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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To "encourage" her to end the pregnancy

143 replies

wemadeit25 · 03/04/2015 23:32

my daughter is 20 and in a relationship with a young man of 21, 3 days ago they found out she was pregnant and he is adamant that he does not want to be a Dad. My daughter is so mixed up understandably as to her next step, she does not want to be a single mum and is thinking he may come round but scared about what will happen if he doesnt. She has asked me what I would do and I have said I will need to think about that one as I dont want to say the wrong thing. I really think she should end the pregnancy as it is unfair to force a person to be a daddy just as it is unfair to force a person to end a pregnancy, but AIBU telling her that I would end it, will I end up the villain here. She will not cope with a baby without her boyfriend as they clearly love each other, part of me thinks it is brave of him to be honest but part of me is fucking fuming that he wont stand by her, I have no idea what to advise her, and keep saying only she can make the decision but she keeps saying my head is saying do it but my heart is saying no, someone please help me to help her.

OP posts:
museumum · 04/04/2015 07:22

I don't think that telling her that if it was you you'd probably not continue with the pregnancy is "encouraging her" to end it. It's just being honest. I think you can tell her that. It must be tough to be asking that question and just getting "only you can decide" back, even though that is the truth.

wowfudge · 04/04/2015 07:27

There is some great advice here. When I was younger my DM made it clear that if I was pregnant and not sure what to do she was there for me and would support me in whatever decision I made.

Can I just make a point: we do not know that the couple made a decision to have unprotected sex. Those people stating this, often to say harsh things about the boyfriend, we do not know whether it was a failure of contraception or unprotected sex.

catontherun · 04/04/2015 07:49

some quite emotive posts on here.

I do think that it's naïve to say that if her heart is telling her to keep the baby then that is what she really wants to do.

We're women, genetically programmed to be mothers and care for babies as part of our role as humans. I'd have had twice as many babies if my heart had ruled my head. No-one wants to have a termination.

If it were me I'd support any decision she made but I would also inform my daughter of what I would do in her shoes so no I don't think you'd be unreasonable to do just that (and I would have chosen an abortion if I'd found myself in her situation at 20).

Her boyfriend is adamant he does not want to be a dad so it is naïve again to advise her/hope that me may come round to the idea.

Yes, he should have worn a condom but he didn't and she didn't insist he did, both should take some responsibility here.

What else does she have going on in her life, is she working/at University ?

SloanePeterson · 04/04/2015 07:50

Op, I was in your dd's position when I was 20. My parents made it very clear I should have an abortion, they even made a huge deal about taking out a loan to pay for me to have it done privately. They told me I was wicked to continue my pregnancy. Our relationship has never really recovered Sad. These are the same parents who had always told me I could go to them with anything and they'd support me. To find out that that simply wasn't true made an already difficult exprience even worse. I continued with my pregnancy, but completely alone, I was at uni far away from family and from the father. It was hell and I'm actually appaled that my parents behaved in the way they did. It was difficult, but I carried on at uni, got a good degree and my dd was the making of me really. I do sometimes wonder what would have happened had I gone along with what they wanted and had an abortion. It wouldn't have been good. Your job as her parent is to listen, and be there for her. By all means offer an opinion I suppose, but you just need to support her. I'm very pro choice fwiw, I had a termination many years after I had my dd and that was a completely different situation and definately the right choice, and a simple choice. There was no big dilemma or massive guilt afterwards.

StaceyAndTracey · 04/04/2015 07:53

It doesn't really matter now whether it was sex with or without contraception . There's always a possibility that sex can result in pregnancy - most 12 year olds could tell you that

If they had sex without contraception , they ran a big risk of pregnancy . If they used contraception properly , then the risk was smaller . Its never zero ( unless one of you has been sterilised, which is unlikely at their age )

So what everyone has been saying about the Bfs views is correct - he knew when he chose to have sex that she could get pregnant. That's the point at which men in our culture get to choose . He knew that . The outcome for him is always far less serious than it is for the woman .

No one " forced him to be a father " unless he was forced to have sex .

teddybears · 04/04/2015 07:55

Some of the comments are a bit disturbing. Why does this young man get such criticism because he doesn't want to be a father. No one is saying 'she should have thought about that before she had unprotected sex'. Some people on mumsnet are downright anti man. Grow up.

Op, I would echo the comments of others, you have to let your dd make her own decision and ensure she knows she will be supported whatever that is.

StaceyAndTracey · 04/04/2015 08:01

You are arguing with biology here,not Mumsnet

PIV Sex can make babies . That's not anti male, that's factual .

mayfridaycomequickly · 04/04/2015 08:08

Instead of ranting about it can we help the op to structure the support she gives her daughter? Op - your daughter obviously trusts you a lot to confide in you - I know lots of young adults who wouldn't.

Does she live with you or her dp? I think that, although uultimately it's her decision the people closely involved should have an input to a point because they'll be affected too.

She needs to think about where her and the baby live if she goes ahead.

Does she want to be a sahm or will she be reliant on you / other family members? Childcare - can she afford it?

Does she want to stay local or did she have plans to travel / holiday etc? (I'm boring - never had the desire to teavel the world so I'd have been happy tied close to home - will she? )

Career plans - could she still fulfill them realistically? It's doable of course but may be difficult depending on the support network she has.

teddybears · 04/04/2015 08:09

But no one is saying op's dd must have the baby because she had sex Stacey.

VikingVolva · 04/04/2015 08:09

"Some of the comments are a bit disturbing. Why does this young man get such criticism because he doesn't want to be a father. No one is saying 'she should have thought about that before she had unprotected sex'."

I rather agree. These threads rarely consider what to me is the likeliest scenario - genuine contraceptive error (by one or both).

I don't think saying 'don't have sex unless you're ready to be a parent' has been tenable, even amongst very, very religious communities, for some decades now.

So yes, sexually active people should talk about what they'd do if contraception failed before it happens. Except of course, what you think you'd do and what you actually do when prospect becomes reality could be utterly unrelated.

Yoruba · 04/04/2015 08:10

I wanted to add my own experience as I think perhaps sometimes its nice to hear a positive story.
I had my DD at 19. Slightly different to your DD as my DH (then DP) was always very supportive. His parents however, were beyond horrendous. They accused me of doing it on purpose to "trick" him, his dad phoned abortion clinics to find out the process and how easy it would be to get an appointment! They tried to railroad me into it and if I wouldn't go along with it, then they wanted him to leave me.
My mum was reasonably supportive but allowed her own emotions to massively affect the advice she gave me and our general interaction. So it was evident she was upset and I couldnt really be completely honest.

I have never felt more alone. I ended up posting here, saying how terrified I was. Not just of the bigger issues but of how my body would change and how I would cope.

I had my DD. She is now 6 and we are married with 2 little DSs too. I am so glad I had her. I love my life and it could have taken a very different path if I had taken a different decision. No I didnt go to uni or have a career but had I wanted to I could have, that said, I would acknowledge that it will make that side of things much harder for her if that is something that is important for her.

Please dont let your own emotions or shock show, try to be as calm as possible even over the DPs lack of commitment to her. Rage and cry later on but be reasonable, supportive and completely unbiased to your dd. Don't encourage ANY path, just support her in her own decision. Good luck!

Starlightbright1 · 04/04/2015 08:10

I am with the others. Your loyalty is to your daughter right now.

I would be encouraging her to make HER decision based on he may stay on the same mindset.

I would do everything in my power not to influence her decision like has been said let her know you will support her whatever her decision. She is 20 so really old enough to make this decision herself.

kathryng90 · 04/04/2015 08:10

Have been in this position with my eldest dd. pregnant but a bit younger. Stable relationship just an accident with contraception.

I had to distance myself from the 'this is my grandchild' and offered what I hope was impartial words of wisdom. Lots of options open to her at this stage and we talked for hours about the what ifs. She had counselling from hospital. She looked at what could happen with and without her DP being in the picture.

She had a termination with pills at around 7 weeks. We occasionally mention it and she has no regrets which I am so thankful for. She has a wonderful job that she couldn't do as a sole parent and a new DP. Her life would have been very different and I believe not as happy. She was and still in just not ready for motherhood.

However if she had chosen to keep baby I would have supported her to the hills. And she knows that. It would just have made life different and I can't imagine her with a child!

Keep talking to her and try not to say 'if I were you'.

Original poster
wemadeit25 · 04/04/2015 08:15

Some great advice here, thanks. They did not have unprotected sex my daughter had food poisoning last month and did not realise that this would affect the effect of contraception. However, I have said to her that if she really wants to know what I would do then here it is. I would forget any idea of him "coming round" (he has made it perfectly clear that a baby doesn't fit into his plans and for this I cannot bring myself to look him in the eye without wanting to clock him one. A baby doesn't fit into anyone's plans at the moment but that doesn't mean that ending the pregnancy is the only option) I said that in her position I would terminate and the sooner the better, but I am not in her position so I told her that whatever she decides her Dad and I will be 100% behind her that will not mean having her and the baby living with us, but we will give her all the financial and emotional support she needs to make a life for herself if she does go ahead with the pregnancy and if she chooses to terminate we will be there emotionally for as long as she needs us. God I hope I have said the right thing, I suppose time will tell.x

OP posts:
EhricLovesTheBhrothers · 04/04/2015 08:22

Sounds like you offered some good, useful advice. Whatever you do don't encourage her to consider the fairness or otherwise on her boyfriend of ending the pregnancy. That's really the last line of thought she should be going down. Imagine if she ended the pregnancy to spare his feelings and they split up 2 years down the line - she could regret that forever.

Treaclepot · 04/04/2015 08:24

There is nothing wrong with a man saying he doesn't want a baby at 20. Just as there is nothing wrong with a woman saying she doesn't want a baby when she is 20.

There is nothing wrong with a man saying he wants to keep a baby and vows versa.

I feel for both men and women when they disagree. But ultimately it is obviously down to the person who is pregnant.

In your daughters case OP if she has the baby the father may well come around to the idea. I know a number of excellent fathers who didn't want unplanned pregnancies to continue but end up being supportive and loving fathers (my DH is one).

CatHammock · 04/04/2015 08:36

It sounds as though you've said the right thing - now it's just a case of following through and acting on that promise to support her in whatever choice she makes. I do think she'd be well served with talking to an independant counsellor such as Marie Stopes - they won't pressure her either way, but they'll help her work out what she wants to do.

If she's at uni, she'll be able to access support and counselling through them too - from what you've said, it sounds like she doesn't live with you?

EhricLovesTheBhrothers · 04/04/2015 08:39

Treacl, the man is 31!

ThedementedPenguin · 04/04/2015 08:45

Ehric he is only 21 if you read the original post!

FeijoaSundae · 04/04/2015 08:53

he has made it perfectly clear that a baby doesn't fit into his plans and for this I cannot bring myself to look him in the eye without wanting to clock him one.

Well, I am not normally one to stick up for the menz, but when I got pregnant at 24, I undoubtedly knew that a baby didn't fit into my plans, which was why I had an abortion.

It is not wrong of him to feel like this, just as it is not wrong for a women to feel like it either. He does not get to tell her how to handle it, but negating his (possibly extreme) feelings on the matter is unfair.

The idea of bringing up a baby when you are absolutely not ready to, is one of the most terrifying in the world. As many women who have had abortions, and felt nothing but immense relief afterwards, will testify.

wineoclockthanks · 04/04/2015 08:55

there is a world of difference between a man saying he doesn't want to be a father - (he has just as much right as the woman to express his opinion) BUT he does not have the right to walk away from his responsibility.

ApocalypseThen · 04/04/2015 09:00

Why does this young man get such criticism because he doesn't want to be a father.

I don't think that's what people are criticizing - I think people are criticizing the girl's mother (the OP) for privileging his wishes above her daughters and expressing frustration at the expectation that she should terminate against her will because of his wishes.

Original poster
wemadeit25 · 04/04/2015 09:03

Apocalypsethen,
You have clearly not read all these posts and until you have shut up as your post makes no sense at all. I am not putting anyone before my daughter and never would.

OP posts:
PtolemysNeedle · 04/04/2015 09:06

I agree that it's fine for the man in this situation to say that he doesn't want a baby. If it would be ok for a woman to have an abortion, which it is, then it's got to be ok for the man to decide he doesn't want to be a parent as well.

I don't understand OP how you can say you would terminate in this situation, but that you're angry with the boyfriend for thinking pretty much the same thing.

Foolishlady · 04/04/2015 09:10

I think you did well OP, all I would add is the suggestion of independent counselling asap - I agree the earlier the better. I had an abortion at 20 - struggled with guilt afterwards due to being previously anti-abortion after a catholic, being shown pro-life videos in school, upbringing, but never regret. Now I've left the Catholic guilt long behind I'm just so glad I did it. It was all my own decision though so I had noone else to blame however I felt which was good I think! Also wouldn't be too hard on the boy, it's not unreasonable to not want to be a father at 21.