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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

To ban DD from speaking to "racist child" who uses the N word.

731 replies

MaryNotPoppins · 09/04/2015 11:24

DD (6) came home a few months back saying another child in the class keeps on getting into trouble (thank god) because they keep on saying the N word. They also say The P word for Asians (forgive me for abbreviating them but they make me sick to even type).

I thought perhaps it was a one off after she first made me aware but other moms have also shared stories lately of how horrified they have been after having this child over for playdates regarding their racist language. There wont be any ethnic children present for example and this child will still say "you are an N word" if they are playing if she doesn't get what she want's etc.

I have considered that perhaps it's just ignorance since she has called other white children this name however it has been widely confirmed by teachers and parents (not in a petty hearsay way) that 99% of the time this language is directed towards the ethnic children.

I try to judge for myself but I've never had her over and have never ever seen her parents, she gets dropped off by a child minder who drops off about 7 kids in her class as they all live locally.

Now -

The parents of these poor children at the end of racist abuse have told me some of the things this child has said and it's horrid. Disgusting. She tells black kids to swim back to Africa and eat only bananas for lunch and wont stop telling this poor Indian girl she stinks.

The fact that it's been going on for so long after multiple warnings from the school means it's obviously something embedded in this child from home.

I hate the notion of judging kids absolutely hate it....but this one sounds like a bad egg! I know no child is born racist or perhaps genuinely racist and that it comes from home but where so we draw the line?

My DD speaks to everyone and even if someone has previously been in trouble always gives everyone a chance....but I wan't her to keep her distance from this kid. Its a class of 20 and everyone is friends there arent friendship groups....I don't want her around this vile language or behavior.

I'm not an unrealistic smothering mother I know they have to grow up but 6 is too young to be listening to this rubbish. I hate the cringey idea of telling my DD to stay away from another persons DC it seems so high handed but I don't want her around it. I've told her to always stand up for someone who is being picked on (they are 6 so obviously "That's not nice" will suffice ) and always to tell the teacher....

AIBU to say stay away from this kid but if they ever want to be nice again then fair enough? I don't like the idea of this type of conversation with DD it's very heavy but what else can i do?

OP posts:
sparkysparkysparky · 09/04/2015 19:08

awadebumbo, I would question your analysis.I don't think any of the posters are in favour of indulging this child's racist diatribes,as you seem to suggest.

Awadebumbo · 09/04/2015 19:14

No Sparky but what some posters seem to be doing is minimising this girls behaviour and excusing it. Do you really think the black child she's abusing cares about this child's home life? Or so you think that they just want it to stop.

sparkysparkysparky · 09/04/2015 19:16

I am firmly in the "exclude this child now " school of thought and have said so repeatedly in my posts. The school should have zero tolerance.

ItsAllKickingOffPru · 09/04/2015 19:23

No one is minimising or excusing. Some are trying to explain why immediately and permanently excluding a child with behavioural problems isn't happening.

Awadebumbo · 09/04/2015 19:38

But you are one of the few Sparky some of posters on here have spoken about the child's home life than the effect her behaviour has on other children. These children have to deal with this on a daily basis, how do you think their parents feel having to explain to their children why this is happening.
I remember when my mum had to have the talk with me and when I had to have that talk with my own child. It's not an easy conversation to have. I have seen minimal support for the OP on this issue and some posters have been quite ready to dismiss the OPs concerns by intimating that they don't believe her and questioning her about school holiday clubs

KatieKaye · 09/04/2015 19:42

I have read so many posts on here about bullying - physical bullying that results in injuries - and although the school has policies and procedures and the bullying is reported, nothing seems to be done to help the victim. So I take little comfort from the fact the head will be going through procedures.

I'm also a little sceptical about tackling these specific behaviour problems from one child by reminding the entire school not to use racist language while at the same time the pupils are well aware that the one child who does use racist language is not being treated in the same way as they would be. Children can spot unfairness a mile off and this approach coul actually serve to undermine the schools stance..

While there may indeed be issues at home that mean it is inappropriate to exclude, it is the message that the combination of the "warning" to pupils who do not use racist language and the fact the child continues to use this language without any visible action being taken strongly suggests the school does not know how to deal with the issue. And whether or not this is true that could undermine their credibility to deal effectively with issues in the eyes of pupils and parents.

ragged · 09/04/2015 19:42

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Hakluyt · 09/04/2015 19:44

I don't think a 6 year old should be excluded for racist language- particulately if she is going to be then spending even more time with whoever she is copying. But I do think that the OP has a right to know that there is a clear course of action in place to protect her child and others from the racist language. And if I was the OP I would certainly be telling my child to avoid her at school.

JulyKit · 09/04/2015 19:49

MaryNotPoppins - I haven't had time to read all of this thread - so I apologise if you've already explained this, but I'm interested to know: why do you think it is that this child hasn't already directed her racist abuse at your own DC?

fanjoforthemammaries7850 · 09/04/2015 19:53

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TenerifeSea · 09/04/2015 20:02

I think calling a 6 year old an "abuser" is unhelpful, they are very young at that age and don't have the cognitive ability to be vindictive in the same way that a 16 year old would. It doesn't make the behaviour acceptable though. Working out what underlies the behaviour is key for everyone involved because it enables everyone to move forward.

JulyKit · 09/04/2015 20:05

Also, MaryNotPoppins, since this little girl wishes to play with you DC - and so, presumably, likes and respects your DC, has it not occurred to you and/or your DC to explain your own ethnic heritage to the 6 year old who keeps abusing children that she perceives as 'different' or unacceptable because they don't share her ethnic background?

It seems slightly odd to me that you think to 'challenge' this child's racist behaviour with wishy-washy 'tellings off' such as 'that's not nice'. Racist abuse is a hell of a lot worse that just 'not nice'.

areyoubeingserviced · 09/04/2015 20:07

I am astounded by the number of posters who are still going on about the needs of this child.
If I was the parent of a black or Asian child I would be pissed of with posters who believe that this child (or other children who exhibit this type of behaviour )should not be excluded from school.
It makes me realise that many people underestimate the impact of racism on the lives of the victims
How very sad

Awadebumbo · 09/04/2015 20:10

Absolutely are you beingserved

JulyKit · 09/04/2015 20:12

I agree, Tenerfie, and if your post was in response to mine, then apologies if my post looked as if I was referring to the kid as an 'abuser'. Like other sensible posters on here, I don't think that that's what she is. (She's 6 years old, FFS!)

I'm just interested to know about OP and her DC's response to this kids behaviour so far.

Personally, I'd be inclined to invite the poor kid round for tea. Let her find out that, contrary to whatever shit she's been fed by family or whoever, she can be friends with children who have ethnic heritages different to her own.

That's what most people I know would do.

I can only really imagine the hand-wringing 'it's not nice attitude coming from someone with little experience of diversity, and also little experience of damaging racism is.

sparkysparkysparky · 09/04/2015 20:15

This,in an older child, would be criminal behaviour. Tackle it as such outside of school and exclude the child while doing so.

Awadebumbo · 09/04/2015 20:18

Do you think it matters to the Black and Asian children how old she is in their eyes she is their abuser. A lot of posters seen to be talking about how this child's home life has an effect on her. Does no one think that by allowing this child to continue to racially abuse other children and concentrating on her needs rather the needs of the victims also leaves a lasting effect on the children it.

JulyKit · 09/04/2015 20:24

Awadebumbo - I don't think anyone on this thread has argued that the child's behaviour should go unchallenged (unless you regard excluding the child as failing to challenge her behaviour - and actually, I think that excluding her would be just that).

What posters like Feenie have (I think) rightly said is that 'excluding' or ostracizing this child wouldn't be useful. It wouldn't change her behaviour.

sparkysparkysparky · 09/04/2015 20:27

Personally, I think the priority should be getting this child away from the children she is abusing. Her home life may well be very sad but that is for social services to deal with away from school. She is incapable of functioning in a standard classroom and should be removed from it.

Aridane · 09/04/2015 20:38

Add message | Report | Message poster sparkysparkysparky Thu 09-Apr-15 20:15:50
This,in an older child, would be criminal behaviour. Tackle it as such outside of school and exclude the child while doing so.

Er, how? Child is under age of criminal responsibility.

LaLyra · 09/04/2015 20:39

I don't see how anyone can really form an opinion on what the school should be doing without more detail on the timescale.

If it's been going on for 6/9 months then it's gone on way too long and the school need to be pushed or it's time for the parents to go beyond the school to OFSTED or social services.

If it's 2 months then the measures the school have already taken show a strong stance by them and they are moving through the sanctions.

Excluding a child does nothing, but move the problem to another school, different children and more pissed off parents, which is why the school, and any other agency involved, will be going through their procedure.

TenerifeSea · 09/04/2015 20:41

Of course her age matters. Confused Some of you are looking at this through an adult's eyes.

I'm not defending the awful behaviour, I am explaining that this child's brain has not fully developed yet and you cannot deal with a child's behaviour in the same way that you would an adult's.

sparkysparkysparky · 09/04/2015 20:44

Tackle it the same way you would tackle abusive behaviour exhibited by children below the age of criminal responsibility. Donâ??t leave victims to endure it. Take the damaged child out of the environment that allows them to abuse as a starting point. They need love and support but not at their victims' expense.

JulyKit · 09/04/2015 20:49

MaryNotPoppins, I'm curious, also, about the sorts of conversations you've had with your DD about the little girl who uses racist language.
Does your DD perceive that the language is directed at her?

areyoubeingserviced · 09/04/2015 20:49

I am looking at it through the eyes of black or Asian child who goes to school and is subjected to racist abuse from another child
I wouldn't care about the background of the child who was abusing me. I would just want the adults to make the abuse stop.