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AIBU?

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Original poster

AIBU to find it disgusting that gypsies have taken over a school playground

808 replies

Adizzylass2014 · 04/04/2015 22:17

whilst attending my best friends wedding today in a little village I was horrified to see that gypsies had taken over the school playground. There was rubbish all over the floor, children and dogs running all over the place and scantily clad women puffing away.
why a school playground, these people have no morals. The poor caretaker is going to have his work cut out for him as there was at least 15 caravans! Angry

OP posts:
WindYourBobbinUp · 05/04/2015 17:02

It comes from gadjo (man) and gadji (woman) its really not the same as pikey at all. I'm sorry again if people have used it to you in an aggressive way. Its not something I've done or heard of myself, we just use it to denote non Romany

SoupDreggon · 05/04/2015 17:05

Thank you, Soup. You confirm my point very well
The very fact that people decide to take to the road, or move into a travellers' camp, does not give them a protected ethnicity nor allow them to hide under a claim of 'racism'.

I haven't proved your point at all. You clearly do not understand ethnicity.

expatinscotland · 05/04/2015 17:08

'Nationality is not the same as ethnicity though.'

Okay, well, by that token, every ethnicity has a right for the council to provide them with a place to be housed together. Other ethnicities can and do chose to live in communities together, by buying or renting accommodation in an area, in line with market forces. They do not expect the council to provide a designated spot for that. That could be seen as unfair at the least. 'I'm Latina, I need a space to live with other Latinas all together to preserve our culture and heritage, since I am not provided with one by the council, a bunch of us will just live wherever we see fit. You are supposed to provide us with a place to live all together.' That sounds Hmm if you substitute any other ethnicity or race name in for the 'traveller' part.

SoupDreggon · 05/04/2015 17:10

Travellers are asking for somewhere to live, not somewhere to live altogether. It isn't the same as your example at all.

NotallTravellersarebad · 05/04/2015 17:11

I agree with windthebobbin. It's not an insult, in any way.

JanineStHubbins · 05/04/2015 17:12

This is such a horrible thread.

FromSeaToShining · 05/04/2015 17:13

Actually, some people in the Roma community do object to the word "gypsy." I try to avoid the word for that reason.

Sexyhouseslippers · 05/04/2015 17:13

Well you wouldn't see it as an insult as you're a traveller.

Christinayangstwistedsister · 05/04/2015 17:14

These are probably stupid questions, but I am genuinely interested

Have traveler groups identified suitable sites and contacted LAs if so, what were the reason they were turned down?

SoupDreggon · 05/04/2015 17:14

I'm not entirely sure how you leapt on my comment about ethnicity to make some rant about wanting a place to live though. I was trying to point out to Sally why just living in a caravan didn't change your ethnic group to that of Traveller or Gypsy. I wasn't making any kind of comment about what they should get.

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 05/04/2015 17:15

Why do they need a specific site for travellers? Why can they/do they not use sites for camping and caravanning then?

"Standard" camp sites often have a very short maximum stay.
A group of travellers would probably be turned away, and they may wish to travel with others in their community.
Travellers may often tow with, or be in convoy with commercial vehicles as many are self-employed. Commercial vehicles often not allowed.

expatinscotland · 05/04/2015 17:16

'Travellers are asking for somewhere to live, not somewhere to live altogether. It isn't the same as your example at all.'

Then, genuine question, why do they not use camping and caravanning sites? These are available for booking and you don't have to state your ethnicity. It's possible to move from site to site in such a matter, people do it all the time.

Why does it have to be council-provided and funded?

SmillasSenseOfSnow · 05/04/2015 17:16

If you're offended by Roma using the word 'gorger' (or however it's spelled), are you also offended by Jews using the word 'gentile'? Or would you be skirting too close to anti-semitism by assuming it was an insult?

Viviennemary · 05/04/2015 17:17

The trouble is I think that this country is not really conducive to the travellers way of life. That is all land is owned by somebody, either the local council or school or whatever. I read an interesting book years ago about the Nomad tribes in the Sahara desert. Who pitched up camp for a few days and then journeyed on. but they weren't camping on anybody's local village green or school playground. Don't know what the answer is though.

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 05/04/2015 17:18

Have traveler groups identified suitable sites and contacted LAs if so, what were the reason they were turned down?

Yes suitable sites have been identified. They are often turned down as nobody likes travellers.

expatinscotland · 05/04/2015 17:19

'I'm not entirely sure how you leapt on my comment about ethnicity to make some rant about wanting a place to live though.'

It's not about wanting a place to live, though. It's about wanting a place to live on one's own terms. In the rest of the world, that means you have to provide that for yourself, you do not expect the government to provide it on your terms.

But continue to label that a rant and get your arse out of kilter about it.

No skin of mine.

Christinayangstwistedsister · 05/04/2015 17:20

Itsall

Ah right, " not on my doorstep "

SmillasSenseOfSnow · 05/04/2015 17:20

Upon discovering that my grandad was ethnically Roma, hence my dark/Roma-like facial features, my first boyfriend thought it would a good idea to refer to me as a 'mongrel'. So tell me again how the ancestral Roma in the UK are no longer liable to suffer racism?

SoupDreggon · 05/04/2015 17:21

are you also offended by Jews using the word 'gentile'?

It makes me feel uncomfortable in the same "them and us" way just as any word that meant "everyone who is not the same as us" would.

However, I suspect that, as a white person, I am not entitled to feel uncomfortable at anything so will go away.

malefridgeblindness · 05/04/2015 17:23

The travellers wgo appled for planning permissionnear us for a small site had a residents group set up to oppose it which was promoted by the local councillors and the headteacher of the village school sent details to parents in a thinly veiled request that we might be interested in opposing the development.

It disgusted me that so many of my friends and neighbours felt no guilt at opposing a small settlement in a fairly isolated place but were fine with new houses being built in the village for settled folk. Gypsy and traveller children have worse health, poorer educational outcomes and are more likely to receive harsher sentences from the criminal justice system than settled ones. They're more likely to be bullied at school. And they have to contend with a settled community which opposes planned sites and protests against illegal ones.

Sure some travellers leave places in a mess - people in similar socioeconomic circumstances in settled communities also leave things in a tip and get into trouble with the law. I hate the mn Traveller-loathing threads and wish people would indulge their UKIP tendencies in a way that was less damaging to community relations.

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 05/04/2015 17:25

It's not about wanting a place to live, though. It's about wanting a place to live on one's own terms. In the rest of the world, that means you have to provide that for yourself, you do not expect the government to provide it on your terms.

That is like saying that Australians have no responsibility for the Aboriginals. The Gypsies/Travellers had a perfectly viable life. There rights and their way of living are being eroded by us. Its not necessarily about taxpayers providing sites for them - its about the fact that all land now belongs to somebody so they have nowhere they can legitimately go. Many travellers have been left homeless due to cuts in available sites.

Ubik1 · 05/04/2015 17:25

I don't think you can generalise. I'm in close proximity to several purpose- built traveler sites and there is no more trouble there than there is in the wider area.

But it's ridiculous to deny that there are groups of travellers who behave really, really badly. They are antisocial in the extreme. It's too easy to dismiss people's concerns as 'racism' - the problems are very real and show a complete lack of consideration for their neighbours.

It's also a hard life. Traveller life expectancy particularly fir young men is shockingly low. Infant mortality rates are much higher than in settled populations. The culture can be very hard on young women - lack of education, married young etc

I guess the answer is more designated sites for travellers but the nimby population will fight that tooth and nail.

NotallTravellersarebad · 05/04/2015 17:29

Roma, at least under my council are recognised under the same umbrella as Romany Gypsies and Irish Traveller. Many are under achieving in school, even the settled (housed) ones for a multitude of differing reasons. As are many gorger children.
In answer to the question about using campsites, this is unlikely. negative stereotypes put the owner on guard and refuse. Furthermore, a group of three or more caravans usually attract attention of the police, who will then want to know where are going, where have you been? It's degrading actually.

madreloco · 05/04/2015 17:30

" Shit" happens "because" Gyspsies and Travellers know they are seen as a lowly race, and the mess they leave is a "fingers up arseholes"

Ah come off it. Can't explain it all away that easily. Sure some of it is prejudice. Some of it is totally deserved because of proven, widescale, common behaviour.

expatinscotland · 05/04/2015 17:30

'That is like saying that Australians have no responsibility for the Aboriginals.'

Not at all. White people invaded and displaced the indigenous people in that case. Not just eroding their way of life but actually taking over their entire country. This country's indigenous people have had a number of assimilators over the centuries.

Lots of ways of life have died out and continue to do so across the land, or have been assimilated into other ones in all sorts of ways.

Even whole religions, cultures.