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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

To have excluded this friend from our travel plans?

142 replies

HourOrTwo · 21/04/2015 16:23

I'm going on a tiger-spotting safari holiday for 3 weeks with a close friend. Our other close friend just found out and is very upset we didn't invite her. For many years the 3 of us talked about going on a tiger safari together, but it was more a pipe-dream.

Reason we didn't invite her is she's been very unreliable the last couple of years. She often says she'll visit for weekend, arranges dates etc then at last minute says she can't afford it and backs out. She's always been hard up and for years I helped her out with money, e.g. paying for her train tickets, giving her money towards group trips, paying her share of meals out etc. I didn't mind back then as she was a student and i was working, but for the last 2 years she's had a full-time job. Nearly every time she's been due to visit, she phoned me the day before and said she couldn't afford the train fare, or she wanted to come but wouldn't have any money for taxi or going out. The first time I said come anyway, I sent her money for train, paid for everything etc. Second time I didn't offer to pay, she didn't ask, she said she couldn't come.

We've been friends since we were 8 years old, she's more like a sister than a friend, but I got fed-up of feeling used. A couple of times she'd claimed she had no money, she'd then go clothes shopping in front of me, or tell me about something she'd recently bought! Since I stopped offering to pay for her, she has stopped visiting altogether. I can't go to her as she lives in a shared house and I'd have to get a B+B, which is too much hassle and expense. I miss her and we talk on the phone often, and if she paid for herself at least sometimes I wouldn't mind helping her with travel costs at other times.

Anyway, she is furious and very hurt we are going on this holiday without her. I feel awful but its booked now. I pointed out she always says she can't afford train fares or meals out, so how would she have afforded this, but she says she would have saved up. AIBU?

OP posts:

HumphreyCobbler · 22/04/2015 14:24

"If you are giving it, most people will take it. Money, time, material goods etc".

I entirely disagree with this. Decent people do not take advantage of their friends.

OP YANBU

Original poster

HourOrTwo · 22/04/2015 16:00

'You made a rod for your own back by throwing money her way to save yourself the inconvenience of visiting her'

Giving her money for train tickets seemed like the only way I would be able to see her. I would have been more than happy to pay for her train fare every other visit, since I wasn't travelling to her. I would still be happy to do this, but she took advantage by playing the 'I can't afford it' card every time she was due to visit. I was also happy to pay for the odd meal out etc but not EVERY time we went out. Bear in mind each visit I was also paying for several days worth of groceries and stocked up on her favourite foods etc (which I would do for any guest). When I was on a student budget this all added up. I don't agree the host should be expected to pay for all the guest's excursions, travel costs, meals and drinks out etc, as 'compensation' for not returning the visits.
I explained to her I wasn't comfortable sleeping in her shared living-room, sharing a bathroom with 8 people, and that I couldn't afford an extra £150 for a few nights in a B+B (this was cheapest in area, I did research it). She said she'd just come to me instead. At no point did she complain about travelling, or say she was upset I didn't visit her. If she'd had her own place we would have taken turns, but if one person can't offer the other a bed for the night, many people won't visit. Personally I hate sleeping on the floor, in a room where strangers walk in and out.
I also suggested we meet half-way sometimes, in a city that was easy for both of us to get to, and split the cost of a B+B. She always said she wouldn't be able to afford the B+B cost so this never came off.

  'How about the op said "look, I can't afford to keep paying for you" How about the op taking responsibility for herself? She has not. Just blamed friend for constantly taking what is offered'

I do take responsibility and accept I allowed her to sponge off me for years. Looking back, I let her get into a pattern of not paying for herself. But I do think most people would not continually put friends in a position where they either pay up or have to cancel plans. Most people would save up to visit friends, or not commit to a date if they couldn't afford the trip. I always hoped she would grow out of it and start paying for herself once she got a job, but she still tries to manipulate me into paying her share of things, and she still puts me (and others) in an awkward position when we go out.

I'm generous with money, I don't mind paying if someone genuinely can't afford something, and I like treating friends to a meal or drinks sometimes. Most of my friends are like this and help each other out, take turns paying etc, and no-one quibbles over how much a coffee cost or whether someone owes them 20p. Most return the favour, but when one person just takes and takes, it starts to erode the friendship and makes you question their motives for being friends.

OP posts:

Aeroflotgirl · 22/04/2015 16:06

I agree op, you have been more than reasonable, I personally would not like to sleep in a place where tgere are strangers going in and out. You even suggested a middle ground, which she did not take. These do goodnes I am sure woukd not accept such behaviour from 'friends'. It does change your view of them, that is why op chose not to reveal plans to this user friend. She knew that she would behave in a similar way, what is the point.

DinosaursRoar · 22/04/2015 16:36

thing is, even if your friend could find the money for the flights and hotel, would you actually want to go on holiday with her? You said you'd worry about her not having spending money, would you feel you couldn't suggest expensive trips or restaurants, or be on edge when it was her turn to go to the bar etc? Plus if you don't really see each other anymore, are you that close anymore? going on holiday with someone you used to be close to is not the same as going away with someone you are currently close to. It's hard to spend that much time in the company of someone you don't spend much time with normally.

It is a shame she's having to face up to the fact that she'll probably never go on that 'dream holiday' - because you've made it a reality so it's not going to be a dream anymore for the rest of you.

She's upset with you anyway, so I think you're at the 'nothing to lose' stage - tell her that you feel that she always says she has no money and does she realise that most times you see her, she needs others to pay her share? That you had noticed, and didn't want to go on holiday with someone who consistantly can't pay their way, and just assumed that if you'd asked her to go, she'd have said yes, then not been able to pay when the time came, leaving you in a tricky position, and that she has form of doing that, so she can't be surprised you feel that way about her.

She'll probably bluster and be upset, probably angry, but hopefully the message will sink in that you've realised she's a bit of a user. Either she'll make an effort to stop when she sees you, or she'll drop you.

IhavenevermetAnthonyHead · 22/04/2015 16:47

I TOTALLY TOTALLY agree with what PanGalatic said. It's the reason we a extremely reluctant to agree to go on holiday with anyone but ourselves.

Tell your friend that she is willing to come along if she wants to book it independently, sort her own room out etc and meet up with you there (I assume you and your other friend are sharing) but that you have a pre-arranged itinerary and it absolutely cannot and will not be messed with to suit different needs and budgets and that you will not be able to lend her any money, subsidise her, or make any amendments to YOUR plans on YOUR dream holiday to suit her. And that includes things like where you will eat and whether you will get a taxi versus the train etc.

If she is willing to accept this and can afford to go where you want, or is prepared to spend chunks of time alone doing her own thing if you want to go off and do something she can't afford then she is welcome to come along.

CruCru · 22/04/2015 16:56

Realistically, you knew if you included this person, the holiday wouldn't happen. It sounds as though you aren't really friends any more but haven't realised it yet. YANBU.

rookiemere · 22/04/2015 17:56

Thanks for coming back to update OP. With your update I can understand a lot more why you didn't want to invite the friend.

I think at this point you need to be really honest with her. Email her what you have booked and apologise for not including her in it, tell her she is welcome to come provided she funds herself, but that you can't afford to subsidise her trip in any way and that was why she wasn't included in the initial invite.

The friendship sounds over to me. She has a lot of growing up to do and perhaps in a few years she may have done this and come back to you, but for now the friendship doesn't appear to be working for either of you.

I used to have a lot of fun friends where I had to initiate the meet ups and they were a bit flakey but loads of fun when we did get together, as I have got older and free time is at a priority I started to cut back on these, so I'm down to a core of genuine friends where we respect each other and have similar views on sharing for costs of things. I'm actually a lot happier for it.

Aeroflotgirl · 22/04/2015 17:57

I agreed Rookie, that is where I am at, the moment.

EvilTendency1 · 22/04/2015 18:15

I agree it could have been handled with a bit more sensitivity. However after reading your update - I think the friendship has run it's course, of course she's upset, she's missed out an a fantastic holiday she can try and get for free with a few tears and pleading !

She's a user, bin the friendship.

Iflyaway · 22/04/2015 19:30

Imperial - no tigers in Africa....

I am having this problem at the moment with someone who keeps expecting me to bail them out.

It is so exhausting

Times change, and so do friendships. I did all I could but sometimes you give a hand and they want to take your arm.

I know I am a soft spot, so I can thank them really for showing me my boundaries....

CatSwag · 22/04/2015 20:41

sounds like you couldn't be arsed to visit her
you could have slept in her bed
yet you threw money at the situation
and created this monster

yabu

Aeroflotgirl · 22/04/2015 20:51

catswag did you not read the op and her subsequent posts! Op offered to meet half way between where they lived and share a b&b but friend did not want to. No op did not create this, friend is an adult who should take responsibility. Friend seemed quite happy to visit op if op was paying, once she stopped, then the visits stopped. If she was unahappy, she could have talked to op.

BMW6 · 22/04/2015 21:01

YANBU OP - your friend has been taking the piss for years and I have NO doubt that she would do the same on a holiday. Tell her straight.

CatSwag · 22/04/2015 22:01

aero, i hav read the entire thread, I do think op is equally responsible for creating this situation
as formeeting up half way and both staying in a b and b, what an odd suggestion imo
op could have asked to have her friends bed
they both haven't talk about things that are bothering them

Aeroflotgirl · 22/04/2015 22:05

Why is it odd cat to meet half way and share a B&B, sounds pretty sensible to me. Friend was quite happy to share a B&B for this wedding tip providing op paid.

TheOneWiththeNicestSmile · 22/04/2015 22:32

op could have asked to have her friends bed

asked for it? friend should have offered it! (esp given earlier favours she'd received). clearly she didn't or OP wouldn't have been even thinking about a B&B. Favours obv all one-way in this friendship

jacks11 · 24/04/2015 00:00

you are both unreasonable and reasonable, IMHO.

You say you are very close- doesn't sound like you are close at all. You don't speak about her in a way that suggests you even like her. I would suggest your friendship has run it's course. She hasn't behaved all that well, and I can see why you are annoyed. It is not unreasonable to feel a friendship has come to an end.

However, this was a holiday you all discussed- a shared dream. As far as she knew, you were stilll good friends. Rather than act like an adult and tell her what you were planning- and if you didn't want her to come (not unreasonable), then explaining why- you deliberately tried to hide it from her. How did you seriously think she would never find out about it? What you did was really mean, and quite childish.

You should have had the courage of your convictions and told your "friend" of your plans. She would have been hurt, quite probably angry- but I imagine she's feeling much worse now.

In summary, you were not unreasonable to decide not to invite your friend/ex-friend given the history/previous behaviour. I think you behaved incredibly nastily in the way you went about excluding your "friend" and trying to hide it from her. You should have let the friendship slide, or had THE TALK about how you feel your friendship has been going badly. You chose the cowardly third way of sneaking around trying to hide things from a person you describe as "a close friend".

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