefits, demonising the poor, supported by the right and the far right, where else would a somebody go?

FFS. I have only read some of this thread and I am appalled by the ignorance on it. Please, if you are thinking of voting UKIP, read their actual policies and understand where they are coming from!

They focus on immigration as a problem but they have worrying things to say about many other things. Some of which are covered on here.

If you read up on them, agree and then vote then it is your right but at least be informed.

I used the term 'fuckwits'.

I prefer it to 'Kippers'. I think it's more accurate.

Dawn - you can be a labour voter without being rude to others ( not you personally ) I like a few of labours policies, I like a few of UKIP's too - I understand that politics is a very emotive subject sometimes, but living in a democracy I respect freedom of choice & I'd never shout anyone down with a ' I know best attitude'

"Calling anyone who dares to have concerns over immigration 'racist'"

No, like them or not, none of the main parties are saying this.

It is fuckwittery to claim that 'Britishness' is under threat and to then not be able to provide any evidence to back this up. Yet nobody seems to have been able to provide a more rational argument than this for supporting UKIP.

It is fuckwittery to accuse others of arrogance without being able to provide a logical, informed, intelligent argument to explain why they are wrong.

With an arrogant attitude like that ( & it is pure arrogance ) you can't be surprised when right wing parties rise up & bite you on the arse.

Maybe, maybe not, but if you want people to stop taking the piss, you do have to start looking a little bit intelligent at some point.

Absolutely, Merrymouse. Upthread I asked someone who was claiming that British values and traditions were being destroyed how she accounted for things like the preponderance of St George's flags to be seen yesterday, St George's Day, and numerous other very British traditions and institutions that are clearly flourishing, and received no response whatsoever. On another thread, daffsandtulips refused to accept independent statistics on immigration and continued to proclaim that the vast majority of asylum seekers come to England (not even the UK!) but steadfastly refused to say what her source of information was.

If intending UKIP voters would stop closing their eyes to inconvenient facts and deal with them, I might have more respect for their decision. But when it comes to saying "I'm voting UKIP because Nigel and the Daily Mail tell me I should be terrified about immigration although I don't have any evidence to demonstrate that" then how can they claim any credibility?

Mrs D I'm sorry but I love you a little bit. I know that's weird and stalky but had to be said. You make some fine points.

That's how I felt yesterday Whatthefuck. Some saddo lovely person said I was being OTT but the thing is, MrsD says what I am thinking but manages to convey it about 1000x better than I can.

If it makes you feel better calling me a fuckwit then fine, I'm really not bothered. But at least I'm not falling in love with people just because they post something I agree with.

I'm not calling you a fuckwit.

I'm calling people who vote for UKIP fuckwits.

My opinion is that people who vote UKIP are fuckwits.

And, as this thread has taught me, if I have an opinion then it's exactly the same thing as a fact.

I am slightly baffled at who wants to vote UKIP after Suzanne Evans said that the party doesn't appeal to the 'educated'. It's as if your own party is calling its voters ill-informed.

So why do you not engage with debate about other topics? What else do UKIP offer other than leaving the EU and protecting a vague indefinable notion of Englishness (and I deliberately mean England not Britain)?

You can. We live in a democracy? Are you ashamed of how you want to vote?

For the record I wouldn't

If it makes you feel better calling me a fuckwit then fine, I'm really not bothered. But at least I'm not falling in love with people just because they post something I agree with.

Again, this kind of post will do nothing to persuade anybody that UKIP's policies aren't fuckwittery - you are just bickering.

People don't all hold entrenched views, opinions can be changed. However, you have to do that by intelligent argument. If you just whine that people think you are stupid, they will indeed think you are stupid.

The people being called racists are the ones who want to remove our race relations laws and get rid of foreigners, (well, the racists!)