my apologies. .I genuinely would like to talk about body image and contradictions on mumsnet

[sorenoggin]

Seems my last post was misunderstood so am trying again.

Why is it okay on mums net and in real life for people to make jokes and disparaging remarks about men with small penises?

We would never condone a man slating or laughing at a woman's genitals on here so why is it okay the other way round?

Read this for the reality of what it is like for a man with a smaller penis and the huge emotional impact it has on his life

ughsocialjustice.com/post/107849865308/small-dicks-are-part-of-body-positivity
I Guess I just want to remind everyone that every time you laugh or joke about 'ignore him, he probably got a small dick ' you are adding to the pain of probably someone you know :(

I had forgotten what my username was! Probably not the best one for this thread! It was not deliberate!

I'm not blaming anyone but feel this article is relevant in highlighting the attitude discussed in this thread.

gu.com/p/46t8y

I believe it's called 'ironic sexism' or something like that but ultimately men are supposed to take it all in good humour. Jessica Valenti is well known for wearing a t-shirt with 'I bathe in male tears' as a joke.

I still don't know how I feel about it. Men have caused so many problems that 'ironic sexism' kind of pales into the background but I don't know how I feel having to take it all on the chin.

It would be nice to think that maybe after reading this thread that maybe if next time you or one of your friends hears the phrase 'oh ignore him..He probably got a small dick'..you just have a think about all the lovely men there are in the world who are suffering cos of this stupid phrase.

I haven't read the whole thread, but I remember a particular thread on here about 'reasons why you dumped an ex'. There were loads of disparaging posts about small penises. It would have been unacceptable for men to come on say similar things about women, but for some reason this is seen as just a laugh.

Regarding using cunt as an insult, I dream of a day when sex is no longer so taboo thst virtually all expressions of annoyance make reference to it in a negative fashion!
It's so ingrained, cunt, dick, bollocks, arse, all of them inspired by a deeply seated historical belief that anything related to sex is negative.
I agree that objectification is a much bigger issue for women, but that doesn't mean that it isn't an issue for men, one does not negate the other.
I disagree with the assertion that talking about dick size in either a positive or negative fashion is a purely patriarchal thing. I have on many occasions been in conversation with women talking about men with reference to penis size, some saying they "need" a large one,( normally referring only to the penis and not the person), and some talking about small ones, (normally referring to the person).
in the former instance I do tend to make jokes about pelvic floor exercises, in the latter I point out that penis size isn't related to personality!
It isn't acceptable to judge a person on their physical appearance, wether to objectify or denigrate.

Hakluyt you just made me laugh out loud!

DH often says "he's probably got a small dick" if he sees a man acting aggressively, is it ok when he says it?

Of course not. We need to get rid of double standards altogether.

"I disagree with the assertion that talking about dick size in either a positive or negative fashion is a purely patriarchal thing. I have on many occasions been in conversation with women talking about men with reference to penis size, some saying they "need" a large one,( normally referring only to the penis and not the person), and some talking about small ones, (normally referring to the person)"

Are you saying that because women have said it it is not a patriarchal thing? If so, then you are misunderstanding. Our society's concept of masculinity, which puts emphasis on penis size is a patriarchal construct. Both men and women "buy into" the construct. That is why the patriarchy is damaging to both of omen and men.

Bathsheba No, still not ok.

It has just been on the news that suicide is the biggest cause of death for men under 50yrs and yet there seems to be a view that men are big, strong and insensitive and can cope with anything. They are all individuals.
I think it sad that people worry more about their DDs and negative comments than they do about their DSs. They should be of equal worry, depending on personality of the individual.

Yes, tragically, suicide has been the biggest cause of death among younger men for some time. Do you have any thoughts about why?

Because men don't talk about things, they bottle them up.
Men can't admit to being upset about jibes 'it is not manly' - the whole 'sticks and stones.....' rot - when words are very hurtful and impossible to banish from your mind.

That's certainly a factor. Men are also more likely to suffer psychologically when the economic situation is bad- their role as breadwinner and supporter of a family is threatened by the economic situation. All of these causes can be traced back to the patriarchal image of masculinity that damages both men and women.

I'm bound to say that the gender difference in suicide statistics is not as simple as first appears, though. Research shows that women actually makes significanly more suicide attempts than men do- men are, sadly, more likely to succeed. Mostly because of the methods they choose- they are likely to choose quicker and more effective methods than women, but also possibly because of social isolation- women are more likely to be found in time.

Women have it as a cry for help, men go past that and intend to succeed.
Men get mixed messages. You may get a lovely man who is a reception teacher in an inner city school, a great cook, knows how to clean toilets etc and yet it is 'Jack the Lad' who is a banker in the city, with a lifestyle to go with it, who claims he can't boil an egg and has never cleaned a toilet who will get all the women- even though they know he will let them down !

Girls get special help 'take your DD to work etc' -but I dare not mention on here that boys need special help in school- I would be cried down 'because it is just the same for girls' - when it isn't.

Where do you think the mixed messages come from?

And actually, many schools do provide extra help for boys, particularly in literacy, where there is a measurable gap in attainment.

I didn't mean extra help - I meant teaching in a way that suits them, as in more physical.
I have already explained that the mixed messages come from women who want more men in childcare etc but many of them wouldn't go out with the male reception teacher. (I know a male reception teacher who now has a lovely wife, but before he met her his job caused him problems- from women).

There isn't actually any evidence to support gender differences in learning styles- there's been plenty of research. But if there was, why would anyone object to children being taught in ways that suit them- subject to the usual constraints of funding and so on? Some schools certainly have experimented with separating boys and girls for some subjects.

I'm afraid I can't comment on women not wanting to go out with reception teachers and only wanting to go out with mega rich bankers. It's a recurring theme among MRA and nobody ever seems to be able to support it with anything but their own personal stories. All I can say is that it does not apply in my circle of friends and acquaintances. But we don't discuss the size of men's penises either........